Got the CA$H - just gotta choose.

[Giddaymate]

Gentlemen,

After saving for a while I was ready for a new prone rifle and pretty sold on the Feinwerkbau 2700 - until a friend told me Anschutz rifles were one step ahead in terms of quality, accuracy and resale value. Im not so sure but Im also pretty new to the sport.

So Ive got two questions,

1) you guys agree in general?
2) whats the basic difference on 1913 and 2013 Anschutz?


Thanks

[Tim S]

1) Feinwerkbau make very good rifles. You will see more Anschutz rifles, not because of any inherent superiority but because Anschutz have been making smallbore rifles for longer, and had more dealers/better after sales support. You may find that Anschutz hold their value a little better as more people are familiar with the brand.

In mechanical terms there isn't much to chose between a FWB 2700 an Anschutz 1918. Both are made by the same methods as far as I've been told. Both are twin-lug rear-locking bolts, with button rifled barrels. The FWB does have a slightly longer receiver, which should make it a little stiffer than the Anschutz, and reportedly the trigger is a little crisper. But these are small points. Practically these is a wider range of aftermarket stocks for the Anschutz if you don't want factory. Booth the 2700 and 1918 precise are fully adjustable, and should be capable of fitting your position. Whether one palances a little better is a purely personal matter.

The FWB does normally come with sights AFAIK, whereas these are an extra with Anschutz. Both take standard Gehmann/Centra irises (M22 at the front for FWB).

2) The Anschutz 1913 and 2013 share the same bolt, trigger, sights, and barrel. The difference is the receiver. The 1913 is a modified Match 54. It is round, and is held into the stock with two bolts. The barrel is a press-fit into the receiver, and secured with two pins. Replacing a barrel is normally a job for a gunsmith; either pressing+pinning, gluing, or threading the action. The 2013 has a larger square-section action that is held into the stock with four bolts. The front of the receiver is split, and the barrel is clamped in by tightening three bolts. Barrel replacement is much easier as several manufacturers sell ready machined drop-in barrel (you just need an allen key and a headspace gauge to fit). The 2013 is slightly heavier than the 1913. 2013 actions will not fit 1913 stocks without considerable work, but 1913 actions go into 2013 stocks with an adaptor plate.

[patriot]

The 1913 is the traditional model 54 round action. The 2013 is a square action that allows you to replace barrels without a gunsmith (if you get the right barrel). Some believe the 1913 is inherently more accurate; both are better than me.

The Anschutz will be easier to service and has better resale. It would be best if you could get behind both a few times before you make up your mind. I have long arms so loading from position isn't an issue, but some have to reach with the Anschutz. It could also be they have the length of pull too long, a common beginner mistake. I'm not certain if the Feinwerkbau is any better. Friends that own Walthers and Grunich Racers ($$$$$) prefer their ergonomics. Keep in mind it takes a while to get a stock to fit you vs. you fitting the stock. The same goes for the trigger, but if you are a new shooter I'd leave that alone until you are comfortable with the rifle. I prefer two different trigger setups for irons and scope (35x).

In generally I'd recommend starting with the Annie. If you find something you like better it will be easier to sell. They still dominate the line at the nationals.

Mark

[Giddaymate]

What a nice clear answer. Thanx. I bet the Anschutz is good but Im still leaning towards the Feinwerkbau.

[redschietti]

Which nationals? Anschutz are great guns but I don't see many of the elite shooters using them anymore.

[efoleyjr]

Look at the Walther KK300. May be the best of the lot. I am sure the trigger is the best.
Ed

[patriot]

Smallbore prone nationals at Bristol IN. Is there any other nationals? :-)

Ed, have you tried the Racer's trigger?

Mark

http://www.nrablog.com/post/2014/07/23/ ... x#continue

Of course, it is the Indian and not the arrow.

[Ltdave]

i have a line on a FWB smallbore rifle complete (with a precise stock, sights, pelican case) used for 3 years on the Morehouse College team by one of the "graduated" juniors from my club...

i believe theyre asking $3400 complete but if youre interested i can get all of the particulars...

email me at Ltdave at yahoo dot com for faster response...

[tenring]

Walther KK300 in anatomic stock. Great sights, MEC HANDSTOP, the entire package at $4300 is a great deal. Fit and finish superb!
Tenring

[Andre]

I've seen the tests.....I believe from when I've seen, the FWB 2700 is the most accurate out of the bunch. Can't find the pic, but saw a 50m test (Walther anatomic, Anschutz 54 match, FWB 2700) and it was dead clear the 2700 was the most accurate. I like the FWB trigger over anschutz ones also. Not much experience with Walther triggers.

[patriot]

Given each rifle's preference for a particular ammo and tuning, I'd like to see the control for such a test. Do you have a reference link?

Mark

[mtncwru]

Smallbore prone nationals at Bristol IN. Is there any other nationals? :-)

There's a minor match at Ft. Benning every year that calls itself something like "USA Shooting National Championships." I don't think it's that big a deal; after all, USA Shooting doesn't field our Olympic Team or anything.

Oh wait...

As for the Anschutz vs. FWB debate, if you are in the US I would lean you toward an Anschutz. You will have more and better options for post-purchase customer support with than with the FWB. Walther, as Ed mentioned, is actively working on increasing their market share, and is getting up there in with Anschutz in terms of support and parts availability. All three (Anschutz, Walther, FWB) are excellent rifles with superb triggers. None of them will hold you back until you start getting into world class athlete territory, and then it will come down to the specific action/barrel/stock/ammo combo rather than a general brand discussion.

[Andre]

Given each rifle's preference for a particular ammo and tuning, I'd like to see the control for such a test. Do you have a reference link?

Mark

I very much apologize, I couldn't find the test for the life of me. As I remember they were all stock with the ammo they liked. All got amazing groups but the FWB looked the best. Some shooting buddy agree.

Just remember, your going to shoot your best if you have a rifle you enjoy and are proud to own. If you wish you had a different rifle your never going to be happy.

[Giddaymate]

Yeah - let me know where to find that comparison test. Sounds great!!

[Tim S]

As I remember they were all stock with the ammo they liked. All got amazing groups but the FWB looked the best. Some shooting buddy agree.

Just remember, your going to shoot your best if you have a rifle you enjoy and are proud to own. If you wish you had a different rifle your never going to be happy.

A test that involves just one rifle of each brand can't really be categorical proof that one brand is superior; all that can be said is that a specific rifle was more accurate. There will always be some manufacturing tolerance between barrels, so with only a single barrel of each brand, it's really chance that one was a little better than the other two. How the test rifles were chosen is also relevant. Was each chosen in the same way, whether hand picked by the importer as the most accurate example, or just picked at random, or borrowed from the tester's friends (which throws up the matter of relative round count)?

[jhmartin]

In addition there is the "Fad" factor.
What is the popular rifle in this quad may change depending on how the results come out at the Olympics ... or what rifle the top shooters on your national team may shoot ... or ...... (you get the idea)

As a junior coach, I have many young shooters who feel that snug is not tight enough and feel inclined to exert all their force on specific items ... even when plainly (to me) broken. Having all my shooters shoot the same brand is nice for me as it limits the spare parts I lug around ... screws(mostly), but firing pins, stock bolts, sight parts, etc.

They will, for the most part, all shoot above the abilities of the shooter ... getting one that fits you best (since cash is not the issue for you) would be the priority.

[SRay53txtn]

I am a Palma prone shooter that was looking to better my ground game (not that good - want to be better) and did some trading and got to look
at all three versions at Champions Choice (just down the street from my home) on Monday and could not see an appreciable difference in the factory targets supplied with each new rifle. I discussed the options at length with the owner (Homer). It appears as most have indicated a personal taste, "fit", and finish issue.
I'll post a pic of what I chose if you'd like.

[jhmartin]

got to look at all three versions at Champions Choice (just down the street from my home)

You married?
Now that you know you have a toy shop down the road ........

[SRay53txtn]

Yes.
I'm older, kids out of college, and 33 years with same wife - she lets me enjoy my hobbies. :-)
Agree - I find myself at the back sales counter way too often!!!

[Giddaymate]

Post that pic mate :)