TargetTalk

New to long arms.

I had been using my partner's Hämmerli AR20 air rifle as a tool for training my posture. It is ambidextrous, very light at 4kg. I shoot left handed even though I shoot right handed for short arms. I manage to hold it in standing position, good posture, and shoot OK. Miss the target, but did not miss the target paper. Generally scoring 1 2 or a 3. No problem holding it for a fair period of time. I do mostly dry firing or just holding it in standing position. I actually seldom do the shooting.

I am now doing training on a very old FWB, weighs around 6.5kg. I find it very hard to hold it in place and maintain good posture. I am not sure exactly where I should put my right hand on the fore end; also there is an option which I can put on the weight and use it as a hand stop. Unlike the AR20 which my right hand can be on the fore-end anywhere without much problem, the old FWB I have to be on a specific location to put my right hand. Too close to the trigger I literally cannot support the rifle, but too far towards the front then both arms have to share the weight, and I do not want to burden my trigger finger arm.

The only thing I can do right now is to use a mirror on the side, put the long arm on the off hand stand, and then pull it off and practice holding it standing and checking my posture, while aiming a target. I am neither able to hold the rifle for more than a few minutes, nor hold still enough to aim after the initial 15 seconds. After a minute or so, I have to put the rifle back on the off hand stand, it feels very heavy to me. I have no problem on the 4kg Hämmerli.

I would like to know is there any exercise or procedure to make me stronger to hold the rifle. Also is there a standard way of holding the fore-end. I saw some shooters literally put their non shooting hand right next to the trigger and form a fist to support the rifle, but I don't know if it works for me at all.

Advice will be much appreciated.

Never mind, it looks like using a different way of holding the fore-end totally has solved the problem..

Hi Conradin,

first, an older FWB air rifle with 6.5kg is not normal. All these rifles came out of the shop with a weight below 5.0kg, because this was the old weight limit for air rifles in competition. Now this limit is 5.5kg. So someone has put there much additional weight in the stock or system.

If it comes to weights the position of the (additional) weights make always a big difference. If all the weight is put near the center of gravity, you wont have any big advantage. On the other hand to much weight only at the front of the barrel can also make shooting more difficult. Weight there make the muzzle more slower, but is there movement, it is also more difficult to stop. So you need the right balance, as ever. ;-)

A rule of thump says, the point of gravity has to be straight on your forehand or better sightly before that point. One interesting point is, if the point of gravity is over this point more in front, this will give you in the standing position more spreading of the shoots in the horizontal, not as probably assumed in the vertical. The theory behind this is complex.

Besides this i have now real clue about your standing position. Our different native languages may play here also a role but it is general not easy to give someone some hints without seeing his position in realty. Good coating needs always direct feedback so the trainer or coach has to be direct on the shooting range.

There is one sometimes slightly working workaround. You can put some good pictures which show your standing position here on the board so we might give you some tips or tell you about possible problems.

At least on note. There was never a rifle which fits all shooters. We are all so different and this doesn't only mean first look things like body length or weight and this is the reason why the newer match rifles have so much setting possibilities. On the other hand this makes the start for a beginner not easier. If you have longer arms you need also a longer stock. If the ratio of your underarm and your upper arm and the position of your hip is not perfect, you will always have trouble to find a good place on the hip for your forehand. A good shooting jacked can help at this point.

Do you know the famous target shooting book "Ways of the rifle". It will not substitute a good coach but can give you many good hints about rifle shooting not only in the standing position.


Regards from the home of shooting ;-)

Frank

Thank you for the suggestion. I found out that instead of holding the fore-end by using my palm facing up, I form a fist pointing back towards me and then use the middle and ring finger as a rest with the index and small finger squeezing between the fore-end. Suddenly it is another set of muscle doing the work and I no longer have any weight lifting problem.

The long arm is front heavy. But I find out that if I put my non shooting hand right up against the trigger guard, I can hold the rifle very stable. But if that is the case, I am essentially lifting the chamber, not the fore-end (there is a small gap of around 2 to 3 inches lower-rail between them ); if I move the fore-end back and put it right net to the trigger guard, I find out that while it is more comfortable to rest the rifle on my fist (it is made of wood), the rifle feels heavier. I am less stable, in fact I have to move my fist forward.

If I choose to move the fore-end towards the front, and leave out some empty space so that my fist is in direct contact with the lower-rail for the fore-end while the middle and ring finger is touching the trigger guard, all I need to do is to wear a pair of shooting gloves and the problem of being uncomfortable rubbing against the metal rail is gone.

The interesting fact now is, it does not seem to have anything to do with center of gravity.

FrankD wrote:
first, an older FWB air rifle with 6.5kg is not normal. All these rifles came out of the shop with a weight below 5.0kg, because this was the old weight limit for air rifles in competition.
Frank

Sorry I forgot to mention, it is not an AR, that is why it is around 6kg.

You use a FWB Super Match for air rifle training? The Model 2000?

Now it seams to me i understand some of your trouble with building the right standing position. Have you the necessary hand support for the standing position?

Do you use the hook of your butt plate? Al this makes the first steps for building a good standing position more difficult. If you do the adjustment of the rifle not correct, the the rifle will force you in a bad position. I'm sure you need some help from a good coach or an experienced shooter direct on your range.


Regards

Frank