Specifications for Red & Green Lights for 25m Pistol Targets

[Gwhite]

I'm trying to find any rules, specifications, etc. on the red & green lights used for the timing in 25 meter events like Standard & Sport Pistol. I've search the ISSF rules, and all they talk about it the timing. Nothing about how big they should be, and where they should be located relative to the top & bottom of the targets.

I found a picture of a Megalink target with the lights, and i can probably scale equivalent dimensions off that if I can't find any real specs..

Dos anyone know where I can find the official requirements? Or what they are? I find it hard to believe there aren't formal specs someplace.

Thanks!

[SamEEE]

To the best of my knowledge there are no rules about the size, placement, or arrangement of timing lights in ISSF rulebook other than they must be Red and Green; also approved by the ISSF.

They are about the size of the bottom of a can of fizzy drink. 65-70mm at a guess. Some Narva boat navigation lights work nicely as they are weather sealed and come in red and green packs.
Circular LED array. Powered off the turning target (12V) solenoid relay. No 25m EST in New Zealand, but good enough to get an idea for Sydney.

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6.4.14.1	All indoor ranges must have artificial illumination providing the necessary amount
           of light without glare or distracting shadows on the targets or firing points. The
           background area behind the targets must be a non-reflecting, light even neutral
           color.

The rule I would challenge if they were too bright.

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6.3.2	   Electronic Scoring Target Requirements

Is where you find the specific rules for EST.

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6.4.13     Standards for 25m Electronic Scoring Target Systems
           When electronic scoring targets are used, the timing equipment must be set to
           add a total of 0.3 seconds to each established scoring time. This includes the
           established firing time +0.1 second (tolerance) plus an after-time of +0.2 second.
           The after-time ensures that shots that would have been valid skid-shots on paper
           turning targets, are scored according to the same standard on electronic targets.
           The green lights remain on for the required time +0.1 sec. and the electronic
           target must continue to record and score valid shots for an additional 0.2 sec.
           after-time.

This might give an idea:

[Gwhite]

Thanks! I'm trying to rig a system that will be 'bullet proof' that we can leave set up even when beginning pistol classes shoot up the range. They run classes during the day, and the team I help coach shoots in the evenings. I don't want to have to spend a half an hour setting up and then another half an hour taking down the lights every day. We also have no good place to store an elaborate light system that would be used downrange.

This is for a 50 foot indoor range, and the idea is to put retroreflective tape ("Scothlite") circles down near the targets, and then illuminate them with either narrow beam spot lights mounted above the ceiling baffles, or by using red & green laser pointers above the firing line. That way the only thing that get ventilated by students is the reflective tape, which A) is relatively cheap, and B) will still reflect OK with a hole or two (or three) in them.

The laser pointers are cheap from China ($3), but may be a bit too bright. I'm not sure I can easily attenuate them with filters without wrecking the beam. "Pin" spot lights are more expensive (~$10), and would be more easily dimmed, but the beam angle may be too broad. We have 15 firing points, so we'd need 30 lights/pointers, plus spares.

[jenrick]

Mylar (the stuff they make space blankets out of), for the reflector. Have it angled about 45 degrees, and have the light source in an in ground position (or with some kind of ballistic protection for it). The light shines through a colored gel onto the mylar. Mylar can take a lot of bullet holes before it stops being reflective enough for that to work.

-Jenrick

[SamEEE]

You could get a TP roll, poke a car stoplight bulb in it, and then rubber band over some coloured cellophane then have a couple of transistors to power the lights from a car battery with a 555 triggering the timing intervals.

[Gwhite]

I've scaled the dimensions from both the Megalink photo I found and the Sius-Ascor photo posted above. In case someone else ever wants to know, the 25m lights appear to be 7 to 8 cm in diameter, and are spaced 80 cm apart, center to center.

[metman]

The Megalink targets I've shot at (in Canada) have red+green lights with diameter about 2 inches or so. (~ 6 cm). I haven't measured them but I've handled them several times, helping to set up and take down the targets which aren't permanently installed anywhere.

The lights themselves appear to be diodes in front of some kind of reflector, I think. They've got a ~3 cm thick flat "plexiglass" cover that apparently stops 22LR pistol rounds: I've seen a couple bullets (not mine!) imbedded in the plexiglass that didn't seem to affect the lights. The only problem I personally observed was in the morning or later afternoon; the sun was shining on the targets at a particular angle and the glare on the plexiglass made it hard to see whether the red or green lights were on or off. The improvised solution of the range officers was admirable: they cut the bottoms out of some large paper coffee mugs (Tim Hortons is good for something!) and stuck them over the lights, like lampshades. The improvement was quite remarkable.
Obviously this wouldn't be a problem for an indoor range.

I once thought about using laser pointers for training indoors. I figured I would use a backing that would spread out and reduce the brightness of the laser dots but ended up abandoning the project for other reasons.