Hypoxia

[bereznov]

I have been asked to post some info -that I sent to the UIT mailing list- onto this site. Take it for what it is, accept it or reject it. Feedback is always welcome.

The file in MS Word is attached

[Marcus]

Thanks Doc!

Thank you for the research and taking the time and having the persistence to get your word out.

Marcus Raab
National Coach Trainer
National Rifle Association
mraab(at)nrahq.org

[bereznov]

Thanks for they reply and questions.

The vision issue you are discussing re: burn in,
is a retinal phenomenon. The retinal cells
fatigue after prolonged stimulation by a light source.
This also happens when you stare at
a pinpoint light source in the night sky. In that
case the object seems to move as you make micro-
eye movements to maintain the pin point object in your
vision.

I suspect ( yet have no medical references )
that the reason breathing will break
the "burn in" you are talking about, is that when you breathe,
there is motion in the thorax as well as the head. Therefore;
the eyes must move to maintain the target picture and thus
move the retinal image, thereby preventing the " burn in " or
retinal cell fatigue you mentioned. I am not a retinal physiologist
but my training in aerospace medicine focused on vision to
a very large extent.

I do not think that you can hold your breath long enough while shooting to alter
your visual acquisition or acuity.

There may be some studies out there to prove my assumption wrong.
If anyone finds some. please let me know.

Re; the hypobaric chamber: I used the Navy's chamber at the
Naval Aerospace Medical Institute, not something most civilians get access to.

Any comments from ophthalmologists out there?

Dr. C. M. Bereznoff
CDR USNR (Flight Surgeon) - Ret.
Medical Director
Longmont Institute of Integrative Medicine
1304 N. Vivian St.
Longmont, Colorado, USA 80501-3217

Dear C.M.

Thanks for that information. I was also interested in the hypobaric chamber training. I have a swim coach contact who is interested in that so I will be forwarding your email.

I suspect - as usual one may think - that one piece of information (apparent lack of oxygen) has been used to "describe" another problem on shooting.

What I allude to is the problem of staring at the sight picture for too long
and letting the image burn in. If one suggests to a shooter that they breath
more often, this problem automatically goes away. Thus one MAY attribute the problem to lack of oxygen rather than the problem inherent in the visual system.

What I would really like to know is what is the effect of holding ones
breath on the visual system??? If any.

If we blink, look away etc from the sights to alleviate the burn in problem
while holding "long" breaths does the sight picture deteriorate?

BTW. Are we talking about "holding" breath in or "holding" breathe out? ie
lungs empty. Strike me dead but all these years I have been preaching lungs empty at the time of sighting and firing.

God, I hate people who bring FACTS into an argument!!!

Regards

Ross Mason

[pilkguns]

the Coach in question is addressed in this thread if you are not up to speed on that issue
viewtopic.php?t=13791&start=20&postdays ... highlight=

[Richard H]

Is Chet back? I noticed they were talking about closing down UIT mailing list (he seemed to be the only one regularly posting there), so he must be lonely.

[Elmas]

.

Dont you think that anyone on aim should not experience the beginnings of discomfort as a result of holding his breath ?

That once one feels the very beginnings of this discomfort , that one should take a breath and and start over ? For any discomfort is necesarily a distraction and a n y distraction is detrimental .

The way out of this discomfort is not to let off a shot , but to resist the temptation to do so and bring the pistol down ?

That is to say , if you 'experience hypoxia' during shooting , then you're " doing it wrong" !



Elmas

.

[Wisard]

Coach,

I have been following all of the comments regarding the hypoxia issue.

Sure, Anoxia ( the complete absence of oxygen ) will cause organ and brain damage. After about six minutes, real damage is done, and that is nothing to laugh about. It is NOT permanent however. Rather it is a temporary condition that time and rehabilitation with cell regeneration will resolve, albeit months to do so. Recent studies have shown that the brain and all other organs DO regenerate.

Mountaineers routinely climb to altitude that have an oxygen saturation that is not
compatible with life lasting many days, yet they do it under heavy physical ( i.e.: oxygen demanding ) conditions. They do perform at reduced mental and physical capacities but only while in the oxygen deprived state with oxygen saturation in the 40-50% range ( normal 95-100%). I know this to be true as I have been involved with and climbed at high altitude as a climbing team physician over many years. During some of these high altitude climbs, we conducted research with the United States Navy Health Research Center, on the performance decrements that the climbers (me included) experienced.

Further more for shooters there is a small oxygen reserve in that the shooting athlete will balance the lungs at the level where the athlete is not forced to inhale or exhale and the lungs being balanced and yet having a small reserve for systems protections. This is the reserve the Doctor is referring to but the reports fail to include in the studies. In other words, the researcher has completed an incomplete report without consideration of or taking the balanced lung condition into account. Any increase in oxygenation has to come from some reserve as the vascular system does not have it available. This then puts the whole of the reports into question as to the validity of such information.

I have been in a hyperbaric chamber and directly experienced the effects of rapidly induced hypoxia for durations of up to 10 minutes. There were no immediate effects noted, only as the minutes ticked by did the effects on performance decline begin to develop as my original report indicated. Every thing is accumulated over time and reoccurrence of breath holding under the NRA shooting technique. For the our young shooters this is unacceptable.

I seriously doubt that any shooter can hold their breath for much more than 60 seconds ( yet I am sure a few can ), and I seriously doubt than any will hold their breath for that amount of time while shooting a one shot match but over time on a accumulative bases where the system is incorrectly flushed after each shot fired, it is very possible.

RESPONSE: THE SHOOTING ATHELTE WILL REPEATEDLY HOLD BREATH FOR EXTENDED TIMES AND THIS BECOME’s ACCUMLITIVE OVER TIME. Therefore, an athlete can ands will hold the breath longer then 60 seconds because no replenishment is accomplished in enough time to flush the system of bad gasses in the blood system.

Also, in
1966 American Heart Association, Inc. Cerebral Hemodynamics, Blood Gases, and Electrolytes during Breath-Holding and the Valsalva Maneuver JOHN S. MEYER M.D.1; FUMIO GOTOH M.D.1; YASUYUKI TAKAGI M.D.1; RYOJI KAKIMI M.D.
During the interval of tolerated breath-holding for 69 seconds or less, jugular venous oxygen tension was increased owing to increased cerebral blood flow resulting from an increase of arterial carbon dioxide tension.

This means that during breath holding of 69 seconds or less, the oxygen saturation of the blood in the brain actually INCREASES with breath holding.

RESPONSE: THIS IS VERY GOOD BUT YOU DID NOT SAY WHERE THIS OXYGEN RESERVE IS COMING FROM? “the oxygen saturation of the blood in the brain actually INCREASES with breath holding.” Sorry but I don’t think so. If this increase occurs then the subject is breathing and not holding the breath…


M. Holzschuh1 C. Woertgen1, C. Metz2 and A. Brawanski1
(1) Department of Neurosurgery, University of Regensburg, Regensburg, Germany
(2) Department of Anesthesiology, University of Regensburg, Regensburg, Germany

Summary The present study compares the change of cerebral blood flow and HbO2 ( Oxygen saturation of hemoglobin )measured by near-infrared spectroscopy (NIRS) after administration of 1000 mg acetazolamide intravenously. CBF ( Cerebral blood flow ) studies in 21 patients with ischaemic cerebrovascular disease were performed routinely with the133Xenon technique. Additionally the local HbO2 was recorded by NIRS. A rest study was followed by a second study after the administration of 1000 mg acetazolamide. In 18 patients we observed an increase of 30.8% of CBF and 4.7% of HbO2

So how can the shooter have all of the falsely claimed oxygen deprivation problems while holding the breath long enough to get a shot off ?

RESPONSE: MY POINT EXACTLY, under my findings I have the athlete fire within or less then one second. In such cases of firing in one second or less does not incur such problems where the current NRA Traditional Methods do.

There is also ample evidence to show that with the elevated Carbon dioxide levels in the brain (breath holding), the heart rate actually decreases, (benefit to a shooter, no and yes?) and the blood flow to the extremities (arms and legs) decreases (less pulse effect in the shooting position, no and yes?).

RESPONSE: EXACELY MY POINT IS IT NOT? Such actions in reduction are precisely what are directed with in the mental checklist and just for this reason. The check list used in the precise time limitations will safety protect the athlete from dangerous incidents during the one shot match on an accumulive basis.

There are actually benefits to intermittent hypoxia episodes as seen below.
J Appl Physiol. 2001 Apr;90(4):1431-40.
Intermittent hypoxia increases ventilation and Sa(O2) during hypoxic exercise and hypoxic chemosensitivity.

Katayama K, Sato Y, Morotome Y, Shima N, Ishida K, Mori S, Miyamura M.

Research Center of Health, Physical Fitness and Sports, Research Institute of Environmental Medicine, Nagoya University, Nagoya 464-8601, Japan.

The purpose of this study was 1) to test the hypothesis that ventilation and arterial oxygen saturation (Sa(O2)) during acute hypoxia may increase during intermittent hypoxia and remain elevated for a week without hypoxic exposure and 2) to clarify whether the changes in ventilation and Sa(O2) during hypoxic exercise are correlated with the change in hypoxic chemosensitivity. ...........1 wk of daily exposure to 1 hour of hypoxia significantly improved oxygenation in exercise during subsequent acute hypoxic exposures up to 1 wk after the conditioning, presumably caused by the enhanced hypoxic ventilatory chemosensitivity.
J Appl Physiol. 2001 Apr;90(4):1593-9. Review.

Invited review: Physiological and pathophysiological responses to intermittent hypoxia.

Neubauer JA.

Division of Pulmonary and Critical Care Medicine, Department of Medicine, University of Medicine and Dentistry of New Jersey, Robert Wood Johnson Medical School, New Brunswick, New Jersey 08903-0019, USA. neubaeur@umdnj.edu

This mini-review summarizes the physiological adaptations to and pathophysiological consequences of intermittent hypoxia with special emphasis given to the pathophysiology associated with obstructive sleep apnea. Intermittent hypoxia is an effective stimulus for evoking the respiratory, cardiovascular, and metabolic adaptations normally associated with continuous chronic hypoxia. These adaptations are thought by some to be beneficial in that they may provide protection against disease as well as improve exercise performance in athletes.
Eur J Appl Physiol 2001 Apr;84(4):283-90
Training-induced increases in sea-level performance are enhanced by acute intermittent hypobaric hypoxia.
Meeuwsen T, Hendriksen IJ, Holewijn M.Research and Development Department, Netherlands Aeromedical Institute, Soesterberg, The Netherlands.
The goal of this study was to investigate to what extent intermittent exposure to altitude in a hypobaric chamber can improve performance at sea-level. Over a 10-day period, elite male triathletes trained for 2 h each day on a cycle ergometer placed in a hypobaric chamber. Training intensity was 60-70% of the heart rate reserve. Eight subjects trained at a simulated altitude of 2.500 m (hypoxia group), the other eight remained at sea-level (sea-level group). Baseline measurements were done on a cycle ergometer at sea-level, which included an incremental test until exhaustion and a Wingate Anaerobic Test. Nine days after training in hypoxia, significant increases were seen in all important parameters of the maximal aerobic as well as the anaerobic test. A significant increase of 7.0% was seen in the mean maximal oxygen uptake per kilogram body weight (VO2max), and the mean maximal power output per kilogram body weight (Wmax) increased significantly by 7.4%. The mean values of both mean power per kilogram body weight and peak power per kilogram body weight increased significantly by 5.0%, and the time-to-peak decreased significantly by 37.7%. In the sea-level group, no significant changes were seen in the abovementioned parameters of both the maximal aerobic and the maximal anaerobic test at the second post-test. The results of this study indicate that intermittent hypobaric training can improve both the aerobic and the anaerobic energy-supply systems.

The above articles do not generally address the practice of hyperventilating before breath holding episodes. This practice actually increases the oxygen saturation and keeps the saturation elevated for prolonged period of up to 2 1/2 minutes. In addition, most articles on hypoxia are studying the effect of prolonged oxygen deprivation, and not the brief episodes experience in shooting sports. Do NOT misunderstand me, Long term -many minutes to hours of hypoxia - can be devastating, and even deadly.

RESPONSE: Thank you for this admission of fact. And, validation of my responses to the occurrences of hypoxia among shooting athletes in training and competitions. The study findings would be of benefit if we all had hypobaric chambers to work with and during competitive training and competitions. Because of the high cost of hypobaric chambers, I am sure we will not see them in the ranges around the country.

I will not bore you with 100s of research articles that do NOT support the theories that have been espoused in this forum. You can find them yourself on MEDLINE researches.

RESPONSE: THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR YOUR CONSIDERATION.

I have provided the above information to reassure all of you that holding your breath while getting the sight picture and the shot off, will NOT harm you if accomplished within the one second time limit, and may not even cause a reduction in shooting accuracy, and will actually improve shooting accuracy. I have NOT provided this information in any attempt to put down or "flame" anyone.

RESPONSE: But you have clearly tried to up hold the NRA point of view and protect the job security of the so call coach and training division of the NRA. However, you have also confirmed my postings for all to see. Sorry you tried so hard but fell flat with Maggie’s drawers. Better luck next time. You have the distinction of continued harm to our young shooter who are being taught the NRA and traditional trail and error method of shooting.

Chet Skinner, Coach and The Wizard of Target Talk.

Be well, shoot straight and often !



Dr. C. M. Bereznoff
Medical Director
Longmont Institute of Integrative Medicine
1304 N. Vivian St.
Longmont, Colorado, USA 80501-3217

[Wizzer]

Chet,

You sorry SOB!

You are changing the words the good doctor wrote to make yourself look good and of course with the intention of making him look like a fool.

You are just a punk bully! Don't try to lie your way out of this one!

Everyone understands you must have the last word and no doubt you will get it again this time, but this is BS!

Come on BIG boy! Stand up like a real man and show us what you got!!

Admit you were wrong to change the words of Dr. Bereznoff. I don't give a flying you know what if you still disagree with him. That is not the point. By your use (misuse really) of scientific research you fraudulently pass yourself of as an "expert." Let me tell you that there are so few people who believe what you say now and all this fraud will now drive the rest of them away.

If you can't admit that you are wrong for changing the words in Dr. Bereznoff's document, then you are a disgrace. You dishonor yourself, the sport, and the country you so loudly proclaim that you served.

So what is it going to be you big bully?

[Elmas]

Anyone with trouble holding his breath for a shot , should think of following the Jack Nicholson way :

To take an Oxygen Cylinder and mask ( small enough to fit into the shooting bag ) to the match .

(( He is known to have a small Oxygen Cylinder with mask on the set , gulping several lungfulls of Oxygen after each action 'shot' ..... One would also assume, knowing him, another Oxygen Cylinder at his bedside . ))

Elmas

.

[Wizard]

OK Wizzer here is your answer.....Check the attachement....
By the way what is your qualifications to weight in on this subject: ?

Mine was attending such training in a flight surgeon class on physicology and involvement is the chamber while experienceing hypoxia nd rapid decompression. Yes I am very knowledgable and I again ask you your qualifications?

[Wizard]

OK Wizzer here is your answer.....Check the attachement....
By the way what is your qualifications to weight in on this subject: ?

Mine was attending such training in a flight surgeon class on physicology and involvement is the chamber while experienceing hypoxia nd rapid decompression. Yes I am very knowledgable and I again ask you your qualifications?

[RobStubbs]

OK Wizzer here is your answer.....Check the attachement....
By the way what is your qualifications to weight in on this subject: ?

Mine was attending such training in a flight surgeon class on physicology and involvement is the chamber while experienceing hypoxia nd rapid decompression. Yes I am very knowledgable and I again ask you your qualifications?

Physicology eh Chet, that's a new one on me. Your obviously weren't paying much attention - assuming you were even there.

Rob.

[mentalcoach]

Thank you Rob. I note you are in England. I was flying out of Mildenhall, UK when I attended the training session and chamber activities in Germany about 1968 or 69. Your comment is not all that welcome but then again maybe.............?

[Richard H]

Chet man if your are going to make stuff up at least learn how to spell the subjects that you are pretending to be an expert in.

[mental coach]

It has been known for many years the human nature is to find fault and you have confirmed this fact. It is natural human nature to find fault and this is an asset for many. This used for object detection and mental measurement during the analysis phase. Many researchers have found it is also the quickest way to aquire attention of many conditions or factors.
It is natural for all humans to find fault and it is used for this purpose of gaining attention and disrupting the status quoa.

See what I mean. Finding fault inhanses and intensifes your egos. :-))


By the way, alll athletes hove only one goal but have many objectives. So when a coach or instructor tell you to make many goals then walk away because to do so will athletically confuse the intrestic part of the athleteltic performance.

[Mental coach]

For those having hard time reading and this is another word = intrinsic

A writter has two choises, underline or other wise make the word very unique. Misspelling falls under the later and is used quite offten to cause attention to a word or phrase, such as I just did with the word 'often'.

This is sometimes used in instructional text to force your attention upon a word or text phrase. The same technique is also used to take control of you mental abilities and force it to follow a precise direction or instructional goal or path. Nothing new in this but maybe you didn't know this simple fact.

[Nicole Hamilton]

A writter has two choises, underline or other wise make the word very unique. Misspelling falls under the later and is used quite offten to cause attention to a word or phrase, such as I just did with the word 'often'.

This is sometimes used in instructional text to force your attention upon a word or text phrase.

This has to be the all-time worst excuse for misspelling ever offered! You really think people will believe this crock?

If you really can't spell, give up on the excuses. Just download the Google toolbar instead; it has a button to spell check anything you type into a form.

[Steve Swartz]

Jeeze Scott, I think we have all had a good enough "Booster Shot" against Chetsteritis by now . . . let's not scare the children too much!

Steve

[pilkguns]

Chet, next post from you I see on here gets on automatic delete. And don't try to fill up my inbox, I have you blocked there.