SSP air pistols

RobinC · Post by **RobinC** » Tue Jul 19, 2011 4:47 am

I use Steyr's but also have SSP's, the Walther LPM1 is a superb pistol, but it is physical to cock, the simplest way is across the chest like a compression chest expander but that does incure the wrath of range officers as the muzzle is pointing across the range. It was also responsible for making my rheumatism painfull so I went to PCP Steyrs.

I also have a FAS 604 for home practice, it is an excellent pistol and easier to load than most of the other SSPs, It is available and I think FAS still make it but in small batches.
Robin

ON_THE_EDGE · Post by **ON_THE_EDGE** » Tue Jul 19, 2011 6:10 am

I am pretty much with pauln. I love my 46M for the cost and simplicity. Right now it will shoot better than I can.

I would really like to find a high quality SSP rifle to go with it. I know there are many used ones out there and I will likely pick one up, but a new one would be great.

I guess I am just a throw back to an earlier age. One of my philosophies has always been "Just because you can, does not mean you should".

Also, I must have some Scottish blood. When you add up the cost of all of the support equipment necessary to even send the first pellet down range with a PCP or CO2 rifle or pistol, it sometimes exceeds the cost of the rifle or pistol.

Yes, I think it would be nice if someone was to reintroduce high quality SSP air rifles and pistols.

Rover · Post by **Rover** » Tue Jul 19, 2011 9:19 am

The FAS 604 is sold by Airguns of Arizona. I know they have at least one in stock, but I don't know if the grip has a palm shelf.

There is a guy named JimE on this site that seems to come up with a lot of match guns. You might contact him.

This guy, too: http://www.targettalk.org/viewtopic.php?t=30604

Richard H · Post by **Richard H** » Tue Jul 19, 2011 4:34 pm

ON_THE_EDGE wrote:I am pretty much with pauln. I love my 46M for the cost and simplicity. Right now it will shoot better than I can.

I would really like to find a high quality SSP rifle to go with it. I know there are many used ones out there and I will likely pick one up, but a new one would be great.

.

There's tons of 601's, 602, 603's around.

toddinjax · Post by **toddinjax** » Tue Jul 19, 2011 6:17 pm

Would this;
http://www.pyramydair.com/s/m/Weihrauch_HW_75/46
be a good choice for a home based recreational shooter?

toddinjax · Post by **toddinjax** » Tue Jul 19, 2011 6:18 pm

Would this;
http://www.pyramydair.com/s/m/Weihrauch_HW_75/46
be a good choice for a home based recreational shooter?

Gerard · Post by **Gerard** » Tue Jul 19, 2011 6:31 pm

That would depend almost entirely on what you meant by 'recreational.' If you mean plinking, then sure, it's a fine pistol. And it'd even do fairly well in Olympic style AP. But the main limitation is with the grip, which is rather too small and certainly at the wrong angle for this type of shooting. A degree of 'wrist lock' is highly desirable in 10m AP such that stability is improved. Since recoil isn't really an issue in AP, the more firearm-like grip angle of this model is irrelevant. Recoil is not generally felt in the wrist, so the pistol's design can be adapted to take advantage of the lack of any shock absorption requirement. I know a shooter who was able to score quite well at home on a 10m range, but he's found his results are considerably better with an appropriate pistol.

Rover · Post by **Rover** » Tue Jul 19, 2011 6:38 pm

For the price of the Weirauch you could have a used "real" gun, such as an FWB 65, IZH 45M, or Pardini 58. They would be infinitely more suitable to 10 meter match shooting.

Gerard · Post by **Gerard** » Tue Jul 19, 2011 6:49 pm

And then there's the barrel direction problem. Pointing the barrel towards anything but a down-range direction is forbidden for safety reasons. Would it not be against this safety rule to even cock this type of pistol? Of course in a logical sense that is ridiculous, as the gun cannot fire without the barrel being engaged with the transfer port... but rules aren't always logical. Easier to implement a general rule regardless of pistol model variations than to start making exceptions for every sort of design. Perhaps I'm missing something in technique, but would it not be very difficult to put pressure into the cylinder in this sort of pistol without pointing the barrel at other people? Unless one got into a very contorted position at least.

j-team · Post by **j-team** » Tue Jul 19, 2011 7:20 pm

Gerard wrote:And then there's the barrel direction problem. Pointing the barrel towards anything but a down-range direction is forbidden for safety reasons.

You are joking I assume?

Anyone who considers loading this type of pistol to be unsafe, shouldn't be allowed near firearms.

Gerard · Post by **Gerard** » Tue Jul 19, 2011 7:33 pm

My tone is a bit in jest... but owing to the rather pointedly upset reaction I witnessed the very first time I cocked my 46m at a club (about a month ago), it would seem that some folks take air pistol barrel direction very seriously. At home, I was used to shooting from a very narrow doorway. Not a lot of room for elbows. Besides that, I favoured cocking the pistol in front of my chest, for the symmetry of muscular involvement. This action necessitates pointing the barrel through a rather wide arc of movement, bringing it almost directly opposite the target at the extreme end of movement, and sweeping twice through the intervening space. As the fellow pointed out, I was twice pointing the muzzle directly at the shooter next to me.

Of course there was no pellet loaded. I never load a pellet until after cocking the pistol and pointing it down-range. But for a person with a firearms background, I can understand the intense reaction. I've never used a firearm so don't have that built-in set of rules about loaded guns going off 'accidentally' while pointed in the wrong direction. Of course I use a sub-set of such rules with the AP, but consider the gun 'safe' when the transfer port lever is brought up to 90 degrees for example, disabling any possibility of a discharge.

I was mentioning this with the HW75 because there is an approximately similar situation introduced every time the pistol is cocked. And unlike the case with the 46m, where I was able to adapt immediately and cock the pistol in front of my right hip while pointing the barrel down-range, it seems rather unlikely someone could do this with the HW75 or any similar over-lever type. It is absurd, obviously, to imagine an accidental discharge while such a pistol was being cocked. But hey, I've felt the shame of pointing a barrel in the wrong direction at a club... so just passing that along as something worth thinking about. I find it amusing that this should even come up considering the impossibility of injury (except maybe a pinched finger to an over-lever noob), but rules are rules.

j-team · Post by **j-team** » Tue Jul 19, 2011 8:10 pm

I guess this raises another possible reason for the decline in interest for the SSP pistols.

In some cases it might be necessary to "break" your normal shooting stance to reload in a perceived safe manner.

william · Post by **william** » Tue Jul 19, 2011 9:42 pm

When you add up the cost of all of the support equipment necessary to even send the first pellet down range with a PCP or CO2 rifle or pistol, it sometimes exceeds the cost of the rifle or pistol.

Yes, I think it would be nice if someone was to reintroduce high quality SSP air rifles and pistols.

OK, I give up. My scuba tank cost me $125 (I think), and the yoke another $50. I fill it twice a year for free - the dive shop owner finds it amusing how little air I use. And every 5 years (is it 5?) I have to pay a few bucks to have the tank inspected.

And which manufacturer values nostalgia so much that they will set up production for a new $1000 or more SSP pistol for the few dozen people who would actually buy one (not the few hundred who would just like to moon over it and know that it's available when they might [n]ever get around to it)?

So everybody close your eyes and wish REALLY hard. If that doesn't get the K58 back into production, you just didn't believe.

peterz · Post by **peterz** » Tue Jul 19, 2011 11:20 pm

For the price of an HW-75 you can get a new IZZY and maybe even fi,nd a grip maker to match tha 46M's grip to you. That's probably the right way to go, even for a home shooter if you're interested enough in precision shooting to read this!

I'm with William. I just didn't find the cost of a tank that daunting. If you get an old match Co2 gun, you can probably get it on a swap basis. I paid a $40 deposit, pay about $20 to swap the bottle for a full one about twice a year. Precision shooting is such a niche market that nobody will restart a dead production line for sentimental reasons. & you'll never convince a top shooter to use one when it counts.

-Pete

networkguy3 · Post by **networkguy3** » Wed Jul 20, 2011 2:01 pm

Rover wrote:Yeah, the K58 is kind of scarce, but not as scarce as the others. Why don't you put a WTB in the Classifieds here. Also, you can find the FWB100 for a lot less money than the 102 or 103. The performance is equal and I find its simpler design more appealing even if they are kind of large and muzzle heavy. Don't forget the very nice Walther LPM1, probably the rarest but still out there.

Another possibility is to contact Pardini directly and ask if anything can be done. They may have a few laying around or would be willing to make a short run of them. The company is not that big that you can't talk to the boss.

You could try here: http://pardiniguns.com/ (US distributor).

Remember, you only need one.

I put out a want add for a K58 / K60 and did not get any bites on it. Another person did the same thing, but obviously I don't know how their quest went. I thought I'd try putting a want ad out every few months and see what turned up. I've pretty well decided to buy a Izzy in the meantime.

I have spoken to the guy that owns PardiniGuns regarding parts for my SP. He is a very nice fellow. I had not thought of asking him if he knew where one might be available. I'll give it a try and see what happens.

networkguy3 · Post by **networkguy3** » Wed Jul 20, 2011 2:10 pm

peterz wrote:For the price of an HW-75 you can get a new IZZY and maybe even fi,nd a grip maker to match tha 46M's grip to you. That's probably the right way to go, even for a home shooter if you're interested enough in precision shooting to read this!
-Pete

Rink makes grips for the Izzy. They have several options as to size, volume, angle, etc. Unfortunately, they are over $200.

Rover · Post by **Rover** » Wed Jul 20, 2011 5:12 pm

Here ya go...

http://www.network54.com/Forum/79574/me ... New+in+Box

You might have a look here or place an ad looking for a pistol...

http://www.network54.com/Forum/79574/

jipe · Post by **jipe** » Thu Jul 21, 2011 5:26 am

Once again the same discussion about the supposed benefit of SSP pistols compared to PCP pistols.

Look at the reality, have you ever seen anybody using an SSP pistol in competition, even at the lowest level, in the last years ?

I haven't seen anybody using a SSP while I still see many people using (very) old CO2 pistols like the FWB mod 2 !

At my club, we have several club pistols including a couple of FWB 65. Nobody wants to shoot with these while there are people liking our old FWB C25.

zuckerman · Post by **zuckerman** » Thu Jul 21, 2011 7:02 am

there was a guy at the nationals this year with an Izzy.....I did not see his name/score...

william · Post by **william** » Thu Jul 21, 2011 7:13 am

Here ya go...

http://www.network54.com/Forum/79574/me ... New+in+Box

You might have a look here or place an ad looking for a pistol...

http://www.network54.com/Forum/79574/

OK, Rover, we all know there are Izh46's out there for whoever wants them. But all the Izzies in the world don't make a single FWB 103 or Pardini K58 for somebody who wants a step-up. While you're keeping your eyes peeled for technological dinosaurs, let me know if you spot a Leica/Minolta CLE at the right price!

TargetTalk

SSP air pistols

Finding good SSPs

SSP pistol in competition