Hi can anyone tell me which pistol is better?
I an currently using Morini CM162 and i'm thinking of changing to Steyr LP 10..is it worth it to change?
which pistol is better?
Moderators: pilkguns, m1963, David Levene, Spencer, Richard H
Forum rules
If you wish to make a donation to this forum's operation , it would be greatly appreciated.
https://www.paypal.com/paypalme/targettalk?yours=true
If you wish to make a donation to this forum's operation , it would be greatly appreciated.
https://www.paypal.com/paypalme/targettalk?yours=true
-
JulianY
- Posts: 350
- Joined: Fri Oct 13, 2006 6:26 am
- Location: A british shooting refugee in Amsterdam
- Contact:
Re: which pistol is better?
They are both winning pistols, its a matter of what suits youtemplars wrote:Hi can anyone tell me which pistol is better?
I an currently using Morini CM162 and i'm thinking of changing to Steyr LP 10..is it worth it to change?
Tens
I enjoy reading the posts regarding which AP is the best. Of course, if you mounted any one of them in a vise - it would shoot one-holers all day long. That being said, the experts all agree that it boils down to which AP feels and works the best in the shooter's hand.
But, something I seldom see is comments about reliability. Which APs have mechanical problems and what are they?
But, something I seldom see is comments about reliability. Which APs have mechanical problems and what are they?
AP - which is best?
I have a 25+ year old FWB 65 that will shoot one hole from benchrest. Now, off-hand, I can shoot in the high 80"s and low 90's at the ripe old age of 65.
Now, who can recommend a modern AP that will raise my average at least 5 points?
:-)
Tillman in Florida
Now, who can recommend a modern AP that will raise my average at least 5 points?
:-)
Tillman in Florida
Hi,
Yes I can recommend FWB P44, this would be the perfect gun in this case.
BUT,
If you shoot among others 60+ and have a gun like that they will say that it is because of the fancy new pistol if you win a match.
It is perhaps better to use a gun like FWB65, (a wolf in sheep clothes) to hide the marksmen in you, and let other competitors have fancy guns without the skill to handle them.
I think you can get 2 points more from a P44 per series of 10 shots. Only you can say if that makes a difference for you. As for me I am content with a half point extra from time to time.
P44 gives you a light weight to lift and a new gun may start a re juvenile process.
Of course if you just shoot a tin per year, stay with your FWB65!
Kent, 63 this year, shooting 1 tin today.
Shooting air:
Steyer LP5, LP10
FWB P44
Morini 162EI
Have had:
FWB 80
Yes I can recommend FWB P44, this would be the perfect gun in this case.
BUT,
If you shoot among others 60+ and have a gun like that they will say that it is because of the fancy new pistol if you win a match.
It is perhaps better to use a gun like FWB65, (a wolf in sheep clothes) to hide the marksmen in you, and let other competitors have fancy guns without the skill to handle them.
I think you can get 2 points more from a P44 per series of 10 shots. Only you can say if that makes a difference for you. As for me I am content with a half point extra from time to time.
P44 gives you a light weight to lift and a new gun may start a re juvenile process.
Of course if you just shoot a tin per year, stay with your FWB65!
Kent, 63 this year, shooting 1 tin today.
Shooting air:
Steyer LP5, LP10
FWB P44
Morini 162EI
Have had:
FWB 80
-
F. Paul in Denver
I have had a chance to shoot many of the fine pistols mentioned in this thread and a few more.
There's an almost unlimited number of modifications you can make to the grip and weight of a gun to make it feel good in your hands. For this reason, I would not make ergonomics the highest of priorities.
As has already been said, the inherent accuracy of any of these guns normally exceeds the shooter's ability to hold. So, unless your going to Beijing in 2008, this is another factor you can set aside.
For me, it's the trigger that sells a gun. I think the Morini 162EI and the Steyr LP1/LP10 have the most superb triggers I have ever experienced. Before you buy anything, you should try to find one of these and try it out for yourself.
When you shop around or if you are lucky enough to have fellow shooters who will loan you an AP to try out - concentrate on the TRIGGER. That's where all the 10's are born.
F. Paul in Denver
There's an almost unlimited number of modifications you can make to the grip and weight of a gun to make it feel good in your hands. For this reason, I would not make ergonomics the highest of priorities.
As has already been said, the inherent accuracy of any of these guns normally exceeds the shooter's ability to hold. So, unless your going to Beijing in 2008, this is another factor you can set aside.
For me, it's the trigger that sells a gun. I think the Morini 162EI and the Steyr LP1/LP10 have the most superb triggers I have ever experienced. Before you buy anything, you should try to find one of these and try it out for yourself.
When you shop around or if you are lucky enough to have fellow shooters who will loan you an AP to try out - concentrate on the TRIGGER. That's where all the 10's are born.
F. Paul in Denver
-
Fred Mannis
- Posts: 1298
- Joined: Sun Aug 29, 2004 8:37 pm
- Location: Delaware
Paul,
Don't agree with you on the unlimited mods you can make to grip and weight, especially if you want to achieve a certain balance. I do agree with you, however, on the importance of the trigger. I have to say that the trigger on my P44 is better than the trigger on my LP1. Suggest you add it to your stable ASAP :-)
Regards,
Fred
Don't agree with you on the unlimited mods you can make to grip and weight, especially if you want to achieve a certain balance. I do agree with you, however, on the importance of the trigger. I have to say that the trigger on my P44 is better than the trigger on my LP1. Suggest you add it to your stable ASAP :-)
Regards,
Fred
I concur with the importance of the trigger....but a good grip also is needed. It's hard to shoot well when you are wrestling the gun around.
The problem with choosing a "best" AP is that while the top shooters are shooting Steyr and Morini almost exclusively, they are reportedly paid to do so. Which tends to encourage loyalty.
On top of that, the other firms are trying very hard to dethrone Steyr and Morini. Which means that they will try harder.
That being said, if you know what you want, you can reduce the field a lot. Morinis have a fantastic trigger...but the grips tend to be a take-it-or-leave-it proposition. Steyrs have more leeway in the grip. The FWB P44 and Hammerli AP40 are featherweights...and if the P44 is what it is reported to be, it might have a chance to crack the market. And perhaps Steyr will field the long-rumored electronic-triggered LP10....or Morini a reworked 162E.
The problem with choosing a "best" AP is that while the top shooters are shooting Steyr and Morini almost exclusively, they are reportedly paid to do so. Which tends to encourage loyalty.
On top of that, the other firms are trying very hard to dethrone Steyr and Morini. Which means that they will try harder.
That being said, if you know what you want, you can reduce the field a lot. Morinis have a fantastic trigger...but the grips tend to be a take-it-or-leave-it proposition. Steyrs have more leeway in the grip. The FWB P44 and Hammerli AP40 are featherweights...and if the P44 is what it is reported to be, it might have a chance to crack the market. And perhaps Steyr will field the long-rumored electronic-triggered LP10....or Morini a reworked 162E.
I would say that there is a lot wrong with this statement. The top shooters do not shoot Steyr and Morini exclusively. I wish it were so. There are a number of notable exceptions shooting other brands. Some of those are getting paid for shooting the latest models of XYZ. The only one I can say for sure doing this is Benelli, and their prize shooter, Nestreuv shot his Steyr when he went to the Olympics, because Olympic gold was worth more to him than a paycheck.Mike M. wrote: The problem with choosing a "best" AP is that while the top shooters are shooting Steyr and Morini almost exclusively, they are reportedly paid to do so. Which tends to encourage loyalty.
.
But if you look at the vast majority of shooters around the world, shooting on world cup level, then yes, most are shooting Morini and Steyr. No way are those folks paid to use the product. The companies would be broke in a week if that was happening. Those are customers.
Steyr has been the dominant gun for nearly 20 years now. Amazing really. Steyr was the first to put all the built adjustment features into the gun, and everybody wanted them. Gold medals were won at the 88 Olympics and then more people wanted them. and it has'nt slowed down. 5 or 6 years ago, FWB was still the number two airpistol, but thats when Morini started finally overcoming the fear amongst competiors about the electronic trigger and Morini has well taken over the number 2 slot and at times threatens Steyr for the number 1.
You can bet that if the vast majority of shooters are using a particular gun, they are doing so for a reason. Its because they want to win, and they have found that for their purposes, they features available in a STeyr or Morini are more to their needs than anything else on the market. Same with computers, cars, or any other feature driven product the ones out front are there because they have the best features for the broadest base fo the populace. You may be one the exception who will do better with brand XYZ, but 95% of you will not be and will do just perfect with the brand leaders.
FWB P44
Having been given the suggestion that a P4 might give me a few more points, I have searched the web looking for information and vendors...all to no avail!
Can any of the list members give me URLs for my exploration, please?
Tillman in Florida
Can any of the list members give me URLs for my exploration, please?
Tillman in Florida
-
Fred Mannis
- Posts: 1298
- Joined: Sun Aug 29, 2004 8:37 pm
- Location: Delaware
Re: FWB P44
if you search this forum for P44 you will find considerable discussion.tleddy wrote:Having been given the suggestion that a P4 might give me a few more points, I have searched the web looking for information and vendors...all to no avail!
Can any of the list members give me URLs for my exploration, please?
Tillman in Florida
The P44 has a very sweet trigger . The ONE example I had the opportunity to handle was much nicer in the trigger department than my LP10 , and felt at least as good as my Morini 162 . I had a hard time believing the trigger was legal , the vendor assured me that in fact it was .
It looks to be a fully competative pistol , if I didn't already own a Styer and a Morini , I would give it serious thought .
Kudos for FWB for comming out with a product that shows a lot of thought , and has some interesting design features .
Chris
It looks to be a fully competative pistol , if I didn't already own a Styer and a Morini , I would give it serious thought .
Kudos for FWB for comming out with a product that shows a lot of thought , and has some interesting design features .
Chris
Hi,
All LP10 have differerent triggers, some are good and others can be made good, I hope. On the other hand you can screw it wrong too.
162E on the other hand is always good as you can not ruin the trigger.
Yes, P44 is like a LP10 in the trigger but a little easier to understand and learn to adjust to your taste.
The P44 has a less bulky grip and may be better for a FWB fan.
I think that the LP10 is better for me.
Have bought a new trigger shoe for LP10 and, guess what, it works on my free pistol FP60 too!
Kent
All LP10 have differerent triggers, some are good and others can be made good, I hope. On the other hand you can screw it wrong too.
162E on the other hand is always good as you can not ruin the trigger.
Yes, P44 is like a LP10 in the trigger but a little easier to understand and learn to adjust to your taste.
The P44 has a less bulky grip and may be better for a FWB fan.
I think that the LP10 is better for me.
Have bought a new trigger shoe for LP10 and, guess what, it works on my free pistol FP60 too!
Kent
-
Multi-AP-owner
Which AP to pick?
Let me brag just a little for a start: I have owned and used very many match APs. Most I have traded off after a year or three, some are still in my possesion.
Today I received my long awaited FWB P44. Much lighter than the too bulky and heavy P40. And a MUCH better trigger. Very promising, and way better than the trigger og any Morini 162 I have fired.
Well time will show. Grip fits my hands much better than the P44, and better than that of the Steyr LP 1/10.
Well, those were my experiences after 100 shots. Time will show how well the P44 stands up to enduring use.
BTW, I still have a FWB CO2-2 dating back to 1982. The trigger is no longer crisp (it hardly ever was), but accuracy is on par...
I am surprised to find many shooters still hang on to their Morini 162s. In my opinion the AP designs have moved leaps forward since the introduction of the 162 in the early 90s.
Today I received my long awaited FWB P44. Much lighter than the too bulky and heavy P40. And a MUCH better trigger. Very promising, and way better than the trigger og any Morini 162 I have fired.
Well time will show. Grip fits my hands much better than the P44, and better than that of the Steyr LP 1/10.
Well, those were my experiences after 100 shots. Time will show how well the P44 stands up to enduring use.
BTW, I still have a FWB CO2-2 dating back to 1982. The trigger is no longer crisp (it hardly ever was), but accuracy is on par...
I am surprised to find many shooters still hang on to their Morini 162s. In my opinion the AP designs have moved leaps forward since the introduction of the 162 in the early 90s.
-
Tom Amlie
Re: Which AP to pick?
Not meaning to sound contrary, but what is the nature of the "forward leaps" in design since then? I recall a recent thread on the value (or lack thereof) of an absorber, and I realize that the Morini lacks the grip adjustments of some other AP's. Also, ("Oh the humanity!....") it requires a screwdriver to adjust the sights. Beyond that, what additional new features or design improvements are there that are worthwhile?Multi-AP-owner wrote:I am surprised to find many shooters still hang on to their Morini 162s. In my opinion the AP designs have moved leaps forward since the introduction of the 162 in the early 90s.
Again, I don't mean to sound snitty. I'm truly curious about what extra goodies are out there.
