is it realy worth dishing out for a first air pistol?

[Richard H]

I will mention that the current Walther lpm300x $1300+ has a synthetic grip material which I am not fond of. I do not see any clear cut advantages in the top of the line units. Lot of wind here for what its worth.

Actually it's not a synthetic grip it is a wood grip with a coating (which they give you some to touch up with should you modify the grip). The Hammerli AP 40 had a truly synthetic grip.

[Guest]

I stand corrected on the walther, did not like the hammer grip material either. Old fashioned I guess.

[Richard H]

Have to agree with you wasn't a big fan of the Hammerli grip material either.

[Tom Amlie]

Getting back to the original question.....

I recently made the move from an IZH46 to a Morini 162EI. The IZH-46 was a very nice AP to start with, and well worth the price.

With that said, the Morini is just super super nice compared to the IZH. The issues (as I see them):
1. Manual cocking vs. PSP: not an issue for me. The cocking effort on the IZH is negligible (for an adult male, at least), and I in fact sort of enjoyed the repetitive aspect of it.
2. Weight and balance: Since the IZH was the only thing I had experience with, the weight, although distracting over a long session, didn't seem to be a big detriment. Now that I've shot the Morini for a bit the additional weight of the IZH seems more of an issue.
3. Trigger: Absolutely no comparison. My IZH got a great deal of use, and the trigger was really showing its age recently. I love the Morini trigger. There is absolutely no comparison. Also, being electric I imagine the trigger will never get old and creaky as my IZH trigger did.
4: Grip: The IZH comes with a mildly shaped 2x4 as a grip. Some time with a wood rasp and "quick wood" helped immensely. A Dremel is simply too slow for the amount of material you'd probably want to remove. The Morini grip is very nice as delivered.
5: Convenience: The fact that the IZH doesn't need an external compressed air supply is very convenient. That said, I went out to a dive shop, got a used 80cf SCUBA tank with a DIN valve and the "inconvenience" is no more. If I were going somewhere else to shoot, my two cylinders, filled from a relatively full SCUBA tank, are good for more than enough shooting. As an aside, if you're going to buy a new or used SCUBA tank you may as well look into getting a DIN valve rather than a yoke valve and adapter. If the dive shop in my small south-central PA town can fill via a DIN valve, I would think it would be possible in almost any market.
6. Sights: The adjustable rear notch on the Morini is a big plus. The IZH has interchangable rear sight blades, but they're not terribly user-friendly. I, personally, like a very narrow front sight. You can make a front sight for the IZH with little difficulty. Buying one for the Morini is a $30 proposition.

If you're not really tight on cash I'd go with the quality gun (Steyr, Morini, Pardini, Benelli, Anschutz, etc.). If, because of some deep-seated character flaw you are not utterly smitten with AP shooting, you could probably get the vast majority of your money back selling it used. On re-sale, you might lose $50 on the IZH, IF you don't mangle the "grip" too much. On the higher-end gun you might lose $100 - $150.

As has been noted, the mechanics of the IZH are capable of a perfect score. The human/gun interface is simply much nicer on a higher-end gun.

[TomAmlie]

I was perhaps unduly critical in my description of the IZH grip as a "mildly shaped 2x4". I used it in its original configuration for quite some time, and it was adequate. Additional shaping with a rasp and putty did help, though.

Tom A

[mad5757]

I just bought a used FWB65 for my first pistol and am very happy with it. Sometimes I have to force myself to put it down and do stuff that needs to be done.
I might step up to a nicer gun this summer but this 65 is fun to shoot and learn for now. And lord knows I have alot to learn.
Dale McClure

[joe1347]

Any recommendations for a low cost ($<400)semiauto target air pistol?

After a quick search, the Twinmasker Action Co2 and Drulov Du-10 looked like the only 'new' candidates. However, neither pistol appears to be widely available (in the USA) which makes both suspect.

[psf32]

After a quick search, the Twinmasker Action Co2 and Drulov Du-10 looked like the only 'new' candidates. .

I would stay away from the twinmaster action as it is double action trigger and go for the drulov I have shot both and the drulov wins hands down for a budget semiauto air pistol.

[mad5757]

I just bought a used FWB65 for my first pistol and am very happy with it. Sometimes I have to force myself to put it down and do stuff that needs to be done.
I might step up to a nicer gun this summer but this 65 is fun to shoot and learn for now. And lord knows I have alot to learn.
Dale McClure

And one day after I made that post I ordered a Steyr LP-50. Doh!
Insert foot in mouth.
Dale McClure

[joe1347]

After a quick search, the Twinmasker Action Co2 and Drulov Du-10 looked like the only 'new' candidates. .

I would stay away from the twinmaster action as it is double action trigger and go for the drulov I have shot both and the drulov wins hands down for a budget semiauto air pistol.

Thanks. The more I read, the more appealling the TAU 7 Sport looks in the ~$400 price range. I suspect that I should follow the typical forum advice and keep an eye out for a good used TAU 7 Sport.

[rogerv]

Don't even bother looking at those crap air pistols, no matter what the price. Look instead for a used top quality gun for the same money. Lots of people have dumped their CO2 guns for the dubious benefits of PCP.

For example: you can get a Walther CP2 or CP3 for under $400 that was good enough to win Olympic Gold a few years back. Can you say the same? The US record is still held by a CO2 gun. As Don Nygord said, "They didn't turn to dog doo overnight."

Check out what our host has for sale under "USed Guns".

[joe1347]

Don't even bother looking at those crap air pistols, no matter what the price. Look instead for a used top quality gun for the same money. Lots of people have dumped their CO2 guns for the dubious benefits of PCP.

For example: you can get a Walther CP2 or CP3 for under $400 that was good enough to win Olympic Gold a few years back. Can you say the same? The US record is still held by a CO2 gun. As Don Nygord said, "They didn't turn to dog doo overnight."

Check out what our host has for sale under "USed Guns".

By crap, I assume that you're referring to a new Tau 7, Alfa Proj, or Aeron in the ~$400 price range and instead recommend a used 'high end' older CO2 AP (such as the Walther CP2/CP3) if you're planning on spending ~$400?

Unfortunately, a quick search didn't turn up any used CP2/CP3's. Since the CO2 match AP's are starting to get a little ancient. I wonder if the supply is drying up?

Also, I was trying to understand how one goes about filling (with CO2) a Walther CP2? Is it possible to use readily available 12gram CO2 Powerlet cartridges - or do you need to get a separate tank and trying to find a welding supply store to fill it for you? Possibly, there is a web link that you could point us to that provides "everything you need to know about the old CO2 Air Pistols".

[David Levene]

For example: you can get a Walther CP2 or CP3 for under $400 that was good enough to win Olympic Gold a few years back.

The last time I looked, as they are single shot, neither of these guns satisfied the request for a semi-auto target air pistol.

[joe1347]

Don't even bother looking at those crap air pistols, no matter what the price. Look instead for a used top quality gun for the same money. Lots of people have dumped their CO2 guns for the dubious benefits of PCP.

For example: you can get a Walther CP2 or CP3 for under $400 that was good enough to win Olympic Gold a few years back. Can you say the same? The US record is still held by a CO2 gun. As Don Nygord said, "They didn't turn to dog doo overnight."

Check out what our host has for sale under "USed Guns".

By crap, I assume that you're referring to a new Tau 7, Alfa Proj, or Aeron in the ~$400 price range and instead recommend a used 'high end' older CO2 AP (such as the Walther CP2/CP3) if you're planning on spending ~$400?

Unfortunately, a quick search didn't turn up any used CP2/CP3's. Since the CO2 match AP's are starting to get a little ancient. I wonder if the supply is drying up?

Also, I was trying to understand how one goes about filling (with CO2) a Walther CP2? Is it possible to use readily available 12gram CO2 Powerlet cartridges - or do you need to get a separate tank and trying to find a welding supply store to fill it for you? Possibly, there is a web link that you could point us to that provides "everything you need to know about the old CO2 Air Pistols".

I'll answer my own question. Here's a link to a site that provides an 'illustrated' guide to understanding what's involved with 'bulk filling' CO2 gas Air Pistols.

http://home.hiwaay.net/~ispellan/Co2.html

CO2 12 gram cartridges certainly seem to be a less annoying alternative (to CO2 bulk fill) for the 'casual' shooter.

[derekm]

I have an Alfa Sport and whilst the pistol does not profess to be "world class", it most certainly is not crap. I have not tried a Tau or a Drulov, but have no doubts that they are not crap either. I do not disagree that a used "ex world class" CO2 pistol would be a good alternative choice, but I doubt there are too many subscribers to this forum who would find themselves limited by the capabilities of the aforementioned "crap" pistols.


Re. the bulk fill v. 12 gr cartridges; the Alfa is supplied with a bulk tank, but frankly, when you know you can get 70 shots (or however many, dependent on MV setting) on a 50 or 60 cent cartridge, I personally don't think that bulk is worth the hassle. Two or three 12gr are more than enough for a good evening at the club.