I've been wondering for a while if you guys have any actual preference to your rear sights. I personally am using my ancient Diana 100 sights on my FWB 700 and the factory sight for my Anschutz 1411. Click preferences? My FWB sight was only 12 clicks which led to an area around the 10 ring which couldn't be hit (hence the switch back to my old Diana sights). And my Anschutz sights are simply there because I've seen no reason to change them. ;)
Thoughts? Opinions? Complaints?
Discuss! :)
Which rear sight and why?
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bpscCheney
- Posts: 187
- Joined: Thu Jan 19, 2012 8:11 pm
- Location: Wisconsin
I use factory anschutz sights on my 1813, because I too see no reason to change. I have added on both an adjustable iris and and adjustable foresight element, but my maxim is if it works... plus new sights are expensive.
Some folks in the UK use very small rearsights that are almost see-through around the iris - to give a better peripheral vision of the wind flags etc, but I find I can see well enough around the nrmal sights.
Rob.
Some folks in the UK use very small rearsights that are almost see-through around the iris - to give a better peripheral vision of the wind flags etc, but I find I can see well enough around the nrmal sights.
Rob.
Before we talk too much about specific sights consider that there are three basic qualities to a target sight. Consistency, Uniformity, Repeatability.
Consistency is the shot to shot solidness of the sight. Does it stay in one place?
Uniformity is the amount each click moves the sight. In an ideal world the sight will move the exact same amount each click in either direction each and every time it is clicked. Worst case, you have some clicks where you get zero change and the next click you get two clicks worth and then some.
Repeatability is how close you can come back to some zero point after clicking off 5 or 10 or 20 or more clicks. Simply stated, can I click off 20 clicks then take them back and be where I started?
Now, sights are mechanical devices and some are better than others with regard to these qualities. None are perfect.
Most of your target sights setup for smallbore and air rifle will move the same amount for a full revolution of the adjustment turret but there are different detents on the clicks giving 10, 12, 20 or some other number of clicks per revolution. How much each click changes point of impact is also a factor of if a bloop tube or other sight extension is in the mix. Longer sight radius makes for smaller impact change per click.
Which level of fineness is right for you? For an air rifle 10 click sights will get you somethlng like 2 tenths of a mm per click at 10 meters which is really fine for most shooters. Some folks swear by 20 clicks per rev but their scores do not support the idea they need that much refinement.
Anschutz makes a good sight, Centra makes a good sight. You have to be willing to spend the dollars. I like my 20 year old Hammerli 460 sight, that some folks consider to be almost like a agricultural implement, (10 click turrets) Many years ago I replaced the stock sights on my FWB 601 with the Hammerlis and my average 60 shot score went up by not quite 3 points. (low 570s to mid 570s) so there is a testimonial.
I have a Centra for my prone rifle, good solid, uniform, repeatable consistent sight with 20 clicks per revolution. With the bloop tube I was clicking all day to get across the 10 ring. At the moment I have other issues and did not need that level of refinement so I pulled the Centra and reinstalled some Hammerli's.
I do have a new era FWB rear sight that came with an air rifle. It is OK but I use it only for fooling around. I have not put it under a dial indicator, frankly I don't like the feel. Frame feels too light and the click detents are mushy.
Past the mechanicals, much of this is personal preference and what you are willing to spend. I can't comment on the Diana sights. For most shooters, the factory Anschutz sights on your 1411 are likely just the ticket.
Cheers,
'Dude
Consistency is the shot to shot solidness of the sight. Does it stay in one place?
Uniformity is the amount each click moves the sight. In an ideal world the sight will move the exact same amount each click in either direction each and every time it is clicked. Worst case, you have some clicks where you get zero change and the next click you get two clicks worth and then some.
Repeatability is how close you can come back to some zero point after clicking off 5 or 10 or 20 or more clicks. Simply stated, can I click off 20 clicks then take them back and be where I started?
Now, sights are mechanical devices and some are better than others with regard to these qualities. None are perfect.
Most of your target sights setup for smallbore and air rifle will move the same amount for a full revolution of the adjustment turret but there are different detents on the clicks giving 10, 12, 20 or some other number of clicks per revolution. How much each click changes point of impact is also a factor of if a bloop tube or other sight extension is in the mix. Longer sight radius makes for smaller impact change per click.
Which level of fineness is right for you? For an air rifle 10 click sights will get you somethlng like 2 tenths of a mm per click at 10 meters which is really fine for most shooters. Some folks swear by 20 clicks per rev but their scores do not support the idea they need that much refinement.
Anschutz makes a good sight, Centra makes a good sight. You have to be willing to spend the dollars. I like my 20 year old Hammerli 460 sight, that some folks consider to be almost like a agricultural implement, (10 click turrets) Many years ago I replaced the stock sights on my FWB 601 with the Hammerlis and my average 60 shot score went up by not quite 3 points. (low 570s to mid 570s) so there is a testimonial.
I have a Centra for my prone rifle, good solid, uniform, repeatable consistent sight with 20 clicks per revolution. With the bloop tube I was clicking all day to get across the 10 ring. At the moment I have other issues and did not need that level of refinement so I pulled the Centra and reinstalled some Hammerli's.
I do have a new era FWB rear sight that came with an air rifle. It is OK but I use it only for fooling around. I have not put it under a dial indicator, frankly I don't like the feel. Frame feels too light and the click detents are mushy.
Past the mechanicals, much of this is personal preference and what you are willing to spend. I can't comment on the Diana sights. For most shooters, the factory Anschutz sights on your 1411 are likely just the ticket.
Cheers,
'Dude
When I shoot prone indoors at 50 ft with my 1913, I use the factory rear sight. It allows you to perfectly center you shots in the bull. Its adjustments are very fine.
Outdoors, shooting prone at 50yds, 50 meters, and 100 yds, I remove the Anschutz rear sight and install a Warner #2.
The reason for that is the Anschutz sight has too fine of an adjustment for shooting in the wind. You have to grab a handful of knob to move the POI just one scoring ring. The Warner has 1/4 MOA adjustments that makes wind corrections much easier for me.
I use a Warner on all my CF prone guns and so am very comfortable adjusting POI for varing wind conditions.
Front sight is a 30mm Rite Site on a bloop tube. I use it both in and out of doors.
Bob
Outdoors, shooting prone at 50yds, 50 meters, and 100 yds, I remove the Anschutz rear sight and install a Warner #2.
The reason for that is the Anschutz sight has too fine of an adjustment for shooting in the wind. You have to grab a handful of knob to move the POI just one scoring ring. The Warner has 1/4 MOA adjustments that makes wind corrections much easier for me.
I use a Warner on all my CF prone guns and so am very comfortable adjusting POI for varing wind conditions.
Front sight is a 30mm Rite Site on a bloop tube. I use it both in and out of doors.
Bob
Justadude: take the cover off your FWB sight sometime and have a look. They do seem very cheaply made but a very clever design. They use a leaf spring frame setup. The adjustment screws just bear against this spring loaded frame. Very clever reliable design- no frills but works great with no backlash.
pdeal:
In the fullness of time I will probably put these sights "through the paces" so to speak. Starting with a dial indicator and just running them back an forth.
I expect you are right, under the cover a very clever design as really the engineering on FWB products is usually pretty top notch. Past that there is also the feel. For me, with big fat fingers, the turret knobs are kind of short and the clicks are soft, that is a personal thing.
'Dude
In the fullness of time I will probably put these sights "through the paces" so to speak. Starting with a dial indicator and just running them back an forth.
I expect you are right, under the cover a very clever design as really the engineering on FWB products is usually pretty top notch. Past that there is also the feel. For me, with big fat fingers, the turret knobs are kind of short and the clicks are soft, that is a personal thing.
'Dude
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bpscCheney
- Posts: 187
- Joined: Thu Jan 19, 2012 8:11 pm
- Location: Wisconsin
I don't know why but my FWB factory sights, despite their clever design, seem to be able to sway left and right and up and down just from a slight nudge. This for me unfortunately unacceptable since my glasses will often times either nudge the sight out of alignment or me placing it in its case will jar the sight. Hence the 30 year jump back in sights. ;)