TargetTalk

Paging Professor Steve Swartz, Oh perfesser, where isist thouist?
Steve,
In a effort to strengthen my shooting arm and trigger finger, I've been using my Pardini Standard pistol to shoot 50 meters along with my Morini free pistol. I've noticed that I shoot better with the standard pistol. The sights don't wobble as much and the pattern of shots is much tighter, even with the greater weight of the trigger pull. As I have a back-up Morini free pistol, I was considering cutting the barrel of the free pistol down to 6 inches or so and see if that makes is as steady as the standard pistol. What are you thoughts on the matter?
Elliott Dushkin

Elliott,
I think you will find the longer sight radius an asset. How do you define shooting better with the standard pistol? What are your scores?

It could be that you are focusing better on the front sight due to the distance from your eye or that your trigger control is better because the apparent movement is less.
Ben

Ben,
The standard pistol sight picture and the free pistol sight picture are virtually the same as far as clarity of focus, size of blade sight and size of rear notch. It just seems to me the standard pistol's sights don't wobble as much, ie., the wobble zone is smaller. The scores are similar with the two different pistols, but I've been shooting the free pistol for 5 years and the standard pistol only about a month.
Elliott

I have a short barrel CM84E. The previous owner had the barrel cut back to reduce weight and had a long Morini compensator installed to maintain sight radius. The pistol now weighs 1130 gm with large Rink Grips and the sight radius is 360mm. Original specs are 1240 gm and 426 mm (max). I love the balance of this gun, though I have not yet shot it in competition so don't know whether it will help my score.

I think the Pardini SP weighs about 1100gm, so the effect you are experiencing may be due to weight and balance. While you can't easily reduce the weight of the CM84E, you can can change the balance and see what happens.

If you're looking at doing some work anyway, perhaps you should just move the front sight back and see what it is like before you try cutting off some of the barrel. That way, you can "try" the shorter sight radius and still be able to go back.

Take Care,
Ed Hall
Air Force Shooting Homepage
Bullseye (and International) Competition Things

VERY sensible suggestion Ed.

Back in the 80's the great gunsmith Don Nygord had put an approx. 2inch Douglas premium 22cal barrel on a Pardini free pistol, he also worked the trigger mechanism, it was the model with the small cocking lever, as I remember it was approximatly 6 or 7 inches long and sure didn't enhance the wobble over 50 metres, it was a great free pistol with with a shorter sight radius. As an aside does anyone know of a gallery of Don Nygord's various gunsmithing efforts.

Can anyone recommend a gunsmith who could do a proper job of cutting and crowning the barrel on a Free Pistol?

Elliott,

1. if you shoot for fun,
I agree with you.

2. If you shoot to perform well in competitions,
I don't think you do the correct thing. pls check how good shooters do before you do the chenge.
I think longer barrels gives you good results specialy when you shoot 60.
I think wobbling is less when the gun is heavy. but you have to get used to it.

I was nearly give up free pistol sometimes back because my Toz is very heavy. but now I really like the way front sight stand up below the black globe.


Good shooting..
Sagara

sorry I missed somthing.. Lot of people bilieve wobbaling is less when the gun is heavy. but it is diffrent to person to person. it is a matter of the way we think about it & the way we take it.

the best way is, if you shoot for competitions, to strengthening your arm & body alining to the gun. you will feel great with weight.

good shooting ..
sagara

For some shooters additional weight is not beneficial, particularly those with shoulder injuries. I speak from experience here. The free pistol is unique in that it allows large scale customization, so in that regard we can do pretty much as we wish.

In my experimentation I've altered the centre of gravity quite significantly on my CM84E, making it very nose heavy, tail heavy and almost neutral balanced. In the end I've discovered that some nose-heaviness is required in order to provide some measure of recoil control and hence consistancy of grouping. I've also shot my CM84E with a barrel cut down to 8". The shorter barrel didn't seem to have any ill effect other than noticeably more muzzle rise on firing. I also would say it didn't have any measureable positive effect.

One point worthy of mention in this discussion is the effect the free pistol grip has on stability. Some folks shoot FP poorly because they haven't managed to make their FP grip fit well. By contrast, a standard pistol grip is much less fit-critical. This might lead the shooter to believe that other aspects of the standard pistol (heavier trigger, shorter barrel, shorter sight radius, different weight) might be the factor contributing to better success in shooting the FP match with a standard pistol when I would wager it's more likely the different grip that's accountable for the biggest portion of the differences in performance.

Just a thought, and at a penny a thought I'm not going to get rich quick! ;-)

I read an article some years back about research into accuracy versus barrel length with .22 rimfire. The results were astounding, as the accuracy was at its optimum with a barrel length somewhere under six inches if I remember correctly, and a minimum or no improvement was achieved by having the barrel any longer. This of course was from a Ransom rest, and didn't take into consideration balance points, recoil etc. My experience is that the longer barrel provides better balance, and the longer sight radius illustrates our natural movement more clearly. With practice, and more experience in the free pistol event, I am sure the longer barrel coupled with a perfectly fitting orthopaedic grip, and a light crisp trigger wil be the best combination
I am also sure that free pistol manufacturers have experimented with every possible length, and all have arrived at a similar measurement for a very good reason.

zoned wrote:Can anyone recommend a gunsmith who could do a proper job of cutting and crowning the barrel on a Free Pistol?

Dave Sams (Sams Custom Gun Works) has done two free pistols that I am aware of. Ransom Rest testing of the guns showed that with the proper ammo they were still capable of 0.5" 10 shot groups at 50 yds.

Is it just perceived wobble due to the sight radius?
Just move the foresight back, no need to touch the barrel.
I'm guessing you could make some sort of mount which would clamp on the barrel say half way along.

The barrel Mark Briggs speaks of in his post is mine. Like Mark, I enjoyed the different balance and the shorter sight radius. The custom barrel produces groups equal or better than the test target provided with the gun. My general impression is the gun is more forgiving now, than it used to be.

A local gunsmith produced custom barrel and I can put you in touch with him,

Brian

I am a woman and I shoot a Morini 84E. I bought it used from our host. When I received it I moved the "sight base" all the way back, flush with the end of the barrel. I have a shorter sight radius and - in my opinion - the balance is perfect. I do not have any problem with "losing the front sight" and/or low shots. Better yet, it did not cost any money and I have not altered the pistol in any way.

Susan