Walther Expert Vs Walther SSP
Moderators: pilkguns, m1963, Isabel1130
Walther Expert Vs Walther SSP
Hi everybody, need a little help. I am a bull's-eye shooter when I was young I did very well. I won a couple of state championships not bragging just want to let you know where I'm at, always use a high standard. Now I joined a pistol league just getting back in to it. Took a look at my high standard and the rail is cracked. so what's new. Anyway I saved up almost a year. And bought AW93 not happy. I won't say anything bad. But I just can't get used of my hand or grip pointing down. My question is. I have been looking at two guns hoping that somebody knows about them they are. Walther Expert & Walther SSP I've seen the Expert but nobody knows anything about SSP for bull's-eye shooting. I am really hoping that somebody could give me some information about these two guns. My next step there's a guns show coming up at the farm show in Pennsylvania if I should just look for a high standard. But I do like the SSP looks. So any help would be really appreciated thank you Bob PS or is there something else that I might look at.
The Expert is basically the same as the old GSP they added a recoil absorbtion system to it.
The SSP is there brand new pistol around a year old, I'm not surprised that there aren't many being used in BE as there still aren't many being used in Internation events yet.
I've shot both (I regularly shoot a mid 80's GSP both in .22 and .32). The Expert has the exact same ergonomics as the old GSP, which means it does have a somewhat more vertical grip. the Absorber in the Expert does seem to make a small difference (I noticed more of a difference with the optional barrel weight which includes a second absorber system).
The SSP shot nice has more rake in the grip than the GSP (personally I like a little more rake). It has a low bore line axis , it uses a striker instead of a hammer (so reduces the moving mass of a hammer). has a longer barrel than the GSP and it loads through the breach.
The SSP is there brand new pistol around a year old, I'm not surprised that there aren't many being used in BE as there still aren't many being used in Internation events yet.
I've shot both (I regularly shoot a mid 80's GSP both in .22 and .32). The Expert has the exact same ergonomics as the old GSP, which means it does have a somewhat more vertical grip. the Absorber in the Expert does seem to make a small difference (I noticed more of a difference with the optional barrel weight which includes a second absorber system).
The SSP shot nice has more rake in the grip than the GSP (personally I like a little more rake). It has a low bore line axis , it uses a striker instead of a hammer (so reduces the moving mass of a hammer). has a longer barrel than the GSP and it loads through the breach.
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Guest
New AW93 Grip?
Brenzovich has indicated he's working on an AW93 grip that will approximate the 1911's angle. Might be worth a call: 1-877- 585- 3775.
Guest, Richard H, thanks for Getting back. Not too many people I can talk to about bull's-eye shooting, and these web sites are absolutely great for me. I do find out a lot of information. Anyway. Guest that is who I brought the AW93 from and you cannot imagine how I am waiting for that grip, I am hoping that that is the problem, I go to the club about two nights a week. Right now my high standard shoots as good, or better. Then the 93. 5-20 rounds, slow fire target. That's with one gun and then the same thing with the other gun. That's not counting time & rapid around roughly 350 to 400 a night. And the high standard is edging it out. That's why I am confuse. Don't know if I should go to Walter. Or another high standard. Hoping to pick up some information or advise. but thank you for answering.
Grip angle
If you want to match the 1911 grip angle, try a Marvel conversion for the 1911 frame.
It is a simple drop-on to virtually any good 1911 frame and you can adjust the trigger to the legal weight of 2# or use the 3.5# for the 45 cal practice.
I have three and the things are tack drivers. I also have an AW93 that I like a lot - heck, if might even be willing to trade one of my complete Marvels for the AW93 since I only have one of those :-)
Tillman
It is a simple drop-on to virtually any good 1911 frame and you can adjust the trigger to the legal weight of 2# or use the 3.5# for the 45 cal practice.
I have three and the things are tack drivers. I also have an AW93 that I like a lot - heck, if might even be willing to trade one of my complete Marvels for the AW93 since I only have one of those :-)
Tillman
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Grant
Walther Expert
I own both the GSP and the Expert in the 22/32. The Expert has a noticably reduced recoil compared to the GSP making getting back on target easier in the T & R series. The SSP likes to be clean and is designed to use the new full primer 22 ammunition. Do I like the Expert, you bet!! I have been shooting for way too long but with the two stage trigger in the Expert and the new laminated grips I am shooting better scores now than I ever have. Nothing wrong with any of the upper end guns but the Expert simply makes it easier to shoot better scores. Combine the Expert with the longer barrels c/w the barrel mounted Ultra Dots Precision Ten X is building and you have winner. Good Shooting.
Re: Walther Expert
Too bad he's not making barrels any more, got to find a new source.Grant wrote:I own both the GSP and the Expert in the 22/32. The Expert has a noticably reduced recoil compared to the GSP making getting back on target easier in the T & R series. The SSP likes to be clean and is designed to use the new full primer 22 ammunition. Do I like the Expert, you bet!! I have been shooting for way too long but with the two stage trigger in the Expert and the new laminated grips I am shooting better scores now than I ever have. Nothing wrong with any of the upper end guns but the Expert simply makes it easier to shoot better scores. Combine the Expert with the longer barrels c/w the barrel mounted Ultra Dots Precision Ten X is building and you have winner. Good Shooting.
If anybody knows of a source for quality longer GSP barrels let me know.
Hi Mileaway,
A few people have mentioned 1911 grip. Since you sound like an "old school" BE shooter, this is worth considering. Is your H-S a military grip model or a slant grip? If it's the former, you may want to strongly consider the Marvel/1911 approach. I see lots of guys using that for outdoor 2700. I've tried it and, if you like 1911 grip angle and trigger, is a great way to go. Many international guys don't like it because the 1911 doesn't have all the adjustments one is used to finding. By the same token, a lot of the same guys consider the H-S more of a plinker. Personally, I think it was, and still is, a great gun. The cracked rail you have, however, is not rare so you may want to keep that in mind looking for a used one.
I have a good bit of experience with the GSP (old model) using stock barrel and a Falcon aluminum sleeve barrel. The Falcon greatly enhances handling in my opinion. But, the GSP just doesn't quite do it for me. I personally prefer the Pardini. It nothing like a 1911, but it hangs beautifully in the hand, at least for me.
The best thing is to try out as many options as possible before laying out the dough. Another option is to look for a discontinued Hammerli 208/215 (208s for two stage trigger). It is a darling of the 2700 and international crowds. It handles like a 1911, if not better, exudes quality and is priced, when found, accordingly. But it will last a lifetime if well cared for. Get one from a reputable Hammerli service retailer, like Larry Carter, so you can be sure it is in top shape.
A few people have mentioned 1911 grip. Since you sound like an "old school" BE shooter, this is worth considering. Is your H-S a military grip model or a slant grip? If it's the former, you may want to strongly consider the Marvel/1911 approach. I see lots of guys using that for outdoor 2700. I've tried it and, if you like 1911 grip angle and trigger, is a great way to go. Many international guys don't like it because the 1911 doesn't have all the adjustments one is used to finding. By the same token, a lot of the same guys consider the H-S more of a plinker. Personally, I think it was, and still is, a great gun. The cracked rail you have, however, is not rare so you may want to keep that in mind looking for a used one.
I have a good bit of experience with the GSP (old model) using stock barrel and a Falcon aluminum sleeve barrel. The Falcon greatly enhances handling in my opinion. But, the GSP just doesn't quite do it for me. I personally prefer the Pardini. It nothing like a 1911, but it hangs beautifully in the hand, at least for me.
The best thing is to try out as many options as possible before laying out the dough. Another option is to look for a discontinued Hammerli 208/215 (208s for two stage trigger). It is a darling of the 2700 and international crowds. It handles like a 1911, if not better, exudes quality and is priced, when found, accordingly. But it will last a lifetime if well cared for. Get one from a reputable Hammerli service retailer, like Larry Carter, so you can be sure it is in top shape.
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grant
Precision Ten X barrels
I just talked to Chris from Preciion Ten X. Chris is still making barrels, he is just so busy he cannot keep up. Chris wants everyone to know he will get to everyone in the order they ordered. When he catches up he will accept more orders.
On a personal note Chris has a young family and has the right perspective, family first, toys second. Chris has done a lot of work to help out our Juniors and the members of my military handgun team. Let's have patience with those helping our sport.
On a personal note Chris has a young family and has the right perspective, family first, toys second. Chris has done a lot of work to help out our Juniors and the members of my military handgun team. Let's have patience with those helping our sport.
Re: Precision Ten X barrels
Grant send me a PM with some way I can contact you please.grant wrote:I just talked to Chris from Preciion Ten X. Chris is still making barrels, he is just so busy he cannot keep up. Chris wants everyone to know he will get to everyone in the order they ordered. When he catches up he will accept more orders.
On a personal note Chris has a young family and has the right perspective, family first, toys second. Chris has done a lot of work to help out our Juniors and the members of my military handgun team. Let's have patience with those helping our sport.
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gblavigne@skvelocity.ca
Re: Precision Ten X barrels
E-mail me at gblavigne@skvelocity.caRichard H wrote:Grant send me a PM with some way I can contact you please.grant wrote:I just talked to Chris from Preciion Ten X. Chris is still making barrels, he is just so busy he cannot keep up. Chris wants everyone to know he will get to everyone in the order they ordered. When he catches up he will accept more orders.
On a personal note Chris has a young family and has the right perspective, family first, toys second. Chris has done a lot of work to help out our Juniors and the members of my military handgun team. Let's have patience with those helping our sport.
Re: Walther Expert
Grant,Grant wrote:... The SSP likes to be clean and is designed to use the new full primer 22 ammunition.
What's "full primer ammunition"?
Thanks,
Nikos
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Grant
Full primer case
Sorry for taking so long to reply, been away for awhile. The SSP has a firing pin that strikes the centre of the case. Some manufacturers, Eley, RWS have developed 22 ammo with the primer charge across the entire base of the case instead of mainly around the rim. Regular ammo will still fire but with the occasional misfire, always at the worst possible time. Thereby in some cases the cause of the misfires some folks have talked about with the SSP. I am sure all of the european ammo makers will have full primer 22 ammo in short order. Not a chance thye will let one or two brands corner the market in Europe. Hope this clears up your question.
Walther Expert Vs Walther SSP
Here is a picture of the bolt face of the Walther SSP. I don't see where the firing pin would hit the center of a full primered 22 case. The firing pin is still hitting the rim????
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Guest
SSP problem
I have not heard of any new primer standard in .22 ammunition. But I hav experienced the problem with rounds that did not fire. The pin hit a little bit more towards the center, than on the rim. The problem have been experienced on ELEY, CCI, old hirtenberger and Winchester.
The problem I found was the action got out of line a little bit. The problem always start when the gun i dirty. A good cleaning solved the problem. So I clean the action every 500 rds.
The problem I found was the action got out of line a little bit. The problem always start when the gun i dirty. A good cleaning solved the problem. So I clean the action every 500 rds.
Frank Glenn
Hi folks,
Frank Glenn from Accuracy Unlimited in Pheonix AZ makes Barrels for the GSP.
Frank is a two time Masters International champ and this years top senior shooter. Frank shoots a GSP with one of his tubes in the precision event.
I know he has one stainless barrel made up and he can fabricate one in most any design you wish.
Frank has built guns for the likes of Rob Leatham, Brian Enos, Doug Koenig shot one of his guns to a Bianchi cup title and others. Frank has a lot of experience making his own GSP shoot at 50 I'm sure he could satisfy most any requirement you all might have
Thanks
Mike
Frank Glenn from Accuracy Unlimited in Pheonix AZ makes Barrels for the GSP.
Frank is a two time Masters International champ and this years top senior shooter. Frank shoots a GSP with one of his tubes in the precision event.
I know he has one stainless barrel made up and he can fabricate one in most any design you wish.
Frank has built guns for the likes of Rob Leatham, Brian Enos, Doug Koenig shot one of his guns to a Bianchi cup title and others. Frank has a lot of experience making his own GSP shoot at 50 I'm sure he could satisfy most any requirement you all might have
Thanks
Mike
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Aussie Matt
Striker in Walther SSP
As an SSP owner, if there's any doubt on the Walter SSP striker/firing pin (as I have read a couple of times now), have a look at the schematic drawing from the European Walther website. It's in German, but other than translation tools, if you look at part no. 21, you will see (where it should be) a medium-sized bar with an 30 degree upwards angle and then a sharp (knife-edge) striker fixed inwards at 90 degrees to the right (as seen from the rear).
The striker is at the rear, with the bar sliding within the bolt and slide assembly, then the 90 degree fork at the front is fitted to the striker's rod and spring assembly (part No. 1C).
To put it simply, when released, the striker will slide forward inside the bolt and make contact with the standard whole-of-face-type .22 primer, but only make contact upon the rim (i.e. rimfire) in a standard line-imprint, not a firing-pin-type central dot imprint (i.e. centrefire).
It's a bit unconventional, but it works, and in my opinion saves a lot of space and weight, so that the grip can be much closer to the barrel axis, for less recoil kick. I know it's only a .22, but remember that this is also designed to be a Rapid-Fire pistol, where 1/2 a second times by around 50 rounds requiring re-alignment, is unacceptable. I've shot this in rapid-fire on falling metal plates, and found it to realign very quickly, and exactly on target (but obviously for a varied of reasons, not just the grip height and barrel-axis issue).
As to whether to buy the SSP, I think works really well once you understand its operation (especially the magazine issue). I also note that in the 2008 Olympics, womens 25m Standard Pistol match was silver and bronze to the SSP.
It also looks a real treat, as many do comment on. Doesn't have a convention rail for light/laser attachments (but has an unconventional one for the barrel weights), but I found the bottom of the trigger guard is suprisingly the perfect size for this and it works. But hey, this isn't a self-defence pistol so who cares? The price is top-end for this type.
There's a million other things I could say, but to summerise it's a highly attractive, adjustable and accurate tool that will last. For me, that's a triple-A rating.
The striker is at the rear, with the bar sliding within the bolt and slide assembly, then the 90 degree fork at the front is fitted to the striker's rod and spring assembly (part No. 1C).
To put it simply, when released, the striker will slide forward inside the bolt and make contact with the standard whole-of-face-type .22 primer, but only make contact upon the rim (i.e. rimfire) in a standard line-imprint, not a firing-pin-type central dot imprint (i.e. centrefire).
It's a bit unconventional, but it works, and in my opinion saves a lot of space and weight, so that the grip can be much closer to the barrel axis, for less recoil kick. I know it's only a .22, but remember that this is also designed to be a Rapid-Fire pistol, where 1/2 a second times by around 50 rounds requiring re-alignment, is unacceptable. I've shot this in rapid-fire on falling metal plates, and found it to realign very quickly, and exactly on target (but obviously for a varied of reasons, not just the grip height and barrel-axis issue).
As to whether to buy the SSP, I think works really well once you understand its operation (especially the magazine issue). I also note that in the 2008 Olympics, womens 25m Standard Pistol match was silver and bronze to the SSP.
It also looks a real treat, as many do comment on. Doesn't have a convention rail for light/laser attachments (but has an unconventional one for the barrel weights), but I found the bottom of the trigger guard is suprisingly the perfect size for this and it works. But hey, this isn't a self-defence pistol so who cares? The price is top-end for this type.
There's a million other things I could say, but to summerise it's a highly attractive, adjustable and accurate tool that will last. For me, that's a triple-A rating.
Mounts for dot sights for the SSP are available here: http://www.waltherusa.net/The other minus for the new Walther SSP is the unavailability of a scope/red dot mount. The Walther GSP Expert is my favorite gun. It's designed to last several lifetimes.
A couple of the guys on my Bullseye team are using them, and they work fine (though I can't say I care for the way they look).