free pistol grip

[Nano]

free pistol grip:

Wy nobody has invented a grip to inflate?
Like some reebok shoes, in those that can fill out with a simple pump, to put on shoes perfectly to the foot, somebody would owe to invent a bag of plastic that is placed in the grip of the free pistol and fill out with a small finger pump, these would put so perfectly to the hand that you don't need to work in the grip, we would surely have to buy a grip one measure more big of the one that we use and we put him the bag of air, inflating to what each shooters requires.
is a good idea, or it is not it?

Nano

[Bill Poole]

Then you would have a bouncy flexible pillow in your hand.... if that was desireable, then the top shooters would have been using rubber grips for decades.

I think hard rigid material is what is found to work best

Poole
http://arizona.rifleshooting.com/

[Nano]

Bill Poole:

Good Point!
But, I think you grip the pistol, only with the palm of the hand, the external part of the hand could be helped with the air bag, I am changing the original idea, leaving the part of the grip in contact with the hand palm in wood (hard rigid material).

What do you think?

Nano

[Benjamin]

somebody would owe to invent a bag of plastic that is placed in the grip of the free pistol and fill out with a small finger pump, these would put so perfectly to the hand that you don't need to work in the grip

You can do something similar with a bag of epoxy. Mix the epoxy, put some on the grip, cover it with a sheet of plastic, put your hand around it, and the epoxy will mold to fit your hand. Then let go and wait for it to get hard.

Actually, I get better results by adding a little epoxy and other materials wherever I think I need better contact with my hand. I like having a rough surface where I need friction to make holding the grip easier, and either real leather or soft felt in other areas. Both these are available as shoe supplies; the leather is a replacement innersole, the felt is for callous relief. The shoe supplies can easily be stuck on and peeled off until it is confortable. You can also glue things on with rubber cement, which can be peeled off as often as you like without damaging the wood.

[marcialvs]

WHY DONT INVENT A FREE PISTOL THAT SHOT 582 PIONT OF 600 IS BETER THAN INFLATE GRIP ISN`T ?, I THINK THE MOST IMPORTANT IN FREE PISTOL IS IN 90% MENTAL PART. VERY MUCH PEOPLE THINK ABOUT RUSIAN TECNIQUE, AMERICAN TECNIQUE, ABOUT BETTER AMMO, ABOUT BETTER PISTOL, ELECT. TRIGEER, MECANIC TRIGEER, BUT AFTER YEARS AND YEARS OLIMPIC RECORD OF 581 SET IN 1980 IN MOSCOW 80(25 YEARS AGO, IS A LOT, OR NOT ?) BY ALEXANDER MELENTIEVE, NOBODY CAN BRAKE IT, WHY ? BECAUSE WE ARE THINKING IN OPOSITE DIRECCTION TO GROW IN FREE PISTO, MOST IMPORTANT IN FREE PISTOL IS MENTAL ASPECT. I HAVE A SERIOUS QUESTION, REALY ALEXANDEL MELENTIEV SET A RECORD OF 581 IN FREE PISTOL OR WAS A CHEAT OF SOVIETS (REMEMBER IN THAT TIME THE COLD WAR) TO "DEMOSTRATE SUPERIORITY OF COMUNISM IN OLIMPICS GAMES, IN WORLD.

MARCIALVS@HOTMAIL.COM

[Dave1]

Nano,
I think your idea is crazy man.

Stick with Bill Pooles advice.
For rigidity and repeatability, you neeed some firm points of reference for a solid foundation.
Soft and bouncy may feel nice, but has no stability.
Give me uncomfortable but positive over soft and spongy every time (Grips only mind you!!!)

The pillow idea won't cut the mustard, or Hot Dog.

[Fred Mannis]

I HAVE A SERIOUS QUESTION, REALY ALEXANDEL MELENTIEV SET A RECORD OF 581 IN FREE PISTOL OR WAS A CHEAT OF SOVIETS (REMEMBER IN THAT TIME THE COLD WAR) TO "DEMOSTRATE SUPERIORITY OF COMUNISM IN OLIMPICS GAMES, IN WORLD.

MARCIALVS@HOTMAIL.COM

Why do you think that Melentiev's score was not legitimate?

[Brian Zins]

Pleaseo not make accusations about cheating unless there is corroborating evidence. The man was on that day and that's all there is to it. As for the grip yes the inflatable idea is out of the box and great ideas come from thinking out of the box but this one can get circular filed. The best grip I have seen for a free pistol has got to be the Rink Formgrif free pistol grip.

[Mike T.]

Nano's idea could be pursued in a slightly different direction. Instead of inflating with air, use one of those Bismuth alloys that melts at the temperature of hot water. Pump in the hot liquid metal and let it cool. Voila! A rigid, conforming grip.
Might not hold up on a summer day in Arizona though :-(

[aurorapolice02_11]

I see no problem with the current grips being used, just ask the top shooters. Keep this in mind as well, if you give everyone a new upgrade to equipment that will make you shoot better, everyone will have that same equipment. So once again you will have the top shooter at top and the novice shooters below. It all comes down to training. A shooter who does not train will not surpass a shooter willing to train.

Quit looking for quick fixes to a lack of training.

Mike Douglass

[Truck]

Try to bring a grip like this thing to the WC.
http://i.cnn.net/cnn/2004/HEALTH/01/08/ ... plants.jpg

[Laszlo]

I HAVE A SERIOUS QUESTION, REALY ALEXANDEL MELENTIEV SET A RECORD OF 581 IN FREE PISTOL OR WAS A CHEAT OF SOVIETS (REMEMBER IN THAT TIME THE COLD WAR) TO "DEMOSTRATE SUPERIORITY OF COMUNISM IN OLIMPICS GAMES, IN WORLD.

MARCIALVS@HOTMAIL.COM

Why do you think that Melentiev's score was not legitimate?

Though there is NO evidence to indicate that his WR is not legitimate, I know that some in Central and Eastern Europe believe that Melentiev's score could have been drug assisted (i.e. the possible use of beta blockers). I would like to think this is not the case. However people whom I have spoken to in Eastern Europe (incl the former East Germany) will readily tell you that many of their athletes at the Montreal and Moscow games were pumped full of drugs. The use of drugs by athletes (particulary by East Germany and Russia) from the 1960's to the 1980's has also been well documented in mainstream media. However out of the thousands of athletes that were tested for drugs at the Moscow games, NOT ONE returned a positive result.

[Mikey]

Regarding the Free Pistol WR someone I know told me recently that

"Those were different days back then"

It doesn't answer any questions but makes for a nice way to sum it up, and you can make of it what you want.

The way I see it is that we will never know and really does it matter, there is no reason it can't be bettered.

Mikey

[David Levene]

I HAVE A SERIOUS QUESTION, REALY ALEXANDEL MELENTIEV SET A RECORD OF 581 IN FREE PISTOL OR WAS A CHEAT OF SOVIETS (REMEMBER IN THAT TIME THE COLD WAR) TO "DEMOSTRATE SUPERIORITY OF COMUNISM IN OLIMPICS GAMES, IN WORLD.

MARCIALVS@HOTMAIL.COM

Why do you think that Melentiev's score was not legitimate?

It is too easy to suggest that long standing records must be the result of underhand ilegal practices.

Was Buljung's 22 year old Standard Pistol record dubious? How about Pyzhianov's 16 year old Air Pistol record. Of course not.

Like Melentiev's record they were shot by extremely talented, well drilled competitors who had a good day.

I am not naive enough to think that drugs have never been used in shooting, I know for a fact that they have. Without absolute proof of a specific case however I would never dream of casting a slur on anyone's reputation or their achievements.

[Brian Zins]

Well put Dave. And like Mikey said there is no reason the record cannot be beat.

[Raymond Odle]

I understand that drugs can help in muscle sports, but I would think it would be difficult for the drugged mind or body to excel in in the very difficult sport of international pistol.

Am I naive?

[David Levene]

I understand that drugs can help in muscle sports, but I would think it would be difficult for the drugged mind or body to excel in in the very difficult sport of international pistol.

I know that their are differing opinions on their effectiveness but, whilst it is possible to obtain a Therapeutic Use Exemption (TUE) for many drugs if you can convince enough doctors that you need them, there is no way that you would get one for the use of Beta-Blockers in shooting.

Under WADA (World Anti-Doping Agency) rules, although several sports ban Beta-Blockers in competition, Shooting, Archery and the shooting parts of Modern Pentathlon also ban them out of competition.

[marcialvs]

Hello, Fred Mannis, and all here, is a pleasure to me talk about Olympic Free Pistol, I want to answer your question about why I think, I suggest, and why I have a presumption of score 581, fixed by Aleander Melentieve in Olympics Games in Moscow `80 is something to think and analysing, we are in talk forum where all give ours opinions to share together.

When I said it, I was thinking in “loud voice” about a presumption in my mind, which I wanted to share to all people here in this talk forum who`s love Shooting Free Pistol, is Not an accusation as Brian Zins said in this forum, I m a Free Pistol Shooter 10 years ago, and I really know what`s Free Pistol Olympic Event means. In International Law the “Presumption” is a valid probation of evidence, but I don’t want that, I only want to share something that grow up in my mind about something what I, and very much people are interested, and do with passion and courage: Shooting Free Pistol.

I don’t think about drug assist in him, like said Laszlo and Raymond Odle (who I think is right in his opinion) in this talk forum, but could be the case, remember what said a soccer player Diego Armando Maradona “…people say I became that I was playing soccer in world, due cocaine consumption, people is wrong because this drug in this specific sport is the worst thing you can use for that.” In case of pistol shooters is the same case, here body is not most important because just a shooter needs a technique to shot, technique is the manner to do some thing, and to do something, we have millions of manners to do this; for that use your own and personal technique, everybody are physical different. Shoot is in a high percent a mental sport (mental game), I mean, playing in who controls body actions in shooting, your body or your mind, best shooter almost never is the strongest, the highest, the smartest, to me best shooter is who really want to be the best and make it possible by training, who never give up, who knows how to learn to shot, to think correctly, to take control of about what are you thinking in precise moment of make your shot, of pulling your trigger and what you are watching in this precise moment of every single shot, if you have hear what say Lanny Bassham (Gold Olympic Champion in Montreal Canada in 1976 and two time World Champion) you can understand me about what im talking about.

Not either I refer to bettered or not 581/600 score, as opinion of Mikel said, all is possible for humans, secret is in how, not in if we can or we can not. In 1995, Taniu Kiriakov of Bulgaria, back in the 580`s with a 580 preliminary at the UIT World Cup celebrated in Hiroshima Japan.

I suggest, like David Levene said. A presumption about if really happened that all people thinks and knows happened in Olympics Games of Moscow in Free Pistol Event, I want to said “it was too much 580/600” for this specific time, in this specific place, in that specific Olympics Games.

I thinking about a few important things to found my presumption, in first place:
The specific historical moment that world have had in this time, “The Cold War”. Everybody knew, what represent being in first place of medallist list at moment Olympics Games ends in Moscow `80. ¿ Who was the first Free Pistol Gold Medallist in Olympics Games of Athenas 1896 ?, I said “the first”, nobody are interested in who was “the second”, ¿ Who was the first in travel or orbit in space, ¿ Who was the first in put a step in the moon ?, ¿ Of who was in past “The Queen” ? (Free Pistol event is denominated Queen of all events in Olympic Shooting, it was first pistol event and never had have changes since 1896 , (who shot Free Pistol know why), since 1946 to 1989 always the answer in world for that questions were: An American, A Sovietic, An American, A Sovietic.

Shooting sport is an martial aspect of war. ¿ Which other olympic sport have it, a martial aspect. Is same thing today, what significance to all the world had been China first medallist place in Olympics Games Athenas in 2004, in past it was used to speculate, today is a reality, all the “Cold War” was a world speculation between two countries. Today we are not only living in Globalizated world, we are living in a Globalichainesse world, just wait for Bejing 2008, they will show to the world who is China today.

In second place, if we are talking about a specific event of Free Pistol, and talking about Alexander Melentieve, we can not talk about “extremely talent” to do 581/600 like said David Levene in this talk forum, because real talent in a person to do something is permanent, or at least is for a period of time; who was Alexander Melentieve (like a international and “Elite” shooter, of course.) before and after Moscow 80, he never won in Free Pistol other medal (gold, silver or bronze) in Olympics Games before, not either after. He never won a Free Pistol World Championship before, not either after, which were his scoring during his international events ?. Take in consideration how have been developed Free Pistol scorings through history of Free Pistol Olympics Games event, we start in Athenas 1896 scoring of 442/600 by Pain Sumner from USA who won firs Gold Medal in Free Pistol event. If we put Moscow `80, between ten Olympics Games, I mean 5 Olympics Games before and 5 Olympics Games after Moscow ´80 and we take average of scoring shooters level humility (only gold medallist) we can find average of 564/600 (not decimal and preliminary event scoring) before Moscow `80, and average of 567/600 after Moscow `80, here line of growing in scoring is nomal, how someone shooter could shot 581/600 from night to morning, without previously high international ranking or presence in scoring list like 580’s/600, we have an anormal statistics. Some people think about it happened to him: (like a David Levene opinions) “it was his day”, “he had a good day”, “he was inspired”, in my opinion this kind of things not really happen to a Olympic shooter, in reality Olympic Shooting go beyond of subjective and dogmatic things. I training in my shooting club to shot well, I not pray to shoot well or wait for my great day or moment. Let me make a comparison between Alexande Melentieve like a really and extremely talent of all times in Free Pistol shooter: Ragnar Skanaker from Sweden, he was in an international activity for more than 20 years shooting average scoring in his carer of 565/600, in 4 Olympics Games, Munich 1972 567/600 Gold Medallist, L.A. 1984 565/600 Silver Medallist, Seoul 1988 564/600 Silver Medallist, Barcelona 1992 566/600 Bronze Medallist.

I wrote this to share my own opinion about 581/600, not to make an acusation.

The first pistol event in the world championships was the free pistol that was established in 1900. Throughout it’s long history the free pistol target is only one of two targets that has never been change except for the addition of an "X" ring.

marcialvs@hotmail.com

[David Levene]

Although you state that you are not making an accusation about Melentiev's record, you are clearly casting a slur on it based on no firm evidence whatsoever.

You are also suggesting that he was something less than a top class elite shooter. He was of course a member of the Russian Standard Pistol team at the European Championships in Osijek in 1985 when they set the current World Team Record.

It is by no means unusual for a shooter to set a personal best at a major championships.

[marcialvs]

Thanks David for your reply.