One of the shooters on the MIT team had his Morini die during the prep period for a practice match on Saturday. He dry fired it a few times, and then it stopped clicking. I changed out the batteries, and that didn't help. I swapped in a spare circuit board and he was off & running.
I haven't tried it in my own Morini to double check, but all indications are that the circuit board is kaput.
Has anyone seen this before? Are the boards repairable, or do we just have to buy a new board? I suppose I could get one of the EE students to take it on as a project, but they are potted, and without a schematic, it may be more trouble than it's worth.
Dead Morini Air Pistol Electronics?
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Hard to tell. We've picked up some of our Morinis used as deals have come up. I don' think it's ancient, but I wouldn't be surprised if it was at least 5 or 10 yeas old. I know we haven't bought any new ones in at least the four years I've been helping coach.
A quick search of the archives came up empty, so it apparently isn't a common problem.
I haven't had time to research this further, but to test the board, you'd need to figure out the external connections. There are four tabs on one side of the board (not sure about the back side), and I suspect two are for the trigger switch, and two go to the firing solenoid. It's easy enough to replace the function of the switch, but coming up with a good dummy load for the solenoid is a bit trickier. A big resistor is probably safe. If it presents a higher impedance than the real solenoid, it just means it will discharge the cap slower.
A quick search of the archives came up empty, so it apparently isn't a common problem.
I haven't had time to research this further, but to test the board, you'd need to figure out the external connections. There are four tabs on one side of the board (not sure about the back side), and I suspect two are for the trigger switch, and two go to the firing solenoid. It's easy enough to replace the function of the switch, but coming up with a good dummy load for the solenoid is a bit trickier. A big resistor is probably safe. If it presents a higher impedance than the real solenoid, it just means it will discharge the cap slower.
Hi
Here in India in last 3-4 months I have seen 7-8 morini air pistols with various problems starting from dead pistols, pistol firing with a delay of about 2-3 sec to pistol firing (clicking) 2 to 7 times each time trigger is pulled.
We dont touch the circuit just change it as we dont have any idea what is in there. Changing circuits in not cheap.
And the pistols are from 5 years to a few months old. So age is not the only factor.
Here in India in last 3-4 months I have seen 7-8 morini air pistols with various problems starting from dead pistols, pistol firing with a delay of about 2-3 sec to pistol firing (clicking) 2 to 7 times each time trigger is pulled.
We dont touch the circuit just change it as we dont have any idea what is in there. Changing circuits in not cheap.
And the pistols are from 5 years to a few months old. So age is not the only factor.
Sometimes an easy fix
I have seen many fail, our electronics tech has been able to repair all but one of them. Should be an easy fix.
I took a closer look at the dead one, and it's coated on both sides in thick, opaque, red epoxy. Even if I had a schematic & knew what was wrong, it will take some delicate surgery to change any parts on this board.
I had time to install the "defective" board in my own Morini this evening, and it worked just fine...
I don't know if the board is intermittent, or if there is some subtle difference between the two pistols that this board doesn't like. All I can do at this point is set it aside with a note and hope that it plays nice if we ever need it again.
I had time to install the "defective" board in my own Morini this evening, and it worked just fine...
I don't know if the board is intermittent, or if there is some subtle difference between the two pistols that this board doesn't like. All I can do at this point is set it aside with a note and hope that it plays nice if we ever need it again.
As Fabian mentioned on a previous post we have been able to bring to life several modules in the past years. A simple troubleshooting routine to pinpoint were the problems is originating is as follows:
1. Remove Printed circuit Assembly (module) from gun and flip the switch to on position:
a: LED Blinks: Module is good and problem could be due to fault batteries, connector at the trigger module or improperly adjusted micro switch at the trigger module.
Easy Fix: Clean battery terminal thoroughly and check the inner contacts of the green connector at the trigger module. If gap between contact row is too wide the module can be inserted and removed with low resistance use a toothpick or dental pin to bring these contact closer. While at this clean the contacts with an alcohol swap or contact cleaner. Even tough the connections is gold to gold corrosion can occur due to flux and other residues.
b: LED Stays On: Module is assuming it is still connected to the trigger module when is not. There are many reasons for this state: 1. Jumper connectors at the bottom are missing or misplaced. 2. Contamination in the module due to Battery leakage (Most Common) 3. Logic circuit malfunction.
If battery leakage occurred it will be required clean the whole module with a solution of water + Borax (1 tsp x 9 oz water). Even with the epoxy coating, the battery fluid will sip through the open spaces between the battery contact and other PCB features close to the battery area. Submerge the module and leave it soak for several hours, then remove module and excess water with a lint free towel and place the module in a low steady heat source for at least 12 hrs to dry completely. Cable, and Satellite TV receivers are an excellent source of low steady heat, this is what I do normally use for this task. After install new batteries and retest.
Regarding to the jumper connectors, these can come loose when module is mishandled or when the bottom of the grip is rammed against the firing table when shooting a 7 or worse during a match. The jumper connectors can be found at any computer stores since these are the same used on PC Hard disk drives.
reading the last post seems like the problem is related to the connection between the PCA module and the trigger module (Green Connectors) the contacts of the connector tends relax over time resulting in low contact force resulting in corrosion, high resistance and hence trigger malfunction. Remove the grip and check the connector inner contacts.
Hope this help.
1. Remove Printed circuit Assembly (module) from gun and flip the switch to on position:
a: LED Blinks: Module is good and problem could be due to fault batteries, connector at the trigger module or improperly adjusted micro switch at the trigger module.
Easy Fix: Clean battery terminal thoroughly and check the inner contacts of the green connector at the trigger module. If gap between contact row is too wide the module can be inserted and removed with low resistance use a toothpick or dental pin to bring these contact closer. While at this clean the contacts with an alcohol swap or contact cleaner. Even tough the connections is gold to gold corrosion can occur due to flux and other residues.
b: LED Stays On: Module is assuming it is still connected to the trigger module when is not. There are many reasons for this state: 1. Jumper connectors at the bottom are missing or misplaced. 2. Contamination in the module due to Battery leakage (Most Common) 3. Logic circuit malfunction.
If battery leakage occurred it will be required clean the whole module with a solution of water + Borax (1 tsp x 9 oz water). Even with the epoxy coating, the battery fluid will sip through the open spaces between the battery contact and other PCB features close to the battery area. Submerge the module and leave it soak for several hours, then remove module and excess water with a lint free towel and place the module in a low steady heat source for at least 12 hrs to dry completely. Cable, and Satellite TV receivers are an excellent source of low steady heat, this is what I do normally use for this task. After install new batteries and retest.
Regarding to the jumper connectors, these can come loose when module is mishandled or when the bottom of the grip is rammed against the firing table when shooting a 7 or worse during a match. The jumper connectors can be found at any computer stores since these are the same used on PC Hard disk drives.
reading the last post seems like the problem is related to the connection between the PCA module and the trigger module (Green Connectors) the contacts of the connector tends relax over time resulting in low contact force resulting in corrosion, high resistance and hence trigger malfunction. Remove the grip and check the connector inner contacts.
Hope this help.
Best info I have ever seen about how to potentially save a module. Thanks!cerami wrote:As Fabian mentioned on a previous post we have been able to bring to life several modules in the past years. A simple troubleshooting routine to pinpoint were the problems is originating is as follows:
1. Remove Printed circuit Assembly (module) from gun and flip the switch to on position:
a: LED Blinks: Module is good and problem could be due to fault batteries, connector at the trigger module or improperly adjusted micro switch at the trigger module.
Easy Fix: Clean battery terminal thoroughly and check the inner contacts of the green connector at the trigger module. If gap between contact row is too wide the module can be inserted and removed with low resistance use a toothpick or dental pin to bring these contact closer. While at this clean the contacts with an alcohol swap or contact cleaner. Even tough the connections is gold to gold corrosion can occur due to flux and other residues.
b: LED Stays On: Module is assuming it is still connected to the trigger module when is not. There are many reasons for this state: 1. Jumper connectors at the bottom are missing or misplaced. 2. Contamination in the module due to Battery leakage (Most Common) 3. Logic circuit malfunction.
If battery leakage occurred it will be required clean the whole module with a solution of water + Borax (1 tsp x 9 oz water). Even with the epoxy coating, the battery fluid will sip through the open spaces between the battery contact and other PCB features close to the battery area. Submerge the module and leave it soak for several hours, then remove module and excess water with a lint free towel and place the module in a low steady heat source for at least 12 hrs to dry completely. Cable, and Satellite TV receivers are an excellent source of low steady heat, this is what I do normally use for this task. After install new batteries and retest.
Regarding to the jumper connectors, these can come loose when module is mishandled or when the bottom of the grip is rammed against the firing table when shooting a 7 or worse during a match. The jumper connectors can be found at any computer stores since these are the same used on PC Hard disk drives.
reading the last post seems like the problem is related to the connection between the PCA module and the trigger module (Green Connectors) the contacts of the connector tends relax over time resulting in low contact force resulting in corrosion, high resistance and hence trigger malfunction. Remove the grip and check the connector inner contacts.
Hope this help.
Stan
Thanks for all the advice, and the great photo. I was actually thinking of taking one in to work where they have an X-ray setup, but you saved me the trouble. I'll have to study it carefully. So far all I can tell is that it looks like they are using a transformer for the boost converter to charge the main cap.
Any good tricks for dealing with the red potting compound? I've had some luck in the past with a hot knife, but that was a long time ago. This stuff seems pretty sturdy.
Any good tricks for dealing with the red potting compound? I've had some luck in the past with a hot knife, but that was a long time ago. This stuff seems pretty sturdy.
Hey Gwhite,
I used to shoot on the MIT range when I did my masters there. We've never actually met on the range but one time you answered my question regarding shipping my air pistol to the UK and airline regulations wrt locks.
Anyhow, I also shoot a Morini 162E. Over the past 9 months I have been having a lot of recurring problems with my trigger. The symptoms are exactly as you described: the trigger would just suddenly stop working. You flick the switch on, the light blinks every 4 seconds but you get no trigger pressure at all and it doesn't go 'click'. I spoke with a good friend who works for Gehmann about this (they do all the maintenance work for Morini here in Germany). We first suspected a moisture problem -- I live in Aachen, Germany, known to be quite humid. I took apart the gun, blow-dried the circuit and trigger unit and stuffed a whole bunch of silica packets in the gun case. Then the problem was gone. And the trigger behaved itself for a few months until just a few weeks ago when it stopped working again! I tried the abovementioned tricks but they didn't work this time. Then a few days later, the trigger came back to live again. It's like it's got a mind of its own! My friend from Gehmann believes that it may be a contact problem which I completely agree.
Also spoke with a Belgian shooter this weekend who visited our range. He also had the same problem a couple of times. Apparently in his case the circuit unit tends to slip out and lose contact with the 'green cube connector'. So when you insert it, you have to give it a good push. Also, he mentioned that when you move the trigger position too far forward or back, you may also get the same problem. I have no experienced this myself but I did notice if I decrease the first stage travel by too much, the trigger problem emerges.
And then someone else at my range told me that he knows some Dutch shooters who have 4 or 5 trigger units as back-ups... So this problem seems to be quite universal. I will send my gun down to Gehmann for a check-up and see what they say.
Best,
Beckett
I used to shoot on the MIT range when I did my masters there. We've never actually met on the range but one time you answered my question regarding shipping my air pistol to the UK and airline regulations wrt locks.
Anyhow, I also shoot a Morini 162E. Over the past 9 months I have been having a lot of recurring problems with my trigger. The symptoms are exactly as you described: the trigger would just suddenly stop working. You flick the switch on, the light blinks every 4 seconds but you get no trigger pressure at all and it doesn't go 'click'. I spoke with a good friend who works for Gehmann about this (they do all the maintenance work for Morini here in Germany). We first suspected a moisture problem -- I live in Aachen, Germany, known to be quite humid. I took apart the gun, blow-dried the circuit and trigger unit and stuffed a whole bunch of silica packets in the gun case. Then the problem was gone. And the trigger behaved itself for a few months until just a few weeks ago when it stopped working again! I tried the abovementioned tricks but they didn't work this time. Then a few days later, the trigger came back to live again. It's like it's got a mind of its own! My friend from Gehmann believes that it may be a contact problem which I completely agree.
Also spoke with a Belgian shooter this weekend who visited our range. He also had the same problem a couple of times. Apparently in his case the circuit unit tends to slip out and lose contact with the 'green cube connector'. So when you insert it, you have to give it a good push. Also, he mentioned that when you move the trigger position too far forward or back, you may also get the same problem. I have no experienced this myself but I did notice if I decrease the first stage travel by too much, the trigger problem emerges.
And then someone else at my range told me that he knows some Dutch shooters who have 4 or 5 trigger units as back-ups... So this problem seems to be quite universal. I will send my gun down to Gehmann for a check-up and see what they say.
Best,
Beckett
Check the micro switch on top of the trigger module and make sure is in pushed position when trigger is at rest. Switch should move to the extended position only when the trigger is pulled. I have seen this type of failure before and typical cause for this are either 2nd stage spring fatigue or trigger travel improperly adjusted. You should hear a click sound when the trigger is pulled meaning that the micro switch has extended to a normally open position hence indicating the module to send the Juice! to the solenoid. Hope this bring more light.
Re: Dead Morini Air Pistol Electronics?
Hello all,
I have two electronic modules that have failed. Both were giving the multiple fast blinks and then nothing.
I tried new, fully charged batteries with no success. One of the modules had residue from battery leakage, and I was going to follow cerami's instructions for immersing both modules and seeing if that would fix either of them. Instead, I decided to simply clean the contacts on both modules with the Borax solution and see what happened. One showed no change (still fast blinking), but the other now gives normal indications - the usual start up light with blinks every 4 seconds. Unfortunately, the pistol will not fire with the module that appears to be working OK.
A possible problem now is I have already made radical changes to the first and second stage weights. And, I should point out that I had been using this pistol with a single stage set up.
Before I look into adjusting the micro switch on the trigger module, using the instructions in Pilkington's TenP files, I would like to make sure that the current 1st and 2nd stage weight settings are not causing a problem. I understand that there must be some weight on the 2nd stage and that there must be some movement on the first stage. Is that correct?
Also, if I want to start the set up of both stages, where should they be set in order to begin this process? Is there a position for both stages where the electronics will be "happy" with them and cause the pistol to either dry fire or fire?
If there is a suggested starting position for each stage, I would like to begin there. And, if that doesn't work, then move on to the micro switch.
Any advice would be much appreciated.
Stan
I have two electronic modules that have failed. Both were giving the multiple fast blinks and then nothing.
I tried new, fully charged batteries with no success. One of the modules had residue from battery leakage, and I was going to follow cerami's instructions for immersing both modules and seeing if that would fix either of them. Instead, I decided to simply clean the contacts on both modules with the Borax solution and see what happened. One showed no change (still fast blinking), but the other now gives normal indications - the usual start up light with blinks every 4 seconds. Unfortunately, the pistol will not fire with the module that appears to be working OK.
A possible problem now is I have already made radical changes to the first and second stage weights. And, I should point out that I had been using this pistol with a single stage set up.
Before I look into adjusting the micro switch on the trigger module, using the instructions in Pilkington's TenP files, I would like to make sure that the current 1st and 2nd stage weight settings are not causing a problem. I understand that there must be some weight on the 2nd stage and that there must be some movement on the first stage. Is that correct?
Also, if I want to start the set up of both stages, where should they be set in order to begin this process? Is there a position for both stages where the electronics will be "happy" with them and cause the pistol to either dry fire or fire?
If there is a suggested starting position for each stage, I would like to begin there. And, if that doesn't work, then move on to the micro switch.
Any advice would be much appreciated.
Stan
Re: Dead Morini Air Pistol Electronics?
I can't help on the specific issue, but I came across this FB page: https://www.facebook.com/Morini.circuit
I would definitely ask there about the cost of a repair.
I would definitely ask there about the cost of a repair.
Re: Dead Morini Air Pistol Electronics?
Reading the names on the envelopes I suspect I am not the first one stumbling on that page :-)
Re: Dead Morini Air Pistol Electronics?
Hello-IPshooter wrote: ↑Sun May 12, 2019 10:12 pm Hello all,
I have two electronic modules that have failed. Both were giving the multiple fast blinks and then nothing.
I tried new, fully charged batteries with no success. One of the modules had residue from battery leakage, and I was going to follow cerami's instructions for immersing both modules and seeing if that would fix either of them. Instead, I decided to simply clean the contacts on both modules with the Borax solution and see what happened. One showed no change (still fast blinking), but the other now gives normal indications - the usual start up light with blinks every 4 seconds. Unfortunately, the pistol will not fire with the module that appears to be working OK.
A possible problem now is I have already made radical changes to the first and second stage weights. And, I should point out that I had been using this pistol with a single stage set up.
Before I look into adjusting the micro switch on the trigger module, using the instructions in Pilkington's TenP files, I would like to make sure that the current 1st and 2nd stage weight settings are not causing a problem. I understand that there must be some weight on the 2nd stage and that there must be some movement on the first stage. Is that correct?
Also, if I want to start the set up of both stages, where should they be set in order to begin this process? Is there a position for both stages where the electronics will be "happy" with them and cause the pistol to either dry fire or fire?
If there is a suggested starting position for each stage, I would like to begin there. And, if that doesn't work, then move on to the micro switch.
Any advice would be much appreciated.
Stan
We have encountered this, before, on one competitors pistol. Too much engagement of the first stage caused the electronics to act up. Turn the first stage adjustment screw anti-clockwise until the electronics start working again. Alternatively, too little weight on the first stage and the electronics will flash weirdly as well.
Also, if either of the springs appear stretched out of shape, they should be replaced. This is an inexpensive and easy fix. Our host generally has them in stock. New springs, with almost no tension on them, is a good starting point for setting up the trigger.
Best regards,
m1963
Last edited by m1963 on Tue May 14, 2019 5:40 am, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Dead Morini Air Pistol Electronics?
Sounds like a reason not to buy(shoot) Morini ? I suppose the newer 200EL has not been out long enough to see if it is more reliable.
Re: Dead Morini Air Pistol Electronics?
Naahh. But I note, that with four generations of electronics repair, he says the new Morini is impossible to repair.
Last edited by Rover on Wed May 15, 2019 7:28 am, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Dead Morini Air Pistol Electronics?
No you're not. have a look at the mailing label in the first photo on the FB page.
Even our host, Scott Pilkington, sends Morini and Steyr electronics there for repair.