old Eley ammo

[JeffinTX]

I have some older Eley Tenex that is about 10 yrs old, well kept. The wax has changed into a gray moldy color though. Should this be of any concern as far is performance of the rounds? thanks

[toznerd]

My experience with Eley is that it doesn't take long to get the "moldy" look. If they feel waxy to the touch (don't wipe the lube off, just rub it with your finger) then they should be fine. Its when the lube becomes dry and chalky that you might find a means other than important matches to dispose of the rounds.

toznerd

[Guest]

Eley's lube or wax as it is called sometimes is a 2 part mix. Tallow which is simply a fancy name for animal fat is one part, and the other is bees wax. If your ammo is 10 years old I would be quite concerned that the lube is dried out. It it was my situation I would most likely shoot that old ammo through nothing but a plinker. Surely the lube will not due it's job to keep the barrel from "leading up" and secondly I would not be surprised if it also caused chambering problems due to "gunk" build up. Just my take on this.

Give me a break! Are you really telling us that 10 yr old ammo is useless? or would damage a match bore? I have a couple cases of $1000.00 + ammo on hand that shoots as well as it did when it rolled of the line. If it is stored in reasonably dry and temerate conditions you should have no reservations shooting it in any match firearm. Animal fat and bees wax, even when dry (to the eye) is not going to damage a steel bore. Excessive "leading" is not an issue in a .22. Shoot 10's and don't worry about the old wives tales.

[Mellberg]

I shot 565 with a +25 year old batch of Eley ammo last summer, and in a test it produced a _very_ tight grouping at 50 meters. I also have an old batch of Eley Tenex that is very consistent and tight.

I tested a really (and I mean really) old batch of Eley Match-something in an old Hammerli 150 that had less than 15mm groupings.

My conclusion is: Old ammo is as good as new ammo if it's high quality and stored well.

[Cricman]

I have some older Eley Tenex that is about 10 yrs old, well kept. The wax has changed into a gray moldy color though. Should this be of any concern as far is performance of the rounds? thanks

I think Jeff was concerned with the color and condition of the lube, not the lack of lube, and how the color change might relate to a degradation in performance. I don't think anyone here believes no lube is good state. As toznerd stated, check it by feel. If it is still waxy, it should be fine. As far as leading a barrel, I don't imagine that it takes much lube to prevent leading from a round going 1100fps, if the bullet has a sufficient amount of alloy added to make it hard. I certainly think it would not cause any harm to the barrel. It would, however, definately effect accuracy over a long string of shots. And for age, 10 years is no cause for any concern, if it was stored properly. However, if any of you are scared to fire 6-10 year old Eley that was stored indoors, I will gladly pay you pennies on the dollar for adequate disposal.


cricman

[slinger]

The ( color ) of the lube would be what would cause concern for me. If the color has changed,,,,what else changed as well? Once the degradation process has begun, who is to say what value the (lube like substance) has at that point. I was offered a full case of Eley Target Piatol about 2 months ago by another fellow shooter. Whan I opened the case to check the ammo status I found that the lube here had turned white. When you took a round out of the box the bullet would actually stick to your hand. According to the ammo lot # this ammo was just over 5 years old, but due to the hot humid enviromenmt that I reside in and improper storeage it was " gone " in my book. This is all a matter of OPINION to me. I just say what I would do. But I would not want to shoot " questionalbe" ammo, after I spend so much time and money to get a great shooting firearm, and practice my skills.

[Fergus Ubermeyer]

Speaking of anonymity, is "Slinger" your first or last name?

[quote="slinger"] Also to our brave "guest" who speaks from behind anonymity regarding the fact that leading does not take place in .22s,please explain to me why copper/brass plating is used on slightly higher velocity 22 ammo then.

If you read the original post, Jeff was asking about Eley tenex, a Standard velocity match target round running out at roughly 1050fps, NOT your copper or whatever plated WallMart bulk packed HV plinking/pest control ammo. Jeff also mentioned that the colouration appeared "moldy" not "rough" or "oxidized" nor any other descriptor of a condition worthy of concern. Jeff also stated that the ammo was stored well, so we can presume that it was not subjected to extreme heat. If you are familiar with Eley Tenex then you know that the projectile is white/light grey to begin with, the lube is also fairly light in colour. Is it possible that what Jeff is describing as "moldy" could also be described as "blotchy"? Without a photo I would be very hesitant to decree his Eley is "gone" or reduced to "plinking ammo", or even "questionable" in any way. I have a case of Eley Tenex that is pushing 20 years old, it's lube has a slight blotchy waxy appearance but it is perfectly fine. In fact, when I compare it to the lube on a new lot of Eley Ultimate EPS I see no difference in the way the lube looks, and I have no reservations shooting it in any match pistol.


Shoot your Eley with an easy mind Jeff, it's fine.

Fergus

[Richard H]

I honestly could not speak for what RWS does. Certianly not since they have been bought out. Personally I find it quite alarming that quality ammo manufactures are being bought out by "corporate giants".

Well RWS was bought out a long time ago by Dupont, they have since changes hands to Ruag which is a Swiss arms conglomerate. I'd much rather have RWS being made by Ruag.

[Guest]

Isn't RWS owned by Umarex now?

[JeffinTX]

thanks for the responses. There is still wax on the bullet, and its still "waxy" to touch. Its not dried or flakey, and its not the oxidized lead. It just looks funny compared to other 22LR ammo I've seen. I did try some out on a recently acquired 1913 and it shot well in gusty conditions with a gun I am only beginning to sort out. It did consistent shoot cleans at 50 with high X counts, but so did Wolf match. At 100, it held about half to 2/3 10 ring for elevation, so I think it shoots. I will try it out at a 1600 tomorrow.

[Richard H]

Isn't RWS owned by Umarex now?

No thats Walther.

http://www.rws-munition.de/en/rws_ruag/rws_ruag.htm

You might be thinking of RWS branded Air rifles which are made by Walther which is owned by Umarex, but his has nothing to do with RWS ammunition.

[methosb]

I also have ammo which look like JeffinTX describes and am wondering if it will be safe to put through my barrel. I have about 1000 rounds of Tenex from about 5 years ago and about 500 rounds of Match Plus from the same time.

Here are some pictures. They still feel waxy but only slightly, nowhere near that of new ammo. They also have that mouldy white look which is patchy. I just bought a brand new 2007 so I am a little scared of it hurting my barrel, but I would like to use it if it won't because they were good batches.

Here is a pic with unnatural yellow light:


Here is a pic in more natural light, but quality of the photo is not as good:


Would greatly appreciated it if anyone could give me some advice on whether or not it is ok to put through my barrel. Thanks.[/img]

[WarWagon]

I wouldn't hesitate to shoot it.

[jacques b gros]

This box of high vel, jacqueted ammo is nearly 25 yrs old. Some time ago I found this last one in the back of a drawer. About 5 yrs ago tried some on an old .22 Marlin: did not fit the chamber.

Sorry for dark pix. blame picasa and its idiossincrasies...

[toznerd]

That is a different animal. Those are copperplated bullets with corrosion; specifically showing the presence of corrosive salts. The salts have changed the outside dimension of the bullet. Plated bullets are generally not required to be lubed for their applicable velocity levels. Wax based lubed tend to lose efficiency at higher velocities, where molybdenum lubes can be effective into slightly higher velocities ranges. Of course, a wax lube can delay surface corrosion on the bullet, if nothing else.

toznerd

[jacques b gros]

That is a different animal. Those are copperplated bullets with corrosion; specifically showing the presence of corrosive salts. The salts have changed the outside dimension of the bullet. Plated bullets are generally not required to be lubed for their applicable velocity levels. Wax based lubed tend to lose efficiency at higher velocities, where molybdenum lubes can be effective into slightly higher velocities ranges. Of course, a wax lube can delay surface corrosion on the bullet, if nothing else.

toznerd

Tks for the information. I had figured that two different metals like these two made a bad couple when pressed together.

Thanks

[JeffinTX]

Follow up on the old red box Tenex. Despite the unsightly wax, the rounds shoot very well and are on call. No apparent functional problems with the ammo.

[Gaffer]

I have a couple of boxes left of 20 year old Eley Tenex black box and quit using it after two rims ruptured while shooting prone and sent gas back into my face. Not sure why except that I speculated that the priming material in that batch must have weakened the brass rims. I have not used it since that happened during a match and I lost points on the shots.

[DomeyDick]

I have some 23 year old Eley that I used in the 2006 Washington St. Prone matches. 1st shoulder to shoulder match in 18 years at age 69. i won three of the four scope matches with that ammo. 50 yards was 39 X 400. It works for me. However it has been sealed in cans and kept cool all that time.