TargetTalk

Bob Smalser wrote:Got it, thanks.

I've been going through old Anschutz ads to find some obvious keys for dating these older 54's in auction listings that my juniors can use when perusing these auctions. Perhaps others can help.

Single-claw to double-claw extractors - ca1962? 1965
Checkering to stippling - ca1964? Closer to 1970, certainly checkering on my 1964 1411. My club has a 67 1403 with checkering
Adding two-number year dates to barrels - 1968? Approx 1962. Date code letters supposed to be from 68 but numbers seem to persist until the early 70's
Fixed-hook to removable-hook buttplates - ca1970?
Wing Safety to Side-Safety triggers? - 1980? First version either 76 or 78. Current version 80

Another one for your list, Front receiver ring grooved for sights: 1965

Alan

The first of the modern trigger series were from serial numbers 143655 to 182155. This would be the 16xx series. Supposedly from 1974 to 1979 although the 1974 date seems early. (Does someone recall if there was a year or two with the new trigger but still retained the wing bolt?)

There are some subtle bolt and trigger differences between the 16xxs and 18xx and up actions. The triggers may look the same but they are not.

1979 was the introduction of the 18xx and up action.

'Dude

Bob Smalser wrote:Got it, thanks.

I've been going through old Anschutz ads to find some obvious keys for dating these older 54's in auction listings that my juniors can use when perusing these auctions. Perhaps others can help.

Single-claw to double-claw extractors - ca1962?
Checkering to stippling - ca1964?
Adding two-number year dates to barrels - 1968?
Fixed-hook to removable-hook buttplates - ca1970?
Wing Safety to Side-Safety triggers? - 1980?

Hi Bob,

Dude has it pretty much right (no surprises).

Two bolt claws came in around 1965.

Chequering changed to stippling in 1970 (1407) and '71 (1411/1413)

The oldest rifle I've seen with the age in the proof makrs was 1961. Numbers gave way to letters in '77/'78.

As for the buttplates, I don't know for sure, but I think around 1970.

Wing safety to slide safety came with the 1600 rifles/5071 trigger in 1976/77. These are mechanically identical to the current 5018 (1800/1900/2000) but the sear is a different shape. The two do not interchange, although adjustment is identical as far as I can tell.

'Dude, I have to disagree about the 1800 rifles. I'd say 1980 not 1979. I've not yet seen a '79 proofed 1800, but lots of '79 1600 rifles. Anschutz did have a stock of 1600 parts so early 1800 actions still have the X, but the new bolt and trigger. I did come across a club rifle, a 1980 proofed xx07. Stock, action, and barrel markings were pure 1600, but the bolt and trigger were 1800.

Tim

You are correct, 79-80 was pretty murky as to is it a 16xx or an 18xx.

By the Anschutz parts literature it was officially 1979 and serial number 182156 was the first 18xx. Like you, I have seen rifles that were clearly part of the 1980 model year with the 16xx bolt (and presumably trigger).

This may suggest (pure speculation here) the first 18xx were released in Europe late 79, before they started making it to the States in 80. (Again, that is pure speculation.)

Like any production line, Anschutz appeared to keep going with the 16xx parts until the supply was exhausted.

'Dude

Hi Dude,

totally agree it's rather murky. I also agree that once the factory had redesigned the trigger and bolt, they simply waited until existing stocks were used up, before launching the 1800. Naturally I'd expect bolts and triggers to go first, as these were the core change for the new model.

As for the factory charts, I'm not sure these are wholly reliable. The 1607/19087 hybrid I refered to was a 1980 proof and serial no 181---X. The factory also state the 1600 rifles were introduced in 1974, but I've seen several 1976 proofed wing safety bolt 1400 rifles.

I haven't yet seen a 1980 rifle with an 1600 bolt, although I'd be very interested to hear. I have always suspect that the very earliest 1800 rifles used up 1600 actions and barrels, so I'd be surprised to see a 1980 rifle with a 1600 bolt.

tim

Tim S wrote: I haven't yet seen a 1980 rifle with an 1600 bolt, although I'd be very interested to hear. I have always suspect that the very earliest 1800 rifles used up 1600 actions and barrels, so I'd be surprised to see a 1980 rifle with a 1600 bolt.

tim

Tim - I have one.

It has a 1600 series bolt (with the open channel underneath), 16 series firing pin and a 1980 (IA) date mark... Serial number 177***.

Cheers,
Ken.

[quote="KennyBTim - I have one.

It has a 1600 series bolt (with the open channel underneath), 16 series firing pin and a 1980 (IA) date mark... Serial number 177***.

Cheers,
Ken.[/quote]

Ooh! Thanks Ken, can I ask what the barrel marking was, or is this your Maddco?

This is the rifle with the dinged breech face - still shoots tons though.
I bought it from a clubmate in the summer of 2011, used it through to spring 2013 when I went back to the Maddco after batch testing both at Eley.

It has a cranked bolt handle where the Maddco (148***x also on a '77 16 series receiver) has a straight bolt handle.
It's an 8 groove, 16.5" twist barrel if anyone cares.

K.

Thank you Ken,

that's one for the memory banks.

A straight handle would be right for a '77. I think the cranked handle arrived in '78 at the earliest or '79 at the latest.

It was the Maddco you shot at Perry then?

Hi Tim,
yes, it was the Maddco I took to Perry.
That barrel shot a 14.5mm consolidated group at Eley - which was a bit of a surprise as it had never tested particularly well before - so it had to be the one.

I guess that might be down to the Lowey tuner..... (Thanks Jason & Debbie).

The black Anschutz barrel was a bit mediocre in comparison even though it had shot very well all the previous year.

(A bit off topic - sorry)

K.

Adding some clarity, (perhaps)

All this talk of serial numbers and series changes set me really checking what serial numbers came out when.

I have two actions from 1974, one has been rebarreled so no help there other than I remember it being 1974. Then one that still has the factory barrel clearly marked "74". These two actions start 117 and 119 respectively. (6 digit serials)

Now I have always figured Anschutz seemed to kick out 15K a year rifles. Probably a few less in the '70s and perhaps a touch more in the 80s and 90s.

If I add 2 years and 30k to either of these serial numbers I end up in the upper 140s which puts me at 1976 when the 16xx action came out. (I put a lot more faith in the serial numbers (first 16xx #143655) than I do in the years mentioned in the Anschutz literature.)

I have another action starting 171xxx that is clearly a 16xx action, but it is supposed to be. Pretty sure it is from 78.

That is all I have for now.

Cheers,
'Dude

'Dude,

if your 171---X SN is '78 proofed I'd be interested. I don't expect rewceivers to be barreled and proofed in exact order, but I had a '79 proofed 170---X.

Tim,

Unfortunately the barrel was set back so the proof mark is hidden in the receiver.

I have two 16xx actions, one starting 154xxx, then the 171xxx I was referring to. I had both of them tuned by Karl Kenyon in the early 1990s and one of the things he did was cut the barrels and rechamber them.

154xxx I bought for next to nothing at a gun show in 1986. Then 171xxx came from a former collegiate shooter who was selling off his stuff. That one I bought in late 1991. I remember him telling me it was a '78 model, but that is not a guarantee.

Sorry I can't be more help to you with the barrel proof marks.

'Dude

'Dude,

never mind, it was worth asking. I've had the same done to my 170---X, so the original year of proof is now only in my head.

Tim

Cut and setback:

That was just something we did at the time. I never thought the discussion about the transition years would become a hot topic.

My serial 154xxx I eventually changed to a 18xx bolt and trigger. The cocking cam on the bolt handle wore funny and the bolt became hard to open. Was not able to replace just the handle assembly, had to go for the whole bolt and matching trigger.

Cheers,
'Dude