MQS ( minimum qualification scores )

MILO · Post by **MILO** » Tue Feb 14, 2012 9:58 pm

Due to the fact that the China World Cup is cancelled. Shooters who win small bore Olympic trials, and do not have a MQS. Will not be given a opportunity to get one. Pretty dirty!

jkuna · Post by **jkuna** » Wed Feb 15, 2012 5:52 am

MQS can be won only at the predetermined events. World Cup in China is not one of those.
For upcoming olympic games MQS have already won.

http://www.issf-sports.org/results/og_q ... fiers.ashx

David Levene · Post by **David Levene** » Wed Feb 15, 2012 6:35 am

jkuna wrote:MQS can be won only at the predetermined events. World Cup in China is not one of those.
For upcoming olympic games MQS have already won.

You are confusing Quota Places and MQSs I'm afraid.

There are still Quota Places (and MQSs) available at the European Airgun Championships.

MQSs can also be obtained at 2012 World Cups including, for Rifle & Pistol, London, Munich and Milan as Article 3.12.3.1 - Q.3.3 of the ISSF rules.

Richard H · Post by **Richard H** » Wed Feb 15, 2012 6:52 am

The last Quota spots are at the European Airgun championships. MQS are available at all the world cups all the time. Anyone who's earned a Quota reallyhaf to have shot an MQS anyways the only ones effected would be countries that are given quota spots. There's nothing dirty.

David Levene · Post by **David Levene** » Wed Feb 15, 2012 7:22 am

Richard H wrote:MQS are available at all the world cups all the time.

'Fraid not. In this Olympic cycle they weren't available in the 2009 or 2010 World Cups.

Richard H wrote:Anyone who's earned a Quota reallyhaf to have shot an MQS anyways the only ones effected would be countries that are given quota spots.

Remember that it's not necessarilly the person who wins the Quota Place who gets to use it. The OP referred to shooters who win Olympic Trials, and it's perfectly feasible that they may never have been to an MQS qualifying event. It all depends on a country's selection procedure.

MILO · Post by **MILO** » Wed Feb 15, 2012 7:29 am

The U.S. Trials are schedule to go after the first three World Cups. Every four year a shooter comes out of no where and makes the Team. So they would send them to the last World Cup of the year to get a MQS. Now that the China World Cup is cancelled. The U.S. only has six people who have A MQS.

jkuna · Post by **jkuna** » Wed Feb 15, 2012 8:11 am

Sorry my mistake, I knew that the quota place can still be won on the European Championship this year, but I thought that MQS can not be won on the World Cups as they can not win the quota places.

RobStubbs · Post by **RobStubbs** » Wed Feb 15, 2012 8:23 am

MILO wrote:The U.S. Trials are schedule to go after the first three World Cups. Every four year a shooter comes out of no where and makes the Team. So they would send them to the last World Cup of the year to get a MQS. Now that the China World Cup is cancelled. The U.S. only has six people who have A MQS.

There's at least 2 male rifle shooters, 2 pistol and 2 rapid fire pistol shooters I can think of and there are certainly a number of female rifle and pistol shooters as well. So I think you're forgetting quite a few.

Rob.

jkuna · Post by **jkuna** » Wed Feb 15, 2012 8:24 am

Question for David, if MQS has to be won in the same discipline as the quota place? Can a shooter who won the MQS in prone to compete in the Olympics if the quota place was won in the 3p

David Levene · Post by **David Levene** » Wed Feb 15, 2012 9:09 am

jkuna wrote:Question for David, if MQS has to be won in the same discipline as the quota place? Can a shooter who won the MQS in prone to compete in the Olympics if the quota place was won in the 3p

To shoot in any event at the Olympics, even as a "Double Starter", you must have the MCS in that event.

In other words, to shoot in the 3P event you must have the MQS in 3P. If you only have the MQS in Prone you cannot take up a 3P quota place.

Q.5.1.2 says:-
"On request of an NOC/ISSF Member Federation the maximum of one (1) quota place in one event can be changed for one (1) quota place in any other event if available. The application for a change must be received by the ISSF by 12 March, 2012"

It is therefore possible, but by no means certain, that a country might be able to change a quota place in one event for a QP in another.

Richard H · Post by **Richard H** » Wed Feb 15, 2012 9:19 am

David MQS's were definitely available in 2010, just take a quick look the List of MQS Qualifers per Event. It looks like they started with the WCH and the YOG, so yes there were no world cup MQS's

Richard H · Post by **Richard H** » Wed Feb 15, 2012 9:26 am

RobStubbs wrote:
MILO wrote:The U.S. Trials are schedule to go after the first three World Cups. Every four year a shooter comes out of no where and makes the Team. So they would send them to the last World Cup of the year to get a MQS. Now that the China World Cup is cancelled. The U.S. only has six people who have A MQS.
There's at least 2 male rifle shooters, 2 pistol and 2 rapid fire pistol shooters I can think of and there are certainly a number of female rifle and pistol shooters as well. So I think you're forgetting quite a few.

Rob.

According to the ISSF there are 126 USA athletes with MQS.

If they are planning on coming out of no where I guess they'll have to get themselves to one of the three WC's prior to the trials.

RobStubbs · Post by **RobStubbs** » Wed Feb 15, 2012 10:48 am

Richard H wrote:
According to the ISSF there are 126 USA athletes with MQS.

If they are planning on coming out of no where I guess they'll have to get themselves to one of the three WC's prior to the trials.

So significantly more than 6 then ;)

I guess though if you only know of 6 then the120 others are 'coming out of nowhere'

Rob.

David Levene · Post by **David Levene** » Wed Feb 15, 2012 10:55 am

Richard H wrote:It looks like they started with the WCH and the YOG, so yes there were no world cup MQS's

I understand it was an IOC requirement that qualifying performances in all sports could only be set in the 2 years preceeding the Olympic Opening Ceremony.

The 2010 World Championships started 2 days inside that limit with the YOGs starting a couple of weeks later.

tedbell · Post by **tedbell** » Wed Feb 15, 2012 12:23 pm

I'm a neophyte when it comes to MQS's and the rest of the things we are discussing here, but in reading through the posts, isn't Milo's initial point still valid? Which is, if someone wins a smallbore event at the US Olympic Trials who has not been on the national team before (or has been on the team but has not scored a MQS), they will not have an opportunity to get an MQS before the Olympics. Right? Which means, that it is possible for someone to win the trials but not be able to go to the Olympics.

Thanks,
Ted

Richard H · Post by **Richard H** » Wed Feb 15, 2012 12:40 pm

Yep they will be sol.

His opinion that it was done for some un sportsman like reason is pretty ridicules.

Barney · Post by **Barney** » Wed Feb 15, 2012 4:39 pm

Maybe China had a very valid reason for canceling there world cup?

RobStubbs · Post by **RobStubbs** » Thu Feb 16, 2012 11:55 am

tedbell wrote:I'm a neophyte when it comes to MQS's and the rest of the things we are discussing here, but in reading through the posts, isn't Milo's initial point still valid? Which is, if someone wins a smallbore event at the US Olympic Trials who has not been on the national team before (or has been on the team but has not scored a MQS), they will not have an opportunity to get an MQS before the Olympics. Right? Which means, that it is possible for someone to win the trials but not be able to go to the Olympics.

Thanks,
Ted

Suggests to me the trials are at the wrong time. I don't know exactly how the US olympic team are selected but a single trials match a few months before the olympics isn't ideal for many reasons.

Rob.

jhmartin · Post by **jhmartin** » Thu Feb 16, 2012 12:42 pm

This is all moot.
In Sept 2009 USA Shooting published the selection procedures for the 2012 Olympics. It has been there for years, and anyone awaiting until the last minute hoping all would go their way is silly.
http://www.usashooting.org/library/Poli ... edures.pdf

Specifically: (my bolding added)

2. Minimum International Federation (IF) standards for participation:
Only athletes who have attained the Minimum Qualifying Score (MQS), per International Shooting Sport Federation (ISSF) Official Statutes Rules and Regulations can be entered in one or more events in the Olympic Games per rule Q 3.0, in each event for which they qualify. If the athlete does not have a MQS in each event for which they have qualified at the conclusion of the selection process, the athlete will be provided an opportunity to obtain the MQS if there is a MQS qualifying match scheduled after the selection process and all entry and logistical requirements can be met. If the athlete does not achieve an MQS score prior to 17 June 2012, the athlete will be replaced according to the process outlined in paragraph IV.A.

It's not the fault of USA Shooting that the World Cup scheduled after the nationals are cancelled. Anyone who wants to "come out of the woodwork" and try for a late WC entry has been welcome to go to C-Springs and shoot in a match personally put on by the National Coach and show their hand .... Rocky Mountain Championships ... a match run in pristine weather conditions ... 50m indoor

Eric U · Post by **Eric U** » Thu Feb 16, 2012 12:51 pm

The US trials time was fine, before Beijing cancelled their world cup. Since that was just announced two weeks ago, there really isn't time to change it now. There really isn't another time in the spring schedule that it would work.

Too bad for someone who shoots the match of their life at the tryouts and they don't have an MQS. If someone really thinks they have a chance at the one each prone, 3x40, or 3x20 slot remaining on the US team, they had better talk to the national coach about self-funding to either the Munich or Milan world cups to try and get an MQS. There may be some slots still available.

Eric U