Mr X is reluctant to shoot a match

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Air Pistol Match Organize

Mr X is reluctant to shoot a match

Post by Air Pistol Match Organize »

Hello fellow air pistol shooter. I'm organizing a match and someone new to the game just sent me the following e-mail (doctored to keep everyone anonymous.) The issue is that he's just started shooting and appears to be unhappy with his initial progress (sound familiar?). So unhappy, in fact, that he doubts he should shoot in an upcoming organized match. My response follows. I'd like your opinion on this. Thanks.
Mr X's e-mail
So what's a really bad score for someone, 'cuz if I can't even come close to scoring that I should probably just stay at home!
This is my response:
Most of the scores that are shot in the local matches are in the 490 to 550 range (out of a possible 600). But it's important to ignore this and just shoot. When I started the main challenge was to hit the target. After I could keep my shots on the paper, then I started to think about score. At my first match I was more nervous about how to get through the match according to the rules and on time to worry about the quality of my shooting. It's just part of the process.
.44062.0
Mr. Blank

Re: Mr X is reluctant to shoot a match

Post by Mr. Blank »

The Mr.X is lucky, and should not miss the opportunity. Competing against people who's skill level is significantly greater than yours provides experience that is hard to come by, as opposed to competing against opponents of your level or below. That can be generalized to any game/sport, not just shooting.
Of course, there is anxiety about being the worst, but I'm sure he'll get nothing but mad props from other competitors for not being afraid to enter the competition against higher-skilled opponents. It is also an opportunity to overcome your insecurities and anxieties.
But then of course - what the hell do *I* know?
.44065.44062
Colonel Mustard

Re: Mr X is reluctant to shoot a match

Post by Colonel Mustard »

: The Mr.X is lucky, and should not miss the opportunity. Competing against people who's skill level is significantly greater than yours provides experience that is hard to come by, as opposed to competing against opponents of your level or below.
===========
Couldn't agree more. When I bought my first AP just a couple of months after starting pistol shooting, I was essentially the only person in my club shooting AP. The club had installed AP target runners, but all the other club members were only interested in shooting cartridge pistols. Never less, I would go down to the club about twice a week to train alone and to teach myself. Despite my efforts, I never once had anyone to shoot against or to instruct me, but I still enjoyed it. About 5 months later I heard about a regional "open championship" competition that was going to be held in a city about 200 miles away. Deciding that I would enter, I started shooting a few practice 60 shot matches my myself, getting into the early 550's - something that I was plesantly surprised with. With great excitement and anticipation I entered the competition, drove up to the city to stay the weekend, went to the hosting club, and started shooting the AP match. Having never once had anyone stand next to me also shooting an AP, as soon as I stood up to the firing line, my body was completely flooded with adrenalin and nervous tension. My pulse was racing and my shirt was soaked with sweat. My scores (and ego) fell to pieces.
I would have LOVED to have someone else to shoot with for all those months, and I firmly believe that things would not have gone so badly for me had I had more experience shooting against others. It took a long time for my self confidence to return. Encourage Mr X to come along - no matter how badly he feels about his scores. Even better, see if you can find someone else who is of a similar ability to Mr X to also attend and get involved in the sport (maybe Ms Y? :). He'll have much more fun (and thus will learn quicker) if he has someone there at his level.

.44066.44065
Bob LeDoux

Re: Mr X is reluctant to shoot a match

Post by Bob LeDoux »

I joined a local shooting club and left after a year. I wanted to shoot free pistol and faced heavy pressure to forget that 'European stuff' and move into NRA three gun.
My plan was to shoot air at home and free at the indoor range. The problem was that unless I was one of the ole boys, I could only use the indoor range when a rangemaster was there.
They made it a habit of being there only on Wednesday nights. I showed up and found the shooting to be informal, a gathering of friends who interrupted their discussions with an occasional magazine at a target. After 45 minutes, they wanted to leave, which meant I couldn't continue to shoot. They were shooting .22 slow and rapid fire, and I was shooting free.
It wasn't worth the 18 mile, one way, drive. After a month of this, I stopped coming and let my membership lapse, after the year was up.
There are a couple of issues here.
1. Not everyone shares the same venue. I don't want to shoot three gun or standard.
2. Without reasonable access to ranges, there is not much incentive to participate.
3. International shooting is pretty thin. In the state of Oregon, we have almost 4 million citizens, but the best we can do is an annual state international competition. Sponsored shoots in Eugene or Portland brought out 3 to 6 shooters, including the scorekeeper. At the nearby Albany gun club, one of the best around, its NRA or nothing.
My shooting is for my own enjoyment. I am aware of four people who have an interest in the international events, within a 60 mile radius.
Those of you living in major metropolitan areas have a mixed blessing. One one hand, such areas tend to have strong "anti-gun" public and media. On the other hand, there are enough people that even if only one person per million is interested in international shooting, you have good odds of bringing enough shooters together to make it work.


.44067.44062
Craig E.

Re: Mr X is reluctant to shoot a match

Post by Craig E. »

It's almost a year that I got back into shooting AP after 15 years away. Lot of water under the bridge in that span....stamina and eyesight deteriorate, technology changes, and youngsters keep shooting better. All that aside, entering into ANY competition is good for the soul. No matter how well I might shoot in my basement, the real world has other folks doing the same thing right next to me. Not once was I made to feel out of place or inadequate for my scores. Lot's of advice freely given and comraderie of folks that are going thru or have gone thru the same trials attempting to put that little slug of lead in the middle of the paper. Shooters in general and Air Pistol folks in particular are not only hospitable, but truly happy to share the enjoyment with all who venture in. Mr. X should go have fun and rest his ego. IMHO. Craig


: : The Mr.X is lucky, and should not miss the opportunity. Competing against people who's skill level is significantly greater than yours provides experience that is hard to come by, as opposed to competing against opponents of your level or below.
: ===========
: Couldn't agree more. When I bought my first AP just a couple of months after starting pistol shooting, I was essentially the only person in my club shooting AP. The club had installed AP target runners, but all the other club members were only interested in shooting cartridge pistols. Never less, I would go down to the club about twice a week to train alone and to teach myself. Despite my efforts, I never once had anyone to shoot against or to instruct me, but I still enjoyed it. About 5 months later I heard about a regional "open championship" competition that was going to be held in a city about 200 miles away. Deciding that I would enter, I started shooting a few practice 60 shot matches my myself, getting into the early 550's - something that I was plesantly surprised with. With great excitement and anticipation I entered the competition, drove up to the city to stay the weekend, went to the hosting club, and started shooting the AP match. Having never once had anyone stand next to me also shooting an AP, as soon as I stood up to the firing line, my body was completely flooded with adrenalin and nervous tension. My pulse was racing and my shirt was soaked with sweat. My scores (and ego) fell to pieces.
: I would have LOVED to have someone else to shoot with for all those months, and I firmly believe that things would not have gone so badly for me had I had more experience shooting against others. It took a long time for my self confidence to return. Encourage Mr X to come along - no matter how badly he feels about his scores. Even better, see if you can find someone else who is of a similar ability to Mr X to also attend and get involved in the sport (maybe Ms Y? :). He'll have much more fun (and thus will learn quicker) if he has someone there at his level.

alance2002-at-yahoo.com.44068.44066
Don

Re: Mr X is reluctant to shoot a match

Post by Don »

:
: I joined a local shooting club and left after a year. I wanted to shoot free pistol and faced heavy pressure to forget that 'European stuff' and move into NRA three gun.
: My plan was to shoot air at home and free at the indoor range. The problem was that unless I was one of the ole boys, I could only use the indoor range when a rangemaster was there.
: They made it a habit of being there only on Wednesday nights. I showed up and found the shooting to be informal, a gathering of friends who interrupted their discussions with an occasional magazine at a target. After 45 minutes, they wanted to leave, which meant I couldn't continue to shoot. They were shooting .22 slow and rapid fire, and I was shooting free.
: It wasn't worth the 18 mile, one way, drive. After a month of this, I stopped coming and let my membership lapse, after the year was up.
: There are a couple of issues here.
: 1. Not everyone shares the same venue. I don't want to shoot three gun or standard.
: 2. Without reasonable access to ranges, there is not much incentive to participate.
: 3. International shooting is pretty thin. In the state of Oregon, we have almost 4 million citizens, but the best we can do is an annual state international competition. Sponsored shoots in Eugene or Portland brought out 3 to 6 shooters, including the scorekeeper. At the nearby Albany gun club, one of the best around, its NRA or nothing.
: My shooting is for my own enjoyment. I am aware of four people who have an interest in the international events, within a 60 mile radius.
: Those of you living in major metropolitan areas have a mixed blessing. One one hand, such areas tend to have strong "anti-gun" public and media. On the other hand, there are enough people that even if only one person per million is interested in international shooting, you have good odds of bringing enough shooters together to make it work.
:
Bob: I know what you mean. Many years ago, the only rifle events were NRA types - 4-p, maybe 3-p, prone and that was about it. Because of my pushing of the Int'l type of shooting, we now have some of the best rifle shooters in the country, and world if Sarah Blakeslee is any indication, in the northwest. There are a substantial number of ISSF/USAS type rifle matches in the region now. All it takes is someone to push it and keep on keepin' on.
Don
.44071.44067
JP O'Connor

Coming In Last

Post by JP O'Connor »

At this year's Nationals, there was a young man who entered all three rifle events and, if memory serves, came in dead last in all three of them. Did he have a bad time? Nope! The kid loved it! He got to hang out with all the good shooters and they encourged and helped him. Not one person laughed at him. Not one.
He had worked hard in the six months leading up to Nationals and improved himself quite a bit. At age 13, he knew he had a long way to go and time to do it. It was all about learning and improving... not about some dumb score. In fact, his attitude and work ethinc earned him an invitation to an advanced camp later in the summer. His scores sure didn't get him invited! But he earned, and deserved, that invitation nonetheless.
Even as an adult, if the athlete can focus on improving their game and on enjoying the company of others who have the same interests, the scores will come. Nobody will laugh... they remember when they were just starting out!
Of course, you know all of this already. Hopefully these comments will help to encourage your correspondent.
"Feel Center!"
-JP

jpoc-at-acm.org.44073.44062
Mako

Beginners Luck!

Post by Mako »

It took me over a year to beat my first match score ... he should take advantage of beginners luck ... while he's still a beginner and doesn't know what to worry about! ;-)
: Mr X's e-mail
: So what's a really bad score for someone, 'cuz if I can't even come close to scoring that I should probably just stay at home!
: This is my response:
: Most of the scores that are shot in the local matches are in the 490 to 550 range (out of a possible 600). But it's important to ignore this and just shoot. When I started the main challenge was to hit the target. After I could keep my shots on the paper, then I started to think about score. At my first match I was more nervous about how to get through the match according to the rules and on time to worry about the quality of my shooting. It's just part of the process.

makofoto-at-earthlink.net.44074.44062
tck

Competition is a kind of practice

Post by tck »

Going to matches is itself a kind of training.
You learn about the rules, the norms of being a good shooter.

.44075.44068
Jack

Re: Mr X is reluctant to shoot a match

Post by Jack »

:
:Bob, I am assuming you mean shooting in Albany Wednesday nights. I've been there as a guest.
Bob, which direction are you 18 miles away from there. If you are north there is the Four Corners club near Salem. I do not know if they do much AP and FP. They have at least one HM BE shooter in that program.
I am in Eugene, about 18 miles from the Emerald Empire range. There is plenty of open time at the indoor 50' range for members. Also at the outdoor 50yd range. I have dabbled in AP with a Hammerli, but do shoot the 3 guns a lot.
I think there are more AP and FP opportunities the closer you get to Seattle. I wish there were more shooting competitions around here. I personally know only two other AP owners in Eugene-Springfield. (one is ex-Olympian) Kind of pathetic there are so few.
hamden106-at-yahoo.com.44077.44067
Unclee Gary

Agree

Post by Unclee Gary »

I agree wholeheartly. You need to get your feet wet sometime. You should got to a match trying to beat the last score you shot by one point. You have to compete with yourself. When you compete with other people it mmakes you work harder and then you improve by shooting better. I have an example. A friend and i played racqueteball and his wife felt left out and wanted to come and play with us. So of course she got beat like a drum and was frustrated. Well she joined a womens league and came in first place because she worked harder when she played with the boy's. But this made her a better player in the long run. Encourage ever shooter you can no matter what age or skill level. Get them to shooting!
gwmartens-at-sigecom.net.44092.44073
Chris L in NC

Oh, you too =o)

Post by Chris L in NC »

The score in the second run of my first PTO was enough to land me in Class A. I've never been closer than 8 points since. But next week is the Fall Selection, and another chance to excel. It's your competition that makes you great. Learning to keep the sights aligned and control the trigger against world-ranked shooters makes any competition worth your while.
.44094.44074
Bob LeDoux

Re: Mr X is reluctant to shoot a match

Post by Bob LeDoux »

Let me summarize my views:
1. The focus in shooting clubs is often directed by one or two people who take a particular interest in some venue, like junior shooting.
2. These leaders tend to be coaches, not shooters, whose interest is assisting others, rather than improving their own skills.
3. Burnout plays a big factors in continued success of these programs. Many of these leaders eventually find their efforts exceed the amount of award. Even with good, positive feedback, four or five years at the pace, means it is time for someone else to take the reins.
3. Currently, the active rate of international shooting is 1 to 2 per million citizens. There are a few exceptions where 'nests' of interest exist.
4. These circumstances make it difficult to build and keep successful programs going. In some cases, existing clubs discourage international shooting venues.

Regarding your ideas:

The last time I checked with Four Corners, their air and .22 interests were aimed at juniors. it was a case of one member being the 'sparkplug' for that orientation.
I've shot several events at Emerald. They were a case of three people showing up, including the scorekeeper.
Portland Rifle and Pistol used to put on a monthly shoot for air, standard, and free, during the winter months. Anywhere from 6-8 would show up. For the last couple of years, its been the state championships and nothing else.
Oregon State University has a group of three position rifle shooters who come out on Friday nights. I was able to shoot with them.
Opportunities are better in Idaho, Spokane and the Seattle area of Washington. But 250-400 mile drives aren't reasonable, especially in winter.
I live outside of Albany, OR.



.44103.44077
Gary

Re: Mr X is reluctant to shoot a match

Post by Gary »

Well in my first match (and only one so far) I dropped 50 points from my average and shot a 473. Man was I upset. But my friend encouraged me and pointed out my GOOD targets, pointing out that the GOOD targets prove I can shoot and that I just need to work on consistency and stamina.
As was pointed out, everyone was friendly, helpful and supportive.
It was also a learning experience.
- I HAD TO finish my 60 shots within the time limit. No fudging of time as you can at home.
- ALL my shots counted. No mulligans.
- There were others shooting as well. How well were they shooting? The mental game.
- The routine and process of shooting a match is different than practicing at home.
In the end, it was fun and an worthwile learning experience.
The best thing is, on my next match that 473 leaves nowhere to go but UP.
Gary
.44105.44062
Spencer C

Mentors

Post by Spencer C »

The best advice I can offer is to arrange some mentoring for Mr X.
In an ideal world, every new member of a club would be paired with an experienced shooter to give encouragement and advise.
As I understand the Chinese system, each new club member is paired with a ‘coach’ who stays with the shooter (effectively for life). The ‘coach’ has a vested interest in improving the standard of shooting – if that shooter goes on to regional or higher level competition, the ‘coach’ goes along too. This system is more ‘mentoring’ and a buddy system than traditional coaching; whatever formal coaching is needed is provided by the appropriate level coach.
When running a few workshops lately I have been asking (pistol) shooters to answer two questions; ‘why/how they got into pistol shooting’, and ’why they are still in pistol shooting’. Interestingly, almost all got into the sport through a family member or a friend. An easy assumption is that the family member or friend eased them into all the protocols and rules (applies to any sport) and importantly, eased them into ‘competition’.
Not every member of a club will have the drive and/or skills to make it to the top level of competition. Fortunately, we have grades, classifications, and handicapping systems to encourage shooters to compete at most competitions. Some will never compete outside their club environment; some will never ‘compete’ even inside the club environment – thank god for those members who turn up to have an occasional ‘plink’ in between mowing the grass, cleaning the clubhouse, doing running repairs, beaver away in the score shed during matches, etc.
But, how many prospective top shooters have we lost to the sport through the fear of looking like a tyro (both at the club level and at outside competition)? How many great contributors to the club? (Dare I mention how much money is lost as membership fees from non-renewing members?)
Yes. Arranging a mentor for new members is extra work! But the outcomes would be well worth the effort.
- Somebody in the club has to pair off the new shooter with a worthwhile mentor. Given the heading on this forum (a place to talk about Olympic style shooting, rifle or pistol, 10 meters to 50 meters, and whatever is in between) if we are after ‘competition’ shooters pairing a new member off with the local .44 magnum/factory load/tin can shooter might not be the best route.
- Somebody in the club has to ensure that the opportunities to shoot ‘serious’ sessions are part of the club’s range programming.
Who knows, all this effort might not produce even one top-level shooter. Then again it might only produce a whole new crop of ‘somebodies’.


.44113.44062
Mako

Remember ...

Post by Mako »

... that for most shooters it takes as many as 50/70 matches to get over general match nerves ... and that the sooner he starts shooting matches ... the sooner he will be able to duplicate his practice scores in a match.
makofoto-at-earthlink.net.44122.44062
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