Sights - same for 50m and 300m prone?

bostonviewer · Post by **bostonviewer** » Tue Jan 18, 2011 10:41 am

I searched TargetTalk for discussions on sights. I found quiet a few, and checked the manufacturer's sites as well. From the "default" Anschutz 7020 to Centra, MEC, Gehman. Also, some hi-power (I assume big bore) like Warner and Phoenix.

My question is, can one buy one set of sights and use them for the ISSF 50m prone and 300m prone events? Without fear of the recoil knocking the zero or breaking the sights. If yes, which (all)?

Reasons are familiarity with one system, keeping costs down, etc etc

Tony C. · Post by **Tony C.** » Tue Jan 18, 2011 8:37 pm

I use the same type of sight with both my small bore and 300 m rifles, Anschutz, Walther, Gehmann...etc

I don't think its a good idea to use one set of sight for several rifles, each rifle should have its own set of sight, this may cost more, but save lots of time plus wear and tear when you switch sight between rifles and need to re-zero again, since its highly unlikely 2 different rifle will have the same sight setting.

Chances are after a few yrs/rifles you'll end up with more sights then rifles.

Eric U · Post by **Eric U** » Tue Jan 18, 2011 11:59 pm

If you feel the need to use only one set of sights for 300m and 50m, you couldn't go wrong with Warner. I know many shooters who use them for American high-power, both cross the course and long range. I also know a couple of very successful guys using them at ISSF 50m.

I've used just about everything at one point in time on my 300m rifles. My old standby is the older Anschutz sight shaped like an "L". This is not the cheap air-rifle sight that looks similar but with the built in sunshade.

I had a bad experience with one of the original Ans 7020 sights on a 300m rifle where it just plain fell apart. I think that sight was #6 off the production line. I don't think Anschutz used loc-tite back then but they do now. I know many shooters who use them now with no issues, but I can't make myself trust it. Love them at 50m though.

I've used Centra sights and they are ok for 300m, but I don't like them for 50m as I bought0 one with clicks that are too big for the 50m target.

Eric U

justadude · Post by **justadude** » Thu Jan 20, 2011 8:20 am

Eric

This raises an interesting question: What would you consider to be the minimum clicks per ring on the 50m target for a sight to acceptable for smallbore?

Thanks
'Dude

NateG · Post by **NateG** » Thu Jan 20, 2011 9:03 am

And so I can better follow the answer asked of Eric... When smallbore shooters talk about clicks per ring, are they talking about the number of clicks to turn a scratch N into a scratch N+1? or the number of clicks to move from a scratch 10 at 3 into a scratch 10 at 9? Or some other variation that I haven't thought of yet? (I just convert everything to arcminutes)

justadude · Post by **justadude** » Thu Jan 20, 2011 9:46 pm

Good question to ask as this will mean different things to different people.

I use "per ring" to refer to scratch 8 to scratch 9 or scratch 9 to scratch 10.

On the 50m target there are 8mm between scoring rings while the 10 ring is 10.4mm across. The distance from ring to ring is well defined. When you start talking about crossing the 10 ring not only is it further across but you get into issues about the center of the bullet impact or the inside edge of the bullet hole and the discussion starts to get murky. To be more precise: How many clicks to move the shot 8mm is acceptable for 50m smallbore?

As my sense is there are a number of juniors on this forum where discussions in arc-anything might be a bit confusing I just throw the question out as "how many clicks per ring is acceptable?" After all, at the end of the day, that is what is down range.... scoring rings.

Cheers,
'Dude

Eric U · Post by **Eric U** » Thu Jan 20, 2011 10:47 pm

The answer to the questions is different for different level shooters. A beginner can get away with 1/4 minute sights. For a more advanced shooter I would say that 1/8 minute is probably the minimum. I'm not sure how this relates to the clicks-per-ring that the Europeans go by. On my Anschutz 7020, I use the fine setting (20 clicks per ring). Just keep in mind that the minutes of angle and clicks per ring are kind of arbitrary numbers. It all depends on your sight radius. Do you use an extension tube? That changes how much your sight will move your point of impact compared to a rifle without one.

Eric U

bostonviewer · Post by **bostonviewer** » Fri Jan 21, 2011 7:16 pm

Thank you Eric, and Tony, justadude, Nate, for the answer. Warner it is for rear sights!

Any suggestions on front sights, and which apertures to use front and rear? Is Gehmann the gold standard for apertures much like Warner is for rear sights? ISSF does not allow lenses, so diopters are out.

Eric U · Post by **Eric U** » Sat Jan 22, 2011 1:15 am

I prefer the Centra non-adjustable glass front apertures. I just use a regular Anschutz 18mm front sight and am pretty happy with it. Many of us prone shooters have tried the 22mm sights and just haven't had good results with them for smallbore. It is almost like they let in too much light and it interferes with getting a clear sight picture. Many of the long range shooters use 22, and even 30mm front sights. I don't know how they do it, other than the fact that most of them use some kind of lens in the front sight.

YMMV,
Eric U