New Clothing Testing Procedures

David Levene · Post by **David Levene** » Mon Jan 24, 2005 1:03 pm

If you are interested, an explanation of the new procedures is available.

Sparks · Post by **Sparks** » Mon Jan 24, 2005 1:15 pm

This came up a lot in the judges course last weekend in Bisley. There's a serious crackdown coming up on the Equipment Control side of things in the next few years, mainly because people have taken the "pushing the envelope" mindset right over into "silly buggers" territory.

deleted1 · Post by **deleted1** » Mon Jan 24, 2005 3:58 pm

This is a very interesting post David. It makes me think that all was not exactly "kosher" as far as the clothing "problem." A few months back we were in the midst of a controversy (feud) regarding the future of the clothing shooting commercial venture. It seemed that there was going to be a "come to jesus" meeting of sorts and the true facts regarding these pants and jackets which are a part of an actual firearm support system was going to be in the open, as it were. This is what I have felt and have been an opponent of for many a year---especially as an intercollegiate coach facing this problem. Then after the original furor died down, we then heard from the "manufacturers" vehemently crying their opposition to the proposed rulings. I think it is way past the time to have eliminated these forms of "shooting clothing" from the rules and returning to a more sane and sensible approach to rifle competition. Now this "new approach" on the part of the ISSF seems to be a move towards really policing the issue and let's hope it's not their new approach to winking at it. There is an old Sicilian proverb that translates " the fish stinks from the head."

Sparks · Post by **Sparks** » Mon Jan 24, 2005 5:28 pm

There was an ISSF judges' course held last weekend in Bisley Camp in the UK Bob, which was the first course that dealt with these new rules. From what we learnt there, I'd have to say that the opposition to the shooting clothing coming from the top was based not so much on what we'd consider to be fair clothing rules, but on clothing that was wildly outside the definition of "fair" - there were incidents cited regarding many shooters especially those using clothing from one particular manufacturer, and from the description of what was happening, I can see why they'd have wanted to do something - though I don't think they picked the right thing to do.

deleted1 · Post by **deleted1** » Mon Jan 24, 2005 6:35 pm

Sparks, in my favorite country---dear Old Ireland---I will return again this coming May for a 2 week stint and I am jumping in my skin at the thought. I hear what you are saying and I can merely state that the current crop of clothing from one manufacturer ( I shall not openly name) I have watched intercollegiate competitors trying to walk in those pants to shoot AP or Offhand smallbore---the jackets are like corsets without the stays---or maybe they are in those jackets as well???? It takes a good ten minutes for these shooter to get in and out of these straight jackets & cement overalls---tell me those aren't a support for the shooter and his/her rifle. I once challenged a coach (personal friend) to shoot his team in standard jackets and no pants---I cannot tell you how much lower his team score was in comparison with their team record. This was a friendly no score reported match---but it proved my point. I think I have said too much already and will bear the "slings and arrows of outraged shooter." We will hear stories about bad backs and aching muscles and how this enables people to shoot compeititvely because it helps their "posture."---IMHO hogwash---if I were dependent on my team scores to maintain my employment ( I am retired) I might choose anything that would help to insure my tenure---that's all the rhetoric is about. I remember the days of the leather shooting coats (1950's+) the (CCCP) Soviet Union and Bloc countries brought on the scene. It became a big hit here in the USA and we all had to have the leather coat---then the US Army ski boots for kneeling and offhand shooting. And boy did it blossom from there, and for what purpose SUPPORT. Sleep tight

Sparks · Post by **Sparks** » Mon Jan 24, 2005 7:04 pm

Bob Riegl wrote:Sparks, in my favorite country---dear Old Ireland---I will return again this coming May for a 2 week stint and I am jumping in my skin at the thought.

Well, we'll have to get you to come out to a club and show you round so!

tell me those aren't a support for the shooter and his/her rifle.

I'm not trying to - if this is the manufacturer we were being told about, they were well past the point where the gear stops being a preventative against chronic injury and starts being a rifle rest shaped like clothing!

But that doesn't mean that you should be taking a 15-year-old shooter and have him shoot with his spine supporting an offset assymetric 8.5kg load when the spine's twisted in three dimensions. It's just not a good idea, and I wouldn't do it with any of the juniors I've trained. We've had to train some in air rifle without the trousers before and we've had some people (myself included) develop some problems - I've got a severed dermatrope as a result of a bad position that trousers would probably have prevented. But there's a difference between stabilising your spine and being a rifle rest!