TargetTalk

Having problems @ 50 yds with my .45. I shoot high 80s to low 90s with my S&W mdl 41 at 50 yds. Shooting low to mid 90s with both .22 & .45 at the short line. My 50 yd scores with the .45 are generally low to mid 80s at best. Most shots are scattered and low and I'm not calling them out. I've used dummy rounds loaded by a friend and I see no downward jerk when the shot breaks with a dummy round.

Any ideas about how to identify what I'm doing wrong and how to correct?

Thanks,

Dennis

It could be your gun or your ammo. It could just mean that on your bad shots, you are holding the gun up too long, and your wrist is getting droopy and or your hold is deteriorating when the gun finally goes off. Sometimes knowing your score isn't very helpful. Can you call your good shots?
Are you shooting with irons or a dot?

When you can shoot in the 90's with a 22 but not with a 45, it is usually a sign of a triggering error. Are you using anatomical grips on both guns?

I'm shooting 185 gr cast lead semi-wadcutters using an Ultra-Dot on both guns. The .45 groups inside the 10 ring off sandbags at 50 yards. I'm shooting anatomical grips on the .22 but the .45 has stock grips.

I can ALMOST always call shots out with the .22, but not nearly so often with the.45. I also suspect triggering mistakes, but I can't figure out exactly what's going on. When my buddy loads dummy rounds and I don't know when the dummy is coming up, I haven't seen any obvious flinch. I used to use an interrupted trigger pull, but all of the reading I've seen lately indicates that is not good technique, so I'm trying to change to a steady progressive squeeze.

Any suggestions on how to diagnose this will be greatly appreciated.

Many thanks,

Dennis

well, unfortunately, a flinch, is only one possible issue, and usually a flinch carries shots high, not down.
The 45 should have a 3.5 pound trigger, and a triggering error exposes itself on a heavier triggered gun.
Have someone time you and see if there is a difference between how long you are holding the 22 up until it goes bang, and how long you hold the 45 up. Sometimes when I shoot too much on a light triggered gun, I have to retrain myself to get as agressive as I need to be with the 45.
Experiment a lot with dry fire, and move the position of your trigger finger on the trigger, until you can execute a quick smooth pull without moving the dot. You may need more trigger finger on the 45 to get good results. I also think it would be wise to standardize your grips between your 45 and your 22. Either go all anatomical or all straight. It will eliminate one variable between the two guns, and let you more easily find your issues.

One of the biggest reasons for scattered shots is grip and trigger consistency, grip to tight with your lower fingers shots go low too much thumb shots go right, to little they go left, getting everything the same every time is the key. Anatomical grips can help to correct this for some people but whatever grip you use if you can grip it the same each shot and get your zero set to that you will shoot higher scores.

Thanks to everyone for their advice and counsel. I will be doing more dry firing exercises and working on my grip and trigger control as well. I hope I will be able to report some satisfactory progress soon.

Dennis

have you double checked your overtravel on the .45?

I have seen significant differences in offhand groups when the overtravel gets out of adjustment. Depending on how a 1911 trigger group is setup the overtravel adjustment can make huge differences in trigger feel and how the gun shoots offhand, as compared to shooting off a rest. I use no overtravel on 1911's, but have shot with significant overtravel on a Pardini and didn't notice a group difference.

just a thought from my experience....

dulcmr-man wrote:. . . . I used to use an interrupted trigger pull, but all of the reading I've seen lately indicates that is not good technique, so I'm trying to change to a steady progressive squeeze.

Any suggestions on how to diagnose this will be greatly appreciated.

Many thanks,

Dennis

Have your slow fire scores dropped after your triggering technique change or are they the same as before the change?

I was shooting 800 - 820 and then took a year off to run matches instead of shooting in them. When I resumed shooting I had also changed to a red dot scope instead of iron sights. Scores haven't been the same since.

I haven't checked over travel but I will do so right away. I generally adjust that so that there is little or no overtravel after the hammer drops.

Use caution in adjusting the over travel there is a right way and a wrong way.

Your little pinkie, does it grip the 45? It should be just resting on a standard 45 grip. The 3rd and 4th fingers are the main gripping fingers. If the pinkie is involved in the grip, since it sits lowest to the axis of the bore, inconsistant pinkie pressure will throw shots low. The third and fourth fingers are closer to the axis of the bore, and are less prone to affect shot height. Hope this helps
Chris

Dulcmr-Man,
My scores are similar to yours and I have anatomical grips on my 22 and slab grips on my 45. I recently made two "discoveries" that may be of interest to you.

1. I think I've been using the wrong grip technique...wasn't getting the center of the 1911 frontstrap centered under the finger joints. As a result, when I tightened/loosened my grip (deliberately or without realizing), my sight alignment would change. Tightening would pull the front sight post low and left. If you haven't already, would try some exercises where you tighten/loosen your grip while watching your sight alignment. If tightening/loosening disturbs your sight picture, may want to diagnose your grip.

2. I also recently realized I wasn't focusing enough on the subtleties of sight alignment w/ open sights on 1911. Have tried to correct by reducing wrist movement and moving arm/gun/head to where they need to be after my wrist is as locked as possible. Have also tried to re-double
my efforts to focus on front sight blade and let the rear sight and target blur a little. Realized that, esp when feeling the TF and RF time crunch or fatigued, I had a tendency to break the shot when the sights were mis-aligned in a way that would make the shot print low and left.

So far, have seen some improvement. Not setting the Bullseye world on fire but offer up my own self-critique in the hope it helps you.