SHOTS PER GROUP

[BOOKER]

What is the average number of shots per target when practicing?
I did a search and all that I found was someone who shoos like twenty shots in air pistol.
I use to shoot ten shots, but I don't know is it ok, or should I just shoot like three or five.

Thanks for any help

[cdf]

I'm no expert , but a number of good rifle shots I know shoot 3 , with pistol it's more usually 5-10 .

[TWP]

Depends upon the target, distance, and how good you are.

Real good shooters with air rifle or 50' small bore can put 2 shots so close together it's tough to tell they are 2 shots some times.

It depends upon your training regime, sometimes I have the kids shoot groups, usually 3 or 5 shots per target, other times I want them to practice like they would shoot in a match, 1 shot per bull.

[isuguncoach]

Your note didn't explain if you were doing the shooting or you are coaching someone. If you are coaching some one (a new shooter) stress shooting groups. Don't worry so much about where they are, you just want a group. I have them shoot 5 in a target until you can't see the separate bullet holes. Then move to 3 shots per target just because their getting better. Then move the 3 shot group to the center.

If you shooting, you should be able to get feedback from each shot, if you have shot so many that you can't tell where the last one went, you have shot too many on that target.

[Ray Odle]

What's your goal?

When I practice air pistol working on shot execution I will shoot out the center with thirty shots or more. Where the shot goes isn't as important as what the front sight does when the shot fires. The fact that I may be too lazy to walk down range to change the target won't be discussed.

If my goal is to sight in, then that's a different story.

If my goal is to shoot a practice match then five would be my limit because that is the number of shots I fire on a bull at most of my matches.

[RobStubbs]

Shoot as many or as few shots as required depending on your shooting objective in that session. If you are shooting for scores and are a very good shot then 1 per diagram. If not then shoot more.

Rob.

[BOOKER]

Sorry if I wasn't too clear, I'm talking about my practice shots. I shoot air rifle, and I usually make ten shot groups.
Somebody made a good statement that when they are so many shots I really can't tell the sequence of each one.
I think three or five should be more than enough for me.
For the one who asked what's my goal it is just for practicinb.

Thanks for the good feedback.

[Richard H]

Sorry if I wasn't too clear, I'm talking about my practice shots. I shoot air rifle, and I usually make ten shot groups.
Somebody made a good statement that when they are so many shots I really can't tell the sequence of each one.
I think three or five should be more than enough for me.
For the one who asked what's my goal it is just for practicinb.

Thanks for the good feedback.

By goal he meant what are you practicing.

When you train you should have a purpose (unless you are out just to have fun a through lead down range, not that there's anyhting wrong with that).

Examples;

Shooting groups= basically you focus on specific aspects of your shooting ie trigger control, timing, breathing, sights, ect. and you shoot not worrying about the individual shot values, what you are try to do is build consitency and produce the smallest group possible.

Match Practice= simulate a match shoot 40 or 60 shoots plus sighters just as you would at a match. Try to shoot the same number of shoots on a target as you would at the matches you compete at. For pistol to save targets I usually shoot 5 shoots (12 targets) but change targets so I get the same rythm as shooting single shoots on a target.

Then there are variations on all of these such as shooting targets with the centers cut out, shooting blank targets, control targets (different aiming points).

The key is if you want to improve you want to learn something about your shooting so you know what works for you.

[Ray Odle]

My above response is a good example of forgetting where I am at on Target Talk. I shoot smallbore during the summer so maybe my response wasn't totally off the wall.

When building and practicing a position one shouldn't worry about the score. So why worry about the number of shots on an air rifle target?

Take away the spotting scope and set a goal to build a good, legal, consistent position with the endurance to shoot a match. This is over simplistic but a start. Don't forget NPA but that's not the subject of this thread.

[TargetShootingShop.com]

If you are putting them all through one hole 3 per target

If you are putting some through the same hole I'd go 5

If you are putting them all on the black I'd go 10

If you can't get them all on the card the sky's the limit.

[BOOKER]

If you are putting them all through one hole 3 per target

If you are putting some through the same hole I'd go 5

If you are putting them all on the black I'd go 10

If you can't get them all on the card the sky's the limit.

Interesting, according to these "rule of thumb" (to give it a name) I am in number two (putting some through the same hole).

It can't be better, this is my definition of goal:

Shooting groups= basically you focus on specific aspects of your shooting ie trigger control, timing, breathing, sights, ect. and you shoot not worrying about the individual shot values, what you are try to do is build consitency and produce the smallest group possible.

I need another advice since I don't know if this is ok and this is the reason why I started this thread, I am shooting the 10m air pistol targets "without" any insert in the front sight (just the tunnel) and making ten shot groups. In general all ten shots are within the 9 ring, and 4-6 in the same hole.

Do you guys think this is a good practice technique?

BTW I was told to practice like that to focus on the concentricity.

Keep posting, very helpful/interesting.

[RobStubbs]

I need another advice since I don't know if this is ok and this is the reason why I started this thread, I am shooting the 10m air pistol targets "without" any insert in the front sight (just the tunnel) and making ten shot groups. In general all ten shots are within the 9 ring, and 4-6 in the same hole.

Do you guys think this is a good practice technique?

BTW I was told to practice like that to focus on the concentricity.

Keep posting, very helpful/interesting.

To me that doesn't seem to be very good training. You are doing the same thing as you would be with the sight insert in so why not just do that ? Also you are not shooting at your normal sized targets, so I see that exercise to be of minimal benefit personally.

Perhaps of more benefit would be things like dry firing, firing at a white card. And breaking down the shot process into individual elements and training them - for example trigger release etc.

I'm just curious but do you have a coach ?

Rob.

[wrc]

Uhhhh - air PISTOL with a front sight TUNNEL ??? In addition to being posted in the air RIFLE area (thus all the rifle related responses), the bigger question is - by TUNNEL do you mean a front sight like a target rifle would normally have? Aren't these illegal in PISTOL competition?

[wrc]

Uhhhh - air PISTOL with a front sight TUNNEL ??? In addition to being posted in the air RIFLE area (thus all the rifle related responses), the bigger question is - by TUNNEL do you mean a front sight like a target rifle would normally have? Aren't these illegal in PISTOL competition?

Oops - yes, now I've gone back over the replies and realized that you are shooting RIFLE, but at an air pistol target, and without a front sight insert.
Well, I guess for a beginner, it would provide a good holding exercise without getting too hung up about fitting the little ring around the little black dot. But I'd suggest that if you're holding well enough to keep the shots in the black of an air RIFLE target, it is time to put the insert back into the front sight, and practice on air rifle targets for real world experience.

[BOOKER]

Rob:

Thanks for your advice. I don't have a coach, and we don't have any around, so that's why all of my "dummy questions". Having a coach would be of great benefit, I know, but well. I keep reading books, watching videos, and posting in this great forum. In other words I'm learning the long and hard way.

Ok, I will try to explain myself. I just purchased a FWB 700 UNIVERSAL, I waited almost nine months for it to come. I was practicing with a TAU 200 (I think that's the model), and was averaging 480-500 using official 10-meter targets and GAMO pellets (not good I know) before purchasing the rifle.

In the time I was waiting for the FWB I stop practicing with the TAU, that means I did not shot anything in nine months. When I finally got the FWB (it's not even a month old) I started practicing with the 10 meter targets again, but obviously the results where not what I would have expected because of the lack of practice, although ten shot groups where all inside the black.

That's why I decided to practice with the air pistol targets, and I took out the front insert because there was almost no blank space within the sight insert and the bullseye. I am also getting use to the new rifle.

I will follow your advice and go back to the air rifle target to get some "real world experience" as you said.

Thanks to everyone for your advice and keep posting.

[RobStubbs]

I should point out that I am a pistol shooter who rarely shoots rifle. That said training has pretty much the same fundamentals. I would suggest that not shooting whilst waiting for the new gun was perhaps a mistake. You could still have practiced the technical aspects and kept things ticking over and just switched to the new gun.

I would suggest you get the gun set up for yourself as good as you can - perhaps with help from some more experienced rifle shooters. If you're not already a member join USAS and look out for training camps and the like that they run. Learn the proper techniques and try not to get hung up on scores - at this stage proper technique is more important. I would also suggest you enter some competitions when you have got more familiar with the gun and shooting it. That of itself will help you develop more confidence and let you see other shooters at work and give you some pointers.

Do you have the shooting clothing ? Boots, glove, jacket, trousers etc ?

Rob.

[BOOKER]

I stop practicing with the TAU because it was not mine, and the owner sold it to another guy. The other rifle that I have is a GAMO and that is just a springer, nothing near a match grade gun.

I am not from USA, I am from Panama and we don't have air rifle shooters around but we have air pistol shooters that have shot in the olympics.

I only have a glove, I will be ordering the jacket within a month, I will try to have the trouser and shoes as soon as possible.

It is very difficult to find match grade equipment around, it is almos impossible to find match grade pellets.

As you can see things are not that easy for me.

[RobStubbs]

If you can do it get fitted properly for all your clothing. I suspect that too isn't easy but it will be worth it in the long run.

If you have trouble finding rifle shooters or coaches then get what you can from the internet. I assume you have a national shooting association that you can join ? Do that and see what help they can offer you. Most nations have various schemes and run coaching/training camps and in my experience, rifle appears better served than pistol.

Keep us posted on how it goes,

Rob.

[BOOKER]

Well after a month of shooting the air pistol targets without front insert, then with the 4.6 front insert, today I switch to the air rifle targets.

I did 5 shot on each target as TargetShootingShop.com suggested, and was trying different apperture sizes. I tried with 4.6, 4.4 and 4.2, I felt very comfortable with the 4.4 aperture size.

Thanks for your support