Shooters:
I've decided to retire my S&W model 52 in favor of a match quality revolover to shoot the centerfire event. I am considering buying a Colt Python Elite w\6 inch barrel.
Yesterday, I discovered that a fellow shooter has an older Python which has never been fired and wants to sell.
My questions are:
1. What are your impressions of the performance of either the new Elite or the older version Pythons for center fire? How about revolvers in general?
2. What differences, if any, are there between the newer and older Pythons that may be relevant to the center fire discipline?
3. What's a good price for the older model, new in box.
The new Python Elite sells for between $975 and $1050 USD
Thank you and good shooting to all.
F. Paul Figlia
paul@figlialaw.com
paul-at-figlialaw.com.47249.0
Colt Python for Centerfire event
Moderators: rexifelis, pilkguns
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Lee Fisher
Re: Colt Python for Centerfire event
Pythons are very nice revolvers. However, I've found that they are somewhat delicate and tend to go out of time rather easily. They are also not easy to work on yourself because of the way the actions are tuned. They also might be a bit harder to find target grips for, and since they are chambered for .357, accuracy with .38 spl wadcutters might suffer.
If you want to stay with 38 caliber, I would recommend you look for a S&W model 14/K38. Every now and then you can find a factory single action only model, which would be ideal. Most of the model 14's I've handled have a very nice single action letoff right out of the box. Parts and grips are more plentiful. Best of all, they're accurate as heck.
If you have the money, go to a 32 S&W wadcutter revolver (not the newer S&W model 16 chambered for 32 mag for the same issue noted above).
hlf_jr-at-hotmail.com.47255.47249
If you want to stay with 38 caliber, I would recommend you look for a S&W model 14/K38. Every now and then you can find a factory single action only model, which would be ideal. Most of the model 14's I've handled have a very nice single action letoff right out of the box. Parts and grips are more plentiful. Best of all, they're accurate as heck.
If you have the money, go to a 32 S&W wadcutter revolver (not the newer S&W model 16 chambered for 32 mag for the same issue noted above).
hlf_jr-at-hotmail.com.47255.47249
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Rob
Re: Colt Python for Centerfire event
Colt made a Python in 38spl. but only in a 8in. barrel. I never figured that one out. The biggest improvement for the revolver for Int. events is the grips. Of all the different guns and grips I have the Morini's on my Model 14 feel the best. I also shot my only 100 slow fire with the revolver. The older Python with Nill grips would make classy rig. My point ave. between the model 52 and the revolver were about the same.
rdnault851-at-msn.com.47258.47249
rdnault851-at-msn.com.47258.47249
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David M
Re: Colt Python vs Smith K.38
I agree, you would be better off with a old K 38 model 14.
It is a better action and is 38 special not .357 Mag (for centrefire comp we need every little bit of advantage we can get)
Fit a Model 14 with a single action target hammer/trigger,fit a Millet sight and a partridge foresight and either a Morini or Nill grip and you have a good C/F pistol.
Better is the French Manurhin MR 73 Match in either .38 special or .32 S&W Long. Or if money is no object how about a Korth from Gremany.
.47274.47255
It is a better action and is 38 special not .357 Mag (for centrefire comp we need every little bit of advantage we can get)
Fit a Model 14 with a single action target hammer/trigger,fit a Millet sight and a partridge foresight and either a Morini or Nill grip and you have a good C/F pistol.
Better is the French Manurhin MR 73 Match in either .38 special or .32 S&W Long. Or if money is no object how about a Korth from Gremany.
.47274.47255
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Paul
Re: Colt Python vs Smith K.38
David M wrote:
<<It (model 14) is a better action and is 38 special not .357 Mag (for centrefire comp we need every little bit of advantage we can get)>>
DavidM,
Please explain what advantage you perceive in a revolver chambered strictly for .38 spl over one chambered for the .357 mag??
Paul
: I agree, you would be better off with a old K 38 model 14.
: It is a better action and is 38 special not .357 Mag (for centrefire comp we need every little bit of advantage we can get)
: Fit a Model 14 with a single action target hammer/trigger,fit a Millet sight and a partridge foresight and either a Morini or Nill grip and you have a good C/F pistol.
: Better is the French Manurhin MR 73 Match in either .38 special or .32 S&W Long. Or if money is no object how about a Korth from Gremany.
paul-at-figlialaw.com.47286.47274
<<It (model 14) is a better action and is 38 special not .357 Mag (for centrefire comp we need every little bit of advantage we can get)>>
DavidM,
Please explain what advantage you perceive in a revolver chambered strictly for .38 spl over one chambered for the .357 mag??
Paul
: I agree, you would be better off with a old K 38 model 14.
: It is a better action and is 38 special not .357 Mag (for centrefire comp we need every little bit of advantage we can get)
: Fit a Model 14 with a single action target hammer/trigger,fit a Millet sight and a partridge foresight and either a Morini or Nill grip and you have a good C/F pistol.
: Better is the French Manurhin MR 73 Match in either .38 special or .32 S&W Long. Or if money is no object how about a Korth from Gremany.
paul-at-figlialaw.com.47286.47274
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Lee Fisher
Re: Colt Python vs Smith K.38
: David M wrote:
: <<It (model 14) is a better action and is 38 special not .357 Mag (for centrefire comp we need every little bit of advantage we can get)>>
: DavidM,
: Please explain what advantage you perceive in a revolver chambered strictly for .38 spl over one chambered for the .357 mag??
:
: Paul
A 38 spl bullet has a longer free bore transition to make in a .357 mag cylinder. This distance is increased with the full wadcutter bullet typically used for target shooting.
Lee
hlf_jr-at-hotmail.com.47288.47286
: <<It (model 14) is a better action and is 38 special not .357 Mag (for centrefire comp we need every little bit of advantage we can get)>>
: DavidM,
: Please explain what advantage you perceive in a revolver chambered strictly for .38 spl over one chambered for the .357 mag??
:
: Paul
A 38 spl bullet has a longer free bore transition to make in a .357 mag cylinder. This distance is increased with the full wadcutter bullet typically used for target shooting.
Lee
hlf_jr-at-hotmail.com.47288.47286
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Paul
Re: Colt Python vs Smith K.38
Of course you are right Lee.
But, isnt that why centerfire shooters using a gun chambered for the .357 mag use the longer .357 mag case to load the .38 spl wadcutter loads?
My personal preference for the heavier magnum frames is that they significantly reduce felt recoil and as such are far more pleasant for me to shoot.
Although I suppose I just crossed the line into personal preferences at this point.
Thanks to all of you folks for your replies and suggestions!!
Paul
: :
: : Paul
: A 38 spl bullet has a longer free bore transition to make in a .357 mag cylinder. This distance is increased with the full wadcutter bullet typically used for target shooting.
: Lee
paul-at-figlialaw.com.47291.47288
But, isnt that why centerfire shooters using a gun chambered for the .357 mag use the longer .357 mag case to load the .38 spl wadcutter loads?
My personal preference for the heavier magnum frames is that they significantly reduce felt recoil and as such are far more pleasant for me to shoot.
Although I suppose I just crossed the line into personal preferences at this point.
Thanks to all of you folks for your replies and suggestions!!
Paul
: :
: : Paul
: A 38 spl bullet has a longer free bore transition to make in a .357 mag cylinder. This distance is increased with the full wadcutter bullet typically used for target shooting.
: Lee
paul-at-figlialaw.com.47291.47288
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DelMar
Re: Colt Python vs Smith K.38
Hey Paul all the folks here had giving you the best advice. The reason revolvers are not popular any more for centerfire events is because pistols are more accurate, but if you have to have a revolver in a resonable cost frame, the best choice in America is a Model 14 with Morinigrips, but if you still disregard all the advice and stay with your original personal preference, why not doing it from the begining and stop wasting others time.
.47299.47291
.47299.47291
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R.M.
Some people have such a way with words!!!!!
: Hey Paul all the folks here had giving you the best advice. The reason revolvers are not popular any more for centerfire events is because pistols are more accurate, but if you have to have a revolver in a resonable cost frame, the best choice in America is a Model 14 with Morinigrips, but if you still disregard all the advice and stay with your original personal preference, why not doing it from the begining and stop wasting others time.
.47300.47299
.47300.47299
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Paul
My Regrets re: wasting time
DelMar wrote
<< Hey Paul all the folks here had giving you the best advice. . . stop wasting others time.>>
I regret that you feel our exchange of ideas following my question was a waste of your time.
If it makes you feel any better, the great advice I received from the more experienced will weigh heavily into my ultimate decision.
With that said, I will also understand completely if you never open another message I ever post to the list.
Have a HAPPY and safe New Year
Paul
: Hey Paul all the folks here had giving you the best advice. The reason revolvers are not popular any more for centerfire events is because pistols are more accurate, but if you have to have a revolver in a resonable cost frame, the best choice in America is a Model 14 with Morinigrips, but if you still disregard all the advice and stay with your original personal preference,
paul-at-figlialaw.com.47305.47299
<< Hey Paul all the folks here had giving you the best advice. . . stop wasting others time.>>
I regret that you feel our exchange of ideas following my question was a waste of your time.
If it makes you feel any better, the great advice I received from the more experienced will weigh heavily into my ultimate decision.
With that said, I will also understand completely if you never open another message I ever post to the list.
Have a HAPPY and safe New Year
Paul
: Hey Paul all the folks here had giving you the best advice. The reason revolvers are not popular any more for centerfire events is because pistols are more accurate, but if you have to have a revolver in a resonable cost frame, the best choice in America is a Model 14 with Morinigrips, but if you still disregard all the advice and stay with your original personal preference,
paul-at-figlialaw.com.47305.47299
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Jack
Re: Colt Python vs Smith K.38
: [snip]".......The reason revolvers are not popular any more for centerfire events is because pistols are more accurate, ."
Oh how I disagree with this claim.
The best 50 yard shooting pistol I ever fired, and I have fired a lot of them, was a Colt Officers Model 38. Other revolvers, both Colt and Smith have been very accurate. I feel I can shoot with irons still at 54 years equal or better revolver Slowfires than with the dot sighted bullseye pistol. (when conditions and my performance are on track that is :)
Now to Paul F. Counselor, if that older Python is indeed in great shape and you do not find the lugged barrel too heavy. BUY IT! I would suggest asking Randall Fung to make a set of grips for it. However a good 6" S&W K38 is hard to beat. I presently use a 1953 made K38 6" fully equipped target revolver with Fung grips. Another good choice would be the 45 Auto Rim Model 1955 (25-2) revolver, especially if you prefer it's weight and stoutness. Not long ago I fire some impressive tests at 50 yds with 200 gr Hornady JSWC in my 45 revolver.
hamden106-at-yahoo.com.47313.47299
Oh how I disagree with this claim.
The best 50 yard shooting pistol I ever fired, and I have fired a lot of them, was a Colt Officers Model 38. Other revolvers, both Colt and Smith have been very accurate. I feel I can shoot with irons still at 54 years equal or better revolver Slowfires than with the dot sighted bullseye pistol. (when conditions and my performance are on track that is :)
Now to Paul F. Counselor, if that older Python is indeed in great shape and you do not find the lugged barrel too heavy. BUY IT! I would suggest asking Randall Fung to make a set of grips for it. However a good 6" S&W K38 is hard to beat. I presently use a 1953 made K38 6" fully equipped target revolver with Fung grips. Another good choice would be the 45 Auto Rim Model 1955 (25-2) revolver, especially if you prefer it's weight and stoutness. Not long ago I fire some impressive tests at 50 yds with 200 gr Hornady JSWC in my 45 revolver.
hamden106-at-yahoo.com.47313.47299
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Spencer C
don't let the ******s grind you down!
Paul wrote:
I regret that you feel our exchange of ideas following my question was a waste of your time. If it makes you feel any better, the great advice I received from the more experienced will weigh heavily into my ultimate decision. With that said, I will also understand completely if you never open another message I ever post to the list.
Spencer comments:
There are always a few grouches around, but if you have a genuine question then ask it (there aren't many stupid questions, only stupid answers).
Look back over the responses and you will find that your initial question generated a lot of helpful comment.
.47323.47305
I regret that you feel our exchange of ideas following my question was a waste of your time. If it makes you feel any better, the great advice I received from the more experienced will weigh heavily into my ultimate decision. With that said, I will also understand completely if you never open another message I ever post to the list.
Spencer comments:
There are always a few grouches around, but if you have a genuine question then ask it (there aren't many stupid questions, only stupid answers).
Look back over the responses and you will find that your initial question generated a lot of helpful comment.
.47323.47305
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Chris L in NC
Is a full wadcutter in a .357 case legal for ISSF CF?
: Of course you are right Lee.
: But, isnt that why centerfire shooters using a gun chambered for the .357 mag use the longer .357 mag case to load the .38 spl wadcutter loads?
Would this be considered a violation of the rule against "Magnum ammunition"? I would think NOT, but you never know what illogic lurks in the minds of some officials.
chrisatty-at-hotmail.com.47365.47291
: But, isnt that why centerfire shooters using a gun chambered for the .357 mag use the longer .357 mag case to load the .38 spl wadcutter loads?
Would this be considered a violation of the rule against "Magnum ammunition"? I would think NOT, but you never know what illogic lurks in the minds of some officials.
chrisatty-at-hotmail.com.47365.47291
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Spencer C
It's magnum loads that are not allowed, not magnum calibres
8.4.3.4 Center Fire Pistol
Any Center Fire Pistol except single shot of caliber 7.62 mm to 9.65 mm (.30” - .38”). For safety reasons high power type “magnum” ammunition is not allowed.
No 'illogic' involved, just a desire to protect the range, target equipment and the hearing of the officials, other competitors and spectators.
.47385.47365
Any Center Fire Pistol except single shot of caliber 7.62 mm to 9.65 mm (.30” - .38”). For safety reasons high power type “magnum” ammunition is not allowed.
No 'illogic' involved, just a desire to protect the range, target equipment and the hearing of the officials, other competitors and spectators.
.47385.47365
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Paul
Re: Is a full wadcutter in a .357 case legal for ISSF CF?
Very good point Chris - I will have to research that.
Thanks
: Would this be considered a violation of the rule against "Magnum ammunition"? I would think NOT, but you never know what illogic lurks in the minds of some officials.
paul-at-figlialaw.com.47519.47365
Thanks
: Would this be considered a violation of the rule against "Magnum ammunition"? I would think NOT, but you never know what illogic lurks in the minds of some officials.
paul-at-figlialaw.com.47519.47365