TargetTalk

Hi,

After a +20 years hiatus I started air pistol shooting again so I bought a new Steyr LP10E to replace my old air pistol (Feinwerkbau Mod 65).
I really like this pistol and the electronic trigger but I believe it recoils a little too much.
When a shot is perfect then the recoil is non existent but this is the case with most air pistols even my FWB mod.65
The problem is when my technique is less than perfect then I get recoil (sometimes a lot and some other times a little less). This usually results in an less than perfect 9 or even an 8.
I was under the impression than the stabilizer together with the muzzle vents made this pistol recoil less in all occasions.
I checked the stabilizer according to Steyr's video and it seems to be correctly adjusted.
Is there something wrong with my pistol or am I expecting too much from all these gizmos (stabilizer, vents etc.)

Thanks.

Dunno hów the stabilizer works, but maybe its dirty and doesnt work fluently?
Otherwise, I can imagine that, when you, for instance líft the pistol during the shot, the recoil is exagerrated. I have this sometimes, with my Tau 7.

Actually Taz, you are giving the answer in your statement "When a shot is perfect then the recoil is non existent". The LP10 is recoil less. My impression is that your pressure on the grip is different from shot to shot.
Just my opinion. Enjoy your shooting.
Guy

I think gn303 is on to something. I don't see how an airgun's recoil could change from shot to shot .....seems highly improbable.

I would guess what you are sensing when you fire an imperfect shot is actually equally imperfect technique. Perhaps improper sight alignment and/or snatching the trigger is causing the gun to move and creating the illusion of recoil.

The good news is that your ability to sense something wrong with a delivered shot suggests you are watching the sights thru the shot release which is excellent. Now you have to develop this awareness (and act on it) BEFORE you release the shot.

Good luck Taz

orionshooter wrote:I don't see how an airgun's recoil could change from shot to shot .....seems highly improbable.

Unfortunately it's highly possible if the Steyr's recoil absorber isn't working correctly/consistently.

If that's been checked and is working correctly however, it does sound like operator error.

One other thing I would check before shelving the "broken gun" theory completely is the velocity (speed and consistency).

Good....no.....excellent point David!

Guys, I thank you for your comments and suggestions but I believe for some reason I did not make myself clear.

I already wrote that a properly executed shot will result in a recoil-less action of the pistol. Even my spring pistol will not recoil if the shot is perfectly executed.
My question is:
When the shooter does not execute a perfect shot (as you said operator error), will all the bells and whistles of the LP10E still provide a recoil-less action?

taz wrote:Guys, I thank you for your comments and suggestions but I believe for some reason I did not make myself clear.

I already wrote that a properly executed shot will result in a recoil-less action of the pistol. Even my spring pistol will not recoil if the shot is perfectly executed.
My question is:
When the shooter does not execute a perfect shot (as you said operator error), will all the bells and whistles of the LP10E still provide a recoil-less action?

To answer on the last question: no, it will not. The sights will still "jump" on bad shot occasion, because it was not the pistol that makes them but either bad griping or triggering.

Understood.
Yet, why does this never happen when dry firing?

I think i know what you are asking. Lp10 is recoilless stright from factory. So if you just held it and kept shooting, it wont recoil. I think i would as mentioned clear the vents and stabiliser, there might be blockage. Also as mentioned if the velocity is higher than standard, it could recoil.

I'm not familiar with the adjustments of the Steyr, but I find that turning down the speed of the pellet from my Pardini K10 (a simple bolt hidden by the grip, turned with a small coin) helped a lot with apparent recoil. As you say, when my execution is perfect I score a 10 and there is no muzzle flip. But if I am second-guessing myself, holding too long, or in any other way less than solid in my technique, the tendency at anything above about 470fps is to flip upwards 1 or 2 rings. This is likely because my grip softens slightly when my confidence fades. Any speed fast enough to cleanly cut the target should be sufficient, though it could be that a given pellet/pistol/velocity relationship is something you will have to find by trial and error.

Thanks.
Yes it seems the most probable cause is too much speed.
I will have to find someone with a chronograph and check if the pistol conforms to Steyr's suggested velocity and adjust if necessary. I suppose that Steyr uses lightweight pistol pellets and not rifle pellets when measuring speed, is that correct? I use H&N Finale Match pistol pellets.

The stabilizer seems to work ok when checked as per Steyr's instructions in this video

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LEe2LS9lll0

No vent holes or compensator holes are blocked and the pistol is brand new and is otherwise marvelous.

[quote="taz"] Even my spring pistol will not recoil if the shot is perfectly executed.
quote]

Are you relying on your 20 year ago memories when saying this? I think that it you fired your spring gun then your LP10 one after another you will realise that even if the steyr's absorber is is completely stuck and not working the Steyr will still feel more recoiless that the FWB 65.

It ain't recoil from that gun----IT'S YOU-----"Doc"

Bob-Riegl wrote:It ain't recoil from that gun----IT'S YOU-----"Doc"

I tend to agree. Since the recoil happens after the shot, I consider it a "symptom" of a mistake rather than a cause.
I know when any of my guns dont recoil straight back it is because of a triggering error. Triggering errors are very hard to detect with the light crisp trigger that most air pistols have.

I think Bob & Isabell have it right.

Try a firmer grip.

If you fire this unit with the fingertips of your free hand forming a "vee" for the tank to rest on, and with the shooting hand, you squeeze the trigger in such a way the rear part is just resting on your thumb, every shot will produce a "nudge" no matter how perfect the squeeze is. In other words, on the assumption that the stabilizer is set and working properly, I think the variation of the felt recoil is a clear indication of human error. As I have always believed, the human is the variable and the gun is the constant. So when you grip the gun and experience such variance, then there is inconsistency maybe with the speed and or pressure of the trigger squeeze, or breaking of the wrist. I often experience this sensation as though this very light nudge triggers a nerve that my hand "jerks" each time my LP10 fires as though I was firing a standard pistol.

No matter how much barrel weights our local champion of over 15 years (scores in the mid 570's then, on any day), he puts on, he would always shoot with a visible rise of the front sight. What I notice though is that the muzzle rise after each shot is very very consistent.

My two cents worth.

Maybe you do this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HYXF-XFa ... el&list=UL

Instead of this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GuYjAC6R ... el&list=UL

Two very simple but good videos.

For some reason some do not understand me and keep saying that I must be doing something wrong when the pistol recoils. I already know this and have stated it from my first post.

Yesterday I tried another shooter's LP10. The feeling was similar to mine.
It seems I was expecting too much from all the features of the LP10 and was under the impression that even when the shooter (in this case me) made a mistake the pistol would still fire without any recoil and it seems this is not the case.