USA Shooting has been very responsive to "our" complaints that there wasn't enough to do at these events. This might have contributed to the lowering attendence at the Nationals. Two years ago we had 63 air pistols shooters at Atlanta. (Apparently the Nationals use to get up to 200 air pistols shooters!) This year only 35! Apparently the fact that the Spring Selection Matches are relatively close to the Nationals means that some people have to choose between one or the other. It would be nice if the important USA Shooting matches were a bit more spread out ...
In order to give us more ... USA Shooting provided clinics given by the various National coaches. They organized an infiltration style match for Rapid Air Pistol and Standard Air Pistol ... with 5 shot Steyr LP-5 air pistols provided by our message board host Scott Pilkington/pilkguns.com. These matches were run by Daryl Szarenski's wife, Ami, a former AMU shooter. (Ami also made a comeback after having a couple of kids, shooting the air pistol match. I believe she was in 1st place after the first match ... and ended up 4th overall ... after having to practice while watching the (very well behaved) kids. :-)
A very nice surprise was the implementing of "Trials Funding For Pistol." (see the current issue of USA Shooting News for details) A lot of NON-SUPPORTED finishers (non- USA Shooting Team members/military shooters) received cash awards ranging from $150 to $50. These were given out all the way down to "C" class ... and Juniors/Seniors. I know this was a very welcomed help for some of the winners of these prizes.
USA Shooting also organized an inexpensive BBQ. For us pistol shooters ... this was our only "beef." Most of us air and free pistol shooters had to go home before the BBQ. Perhaps in the future ... there could be two BBQ's. One held after the 1st Free Pistol match ... and a second one later for the rifle shooters and 25 meter pistol shooters.
A bunch of us also found extra things to do ... hanging out at Scott Pilkington's service tent ... checking out the other AMU shooting teams. Watched an AMU action shooter blaze away at his reactive targets. He took time out to show us his "race" guns, and explain his sport. We went to a local gun show. Checked out local gun stores, movies, group dinners. We were never bored and feasted on being with so many like minded individuals. And what other sport makes it so easy to hang out with the elite athletes. And in what other sport are the elite athletes so willing to share.
During the Athletes Meeting (another open group activity), hosted by USA Shooting Chief Executive Officier Bob Mitchell, we were filled in on ISSF and Olympic developments. We were able to speak our minds on shooting issues and make suggestions. One of the points that USA Shooting made was that the Spring and Fall Selection matches need more participants. Yes, these matches are for selecting shooters for the US Team and Olympic teams ... but they are also opened to all USA Shooting members. And it makes for better competion for all if we have more attendance.
Wanda ... it would help attendance if the Spring Match was perhaps earlier in the year ... or if the Nationals were a bit later ... but then they might interfer with Camp Perry (yes, a lot of International style shooters also like to go to Perry). And of course it would be great if occasionally the Spring and Fall matches were held at Colorado Springs ... so that we West Coast (and Alaska/Hawaii) shooters don't have to travel all the way to Georgai. I know a number of shooters would attend because they could then drive to the match. Since attendance is lower at the Spring/Fall Matches ... perhaps OTC could accomodate us ...
Thanks to all of the USA Shooting staff and the volunteers for all of their work at the Nationals! Most of them have to work long hours for two straight weeks while hosting us.
Beyond the matches ... it was fun, educational and gratifying going to a Big Match. I hope to see you at the Fall Selection Matches. Support Your Sport!
makofoto-at-earthlink.net.41526.0
Lots of Extras at this years USA Shooting Nationals
Moderators: rexifelis, pilkguns
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Mike McDaniel
Schedule!
I'd have gone, except for the scheduling. The problem that I see is that the pistol events are spread out over too much time. If you want to shoot pistol, you're looking at taking an entire week off - and then traveling on the weekends besides. USAS needs to remember that most of us are NOT professional shooters - we've got day jobs, and can't take 1.5 weeks off. Especially if we are participating in other sports (which I definitely do)
HMSLion-at-aol.com.41528.41526
HMSLion-at-aol.com.41528.41526
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agreed scheduling is a pr
Re: Schedule!
: I'd have gone, except for the scheduling. The problem that I see is that the pistol events are spread out over too much time. If you want to shoot pistol, you're looking at taking an entire week off - and then traveling on the weekends besides. USAS needs to remember that most of us are NOT professional shooters - we've got day jobs, and can't take 1.5 weeks off. Especially if we are participating in other sports (which I definitely do)
.41530.41528
.41530.41528
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Mako
Keep giving USA Shooting more feedback ... here
Don't forget that there is also womens air pistol ... and the air rifle events ... so besides needing at least one offical practice session and two matches for each event ... there are mens and womens events ... so there is a real scheduling issue. Between men and womens air pistol and rifle events ... that's 12 sessions that each take up about 2 hours. Plus Finals also take up time.
And Free Pistol shares the 50 meter range with all of the various mens and womens rifle events.
Plus the staff and volunteers need a lunch break. Some of them literally did not get a lunch break even with the events spread out a bit. Also, at Ft. Benning ... the Army stipulates that the ranges close at 3:30 PM. There was talk of starting at 8 instead of 9.
Scheduing was so tight that our Official Free Pistol training session was short due to a late start because there was not only one, but two womens 50 meter rifle finals ... "Regular" plus Juniors. We had to get special permission to add 15 minutes (past the 3:30 PM range closure) to get a bit more Free training ... but we still had less then the "mandated" two hours. There was an open free pistol practice session the day before ... but if you stayed to watch the Mens Air Pistol Finals ... you ended up with less then an hour of free practice.
Let USA Shooting know what you think. Leah Wirth, USA Shooting Director of Operations is here ... reading and listening. USA Shooting wants to know what we need to grow the sport ...
makofoto-at-earthlink.net.41531.41528
And Free Pistol shares the 50 meter range with all of the various mens and womens rifle events.
Plus the staff and volunteers need a lunch break. Some of them literally did not get a lunch break even with the events spread out a bit. Also, at Ft. Benning ... the Army stipulates that the ranges close at 3:30 PM. There was talk of starting at 8 instead of 9.
Scheduing was so tight that our Official Free Pistol training session was short due to a late start because there was not only one, but two womens 50 meter rifle finals ... "Regular" plus Juniors. We had to get special permission to add 15 minutes (past the 3:30 PM range closure) to get a bit more Free training ... but we still had less then the "mandated" two hours. There was an open free pistol practice session the day before ... but if you stayed to watch the Mens Air Pistol Finals ... you ended up with less then an hour of free practice.
Let USA Shooting know what you think. Leah Wirth, USA Shooting Director of Operations is here ... reading and listening. USA Shooting wants to know what we need to grow the sport ...
makofoto-at-earthlink.net.41531.41528
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Scott
Re: Schedule!
: : I'd have gone, except for the scheduling. The problem that I see is that the pistol events are spread out over too much time. If you want to shoot pistol, you're looking at taking an entire week off - and then traveling on the weekends besides. USAS needs to remember that most of us are NOT professional shooters - we've got day jobs, and can't take 1.5 weeks off. Especially if we are participating in other sports (which I definitely do)
submoa-at-aol.com.41532.41530
submoa-at-aol.com.41532.41530
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Scott
Re: Schedule!
I'd have attended USASNC except the air pistol match was first up and then free, followed by the 25m events. Air is the 'bridge' event that both the precision and 25m shooters all generally shoot.
It makes more sense to have that between the free and 25m events, not having three days of 'dead time' waiting for free to happen. The schedule should always be either 25m or free at the beginning or end of the championships, and air in the middle. IMH(but informed)O, of course.
Scott
: : I'd have gone, except for the scheduling. The problem that I see is that the pistol events are spread out over too much time. If you want to shoot pistol, you're looking at taking an entire week off - and then traveling on the weekends besides. USAS needs to remember that most of us are NOT professional shooters - we've got day jobs, and can't take 1.5 weeks off. Especially if we are participating in other sports (which I definitely do)
submoa-at-aol.com.41533.41530
It makes more sense to have that between the free and 25m events, not having three days of 'dead time' waiting for free to happen. The schedule should always be either 25m or free at the beginning or end of the championships, and air in the middle. IMH(but informed)O, of course.
Scott
: : I'd have gone, except for the scheduling. The problem that I see is that the pistol events are spread out over too much time. If you want to shoot pistol, you're looking at taking an entire week off - and then traveling on the weekends besides. USAS needs to remember that most of us are NOT professional shooters - we've got day jobs, and can't take 1.5 weeks off. Especially if we are participating in other sports (which I definitely do)
submoa-at-aol.com.41533.41530
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JP O'Connor
Re: Keep giving USA Shooting more feedback ... here
: ...
: Let USA Shooting know what you think. Leah Wirth, USA Shooting Director of Operations is here ... reading and listening. USA Shooting wants to know what we need to grow the sport ...
--
Hi Mako,
Great coverage, comments, and suggestions from you in this post and in the originating post on this thread! One nit... Leah is director of marketing, director of operations is Wanda Jewell. I'm sure that was just an 'air gap' in your post! ;-)
Scheduling of Nationals itself, and other events, was much more difficult this year, than in years past. For example, a number of very good junior shooters were not at Nationals since they were at the 3P Air rifle JO going on at the same time. The World Cup schedule affected the timing of Spring Selections and Naitonals... and, as we saw, kept some of the top shooters from competing since they were coming home from Germany and/or leaving for South Korea. I hope it works better next year! We sure do need the Atlanta ranges back!
"Feel Center!"
-JP
jpoc-at-acm.org.41537.41531
: Let USA Shooting know what you think. Leah Wirth, USA Shooting Director of Operations is here ... reading and listening. USA Shooting wants to know what we need to grow the sport ...
--
Hi Mako,
Great coverage, comments, and suggestions from you in this post and in the originating post on this thread! One nit... Leah is director of marketing, director of operations is Wanda Jewell. I'm sure that was just an 'air gap' in your post! ;-)
Scheduling of Nationals itself, and other events, was much more difficult this year, than in years past. For example, a number of very good junior shooters were not at Nationals since they were at the 3P Air rifle JO going on at the same time. The World Cup schedule affected the timing of Spring Selections and Naitonals... and, as we saw, kept some of the top shooters from competing since they were coming home from Germany and/or leaving for South Korea. I hope it works better next year! We sure do need the Atlanta ranges back!
"Feel Center!"
-JP
jpoc-at-acm.org.41537.41531
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LArry Lohkamp
Re: Keep giving USA Shooting more feedback ... here
I too probably would have if the matches had been in Atlanta, but Benning was too much.
The schedule is not user friendly. The sport is mostly divided between pistol and riffle disciplines. Many shoot most of the pistol events, or most of the rifle events, but few shooters compete in both rifle and pistol. Pistol should be one week and rifle the other. It is a lot easier to justify the high cost of flying into Georgia airports if I can save 40% on lodging. If necessary, matches should run morning 'till dinner with training in the evening. I'm there to shoot. I can kibitz with other shooters the rest of the year. That said, there still should be time for coaching seminars at the head and tail of the two week event with the bridge at the middle Saturday consisting of social stuff with America's elite shooters.
Better scheduling to accommodate us unsupported shooters will help, but location is another big deal. It is cheaper to fly from Seattle to Orlando and drive to Atlanta than to fly there direct. The cost of always going all the way to the other side of the country is a factor in the decline in participation. I asked Mako about the condition of the LA facilities with the idea that maybe we could get a selection match on this coast, if not the championships once in a while. I was disappointed at his description of the decline of the targeting there. A world class facility with electronic targeting is hard to find in the US, but do we need to be that fancy? Selection for the Pan-Am games was a done deal prior to the NC and the Olympics will probably be the same, so why not use turning targets if it will allow us to shoot some place where most of the country can afford to go to?
: Don't forget that there is also womens air pistol ... and the air rifle events ... so besides needing at least one offical practice session and two matches for each event ... there are mens and womens events ... so there is a real scheduling issue. Between men and womens air pistol and rifle events ... that's 12 sessions that each take up about 2 hours. Plus Finals also take up time.
: And Free Pistol shares the 50 meter range with all of the various mens and womens rifle events.
: Plus the staff and volunteers need a lunch break. Some of them literally did not get a lunch break even with the events spread out a bit. Also, at Ft. Benning ... the Army stipulates that the ranges close at 3:30 PM. There was talk of starting at 8 instead of 9.
: Scheduing was so tight that our Official Free Pistol training session was short due to a late start because there was not only one, but two womens 50 meter rifle finals ... "Regular" plus Juniors. We had to get special permission to add 15 minutes (past the 3:30 PM range closure) to get a bit more Free training ... but we still had less then the "mandated" two hours. There was an open free pistol practice session the day before ... but if you stayed to watch the Mens Air Pistol Finals ... you ended up with less then an hour of free practice.
: Let USA Shooting know what you think. Leah Wirth, USA Shooting Director of Operations is here ... reading and listening. USA Shooting wants to know what we need to grow the sport ...
.41539.41531
The schedule is not user friendly. The sport is mostly divided between pistol and riffle disciplines. Many shoot most of the pistol events, or most of the rifle events, but few shooters compete in both rifle and pistol. Pistol should be one week and rifle the other. It is a lot easier to justify the high cost of flying into Georgia airports if I can save 40% on lodging. If necessary, matches should run morning 'till dinner with training in the evening. I'm there to shoot. I can kibitz with other shooters the rest of the year. That said, there still should be time for coaching seminars at the head and tail of the two week event with the bridge at the middle Saturday consisting of social stuff with America's elite shooters.
Better scheduling to accommodate us unsupported shooters will help, but location is another big deal. It is cheaper to fly from Seattle to Orlando and drive to Atlanta than to fly there direct. The cost of always going all the way to the other side of the country is a factor in the decline in participation. I asked Mako about the condition of the LA facilities with the idea that maybe we could get a selection match on this coast, if not the championships once in a while. I was disappointed at his description of the decline of the targeting there. A world class facility with electronic targeting is hard to find in the US, but do we need to be that fancy? Selection for the Pan-Am games was a done deal prior to the NC and the Olympics will probably be the same, so why not use turning targets if it will allow us to shoot some place where most of the country can afford to go to?
: Don't forget that there is also womens air pistol ... and the air rifle events ... so besides needing at least one offical practice session and two matches for each event ... there are mens and womens events ... so there is a real scheduling issue. Between men and womens air pistol and rifle events ... that's 12 sessions that each take up about 2 hours. Plus Finals also take up time.
: And Free Pistol shares the 50 meter range with all of the various mens and womens rifle events.
: Plus the staff and volunteers need a lunch break. Some of them literally did not get a lunch break even with the events spread out a bit. Also, at Ft. Benning ... the Army stipulates that the ranges close at 3:30 PM. There was talk of starting at 8 instead of 9.
: Scheduing was so tight that our Official Free Pistol training session was short due to a late start because there was not only one, but two womens 50 meter rifle finals ... "Regular" plus Juniors. We had to get special permission to add 15 minutes (past the 3:30 PM range closure) to get a bit more Free training ... but we still had less then the "mandated" two hours. There was an open free pistol practice session the day before ... but if you stayed to watch the Mens Air Pistol Finals ... you ended up with less then an hour of free practice.
: Let USA Shooting know what you think. Leah Wirth, USA Shooting Director of Operations is here ... reading and listening. USA Shooting wants to know what we need to grow the sport ...
.41539.41531
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Mark Rogers
Re: Keep giving USA Shooting more feedback ... here
The only factor prohibiting my participation was the cost of traveling down to Benning. Even from Nebraska, the cost is high, especially for us "rich" high school teachers ;-) I was really planning on it, but just couldn't justify the high cost, especially when I am beginning work on my Ph.D. this fall.
On the plus side, my community is going to have a barbeque/fund raiser to help defray costs to travel to the Fall Selection Match - so I hope to make that.
Having the competition at the OTC would be great for us in the central part of the U.S., but I know that logistics probably prohibit that. I do hope to make Nationals next year!
: Don't forget that there is also womens air pistol ... and the air rifle events ... so besides needing at least one offical practice session and two matches for each event ... there are mens and womens events ... so there is a real scheduling issue. Between men and womens air pistol and rifle events ... that's 12 sessions that each take up about 2 hours. Plus Finals also take up time.
: And Free Pistol shares the 50 meter range with all of the various mens and womens rifle events.
: Plus the staff and volunteers need a lunch break. Some of them literally did not get a lunch break even with the events spread out a bit. Also, at Ft. Benning ... the Army stipulates that the ranges close at 3:30 PM. There was talk of starting at 8 instead of 9.
: Scheduing was so tight that our Official Free Pistol training session was short due to a late start because there was not only one, but two womens 50 meter rifle finals ... "Regular" plus Juniors. We had to get special permission to add 15 minutes (past the 3:30 PM range closure) to get a bit more Free training ... but we still had less then the "mandated" two hours. There was an open free pistol practice session the day before ... but if you stayed to watch the Mens Air Pistol Finals ... you ended up with less then an hour of free practice.
: Let USA Shooting know what you think. Leah Wirth, USA Shooting Director of Operations is here ... reading and listening. USA Shooting wants to know what we need to grow the sport ...
mrogers-at-esu9.org.41541.41531
On the plus side, my community is going to have a barbeque/fund raiser to help defray costs to travel to the Fall Selection Match - so I hope to make that.
Having the competition at the OTC would be great for us in the central part of the U.S., but I know that logistics probably prohibit that. I do hope to make Nationals next year!
: Don't forget that there is also womens air pistol ... and the air rifle events ... so besides needing at least one offical practice session and two matches for each event ... there are mens and womens events ... so there is a real scheduling issue. Between men and womens air pistol and rifle events ... that's 12 sessions that each take up about 2 hours. Plus Finals also take up time.
: And Free Pistol shares the 50 meter range with all of the various mens and womens rifle events.
: Plus the staff and volunteers need a lunch break. Some of them literally did not get a lunch break even with the events spread out a bit. Also, at Ft. Benning ... the Army stipulates that the ranges close at 3:30 PM. There was talk of starting at 8 instead of 9.
: Scheduing was so tight that our Official Free Pistol training session was short due to a late start because there was not only one, but two womens 50 meter rifle finals ... "Regular" plus Juniors. We had to get special permission to add 15 minutes (past the 3:30 PM range closure) to get a bit more Free training ... but we still had less then the "mandated" two hours. There was an open free pistol practice session the day before ... but if you stayed to watch the Mens Air Pistol Finals ... you ended up with less then an hour of free practice.
: Let USA Shooting know what you think. Leah Wirth, USA Shooting Director of Operations is here ... reading and listening. USA Shooting wants to know what we need to grow the sport ...
mrogers-at-esu9.org.41541.41531
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Mako
Love those new message boards where you can edit your messag
: : ...
: : Let USA Shooting know what you think. Leah Wirth, USA Shooting Director of Operations is here ... reading and listening. USA Shooting wants to know what we need to grow the sport ...
: --
: Hi Mako,
: Great coverage, comments, and suggestions from you in this post and in the originating post on this thread! One nit... Leah is director of marketing, director of operations is Wanda Jewell. I'm sure that was just an 'air gap' in your post! ;-)
: Scheduling of Nationals itself, and other events, was much more difficult this year, than in years past. For example, a number of very good junior shooters were not at Nationals since they were at the 3P Air rifle JO going on at the same time. The World Cup schedule affected the timing of Spring Selections and Naitonals... and, as we saw, kept some of the top shooters from competing since they were coming home from Germany and/or leaving for South Korea. I hope it works better next year! We sure do need the Atlanta ranges back!
: "Feel Center!"
: -JP
makofoto-at-earthlink.net.41543.41537
: : Let USA Shooting know what you think. Leah Wirth, USA Shooting Director of Operations is here ... reading and listening. USA Shooting wants to know what we need to grow the sport ...
: --
: Hi Mako,
: Great coverage, comments, and suggestions from you in this post and in the originating post on this thread! One nit... Leah is director of marketing, director of operations is Wanda Jewell. I'm sure that was just an 'air gap' in your post! ;-)
: Scheduling of Nationals itself, and other events, was much more difficult this year, than in years past. For example, a number of very good junior shooters were not at Nationals since they were at the 3P Air rifle JO going on at the same time. The World Cup schedule affected the timing of Spring Selections and Naitonals... and, as we saw, kept some of the top shooters from competing since they were coming home from Germany and/or leaving for South Korea. I hope it works better next year! We sure do need the Atlanta ranges back!
: "Feel Center!"
: -JP
makofoto-at-earthlink.net.41543.41537
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JLK
The reason for the 3:30 PM range close is probably...
because Army posts have a place called "Range Control". Nothing goes on unless they know about it and approve of it. Their normal duty hours probably end at or near 3:30. It might be just a case of talking to the appropriate people in advance, telling them what your needs are and seeing if they can accomodate you.
.41544.41539
.41544.41539
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bruce
Re: Schedule!
We kicked all of that arourn with Doc Sexton and I also talked with Bob Mitchell and he was aware as well. One thing is to allow unsquadded training so competitors can arrive later in the day before match1. As it is now a 10 am check in before match 1 actually adds days to schedule.
Also split off rifle events from pistol and try to compress schedule. Bib was concerned about expanding the schedule to 14 days for rifle & pistol but I think a combination of things can help there.
.41572.41528
Also split off rifle events from pistol and try to compress schedule. Bib was concerned about expanding the schedule to 14 days for rifle & pistol but I think a combination of things can help there.
.41572.41528