Checking the hits

[hiermax]

Hi!
Last week I´ve made the following experience:
I shot a competition 50m pistol. The targets were mounted on (sorry I don´t know the english word) wires to bring them in and out. This was done electronically.
Now my question: The shooter next to me brought in the target after each shot. He didn´t have a telescope to check the hits, so he pushed the bottom to bring the target in and out. This procedure was disturbing me enormously. I asked the range-officer whether this doing is approved or not. He said "no" but another one said that the shooter can do whatever he wants (concerning the in-and-out procedure).
I couldn´t find any clue in the ISSF-regulations referring to this issue.
Can anybody find an answer?
Thanks
Max

[David Levene]

Get used to it.

Under rule 8.8 (table) you have to change targets every 5 shots so, if a target carrier system is being used, the targets must be brought back and changed then anyway.

The only time when you cannot bring the targets back when you want is in a final where rule 6.16.4.5.3.5 applies:-
"If carrier operated target systems are used the targets must only be brought back to the firing line after the commands “STOP” and “CHANGE TARGETS”, to avoid disturbing other shooters."

[hiermax]

Well, every 5 shots would be ok (at local competitions we change the targets every 10 shots) - but he brought the target back every shot. Is that according to the rules?
Max

[David Levene]

- but he broucht the target back every shot. Is that according to the rules?

Nothing that I know of to stop it.

Remember that if the 50m Prone Rifle or the 10m Air Rifle/Pistol events are shot on a carrier system then, under ISSF rules, apart from in exceptional circumstances they must be brought back for every shot. Shooters just get used to it.

[hiermax]

Yes that seems logically to me. But anyway it´s disturbing my concentration. It seems also that I have to work on it ;-)
Thx
Max

[RobStubbs]

Yes that seems logically to me. But anyway it´s disturbing my concentration. It seems also that I have to work on it ;-)
Thx
Max

Like David says it's perfectly alloweable and at comps on paper targets it's the norm for every shot (on air anyway). You'll get used to it with time so just learn to ignore it.

Rob.

[Guest]

You really need to work on your concentration. If you are noticing someone else return their targets, your focus is not where it should be.

Once you learn to get in your own zone, you wont know or care what's going on around you.

I'll bet that when you see the neighbor shooter's target come back, you sneak a peek at how well/poorly he shot right??? Come on admit it - we've all done it!!

[Gwhite]

The MIT Pistol Team holds an annual get-together with a match between the alumni and the students. We have always been taught that it was impolite to crank your target back while someone next to you is trying to get a shot off. I was shooting next to another alum, and after the match, he apologized for cranking the target back once when I was firing. He was concentrating on his shooting, and hadn't noticed I was about to fire until he had already started his target moving. I hadn't even noticed. It used to bug the heck out of me, but over time my focus has improved.

There are some people out there who will do this intentionally to try to rattle you. You really have to be able to concentrate to deal with that. I try to concentrate REALLY hard on shooting 10 after 10. The best revenge is to outshoot them.

[David Levene]

This boils down to match training (as opposed to technique training). In a match you will get other targets going backwards and forwards so make sure that they also do during your training.

If I am in an AP match on carriers, part of my routine is that when the gun comes down on to the bench after a shot I push the button to return my target, open the loading gate on the pistol, drop a pellet in, look at the target (which has just arrived) to check my shot call, push the button to send the target away and then close the loading hatch. My routine is controlled by me, not by those around me. If they haven't trained to expect targets moving then that is their problem, not mine.

The only time that I will take notice of what my neighbours are doing is when I want to return to the firing point after a break. I will always delay if the shooter on either side has the pistol off the bench.

[madmull]

I asked the range-officer whether this doing is approved or not. He said "no" but another one said that the shooter can do whatever he wants (concerning the in-and-out procedure).

This is strange! I am a range-officer during 50m FP-matches. If i say NO it is NO, even if a shooter is standing in his rights. The shooter can complain after the match to the match-leader about my decision, or stop immedately and leave the shooting-area to make a complain. He will not re-enter the session which is going on even if he is right. A shooter is allowed to bring completly forward the target and back after each shot. Is this wise? At our place no, transporting the target back and forwards will cost him each time more than one minute of his time. If he has to do 60 shots in 2 hours minus transportation time he wil have less then a minute for each shot.
I experienced once a shooter who brought back the target halfway to see the score and then returned the target. In that case i told him to stop doing this because he was now disturbing the other shooters. after some words his site and seeing my faceexpression he was so clever to stop doing it and went on with the match. Shooters next to him where thanking me after the match.

As a shooter i would tell him to buy a scope.

[hiermax]

I asked the range-officer whether this doing is approved or not. He said "no" but another one said that the shooter can do whatever he wants (concerning the in-and-out procedure).

This is strange! I am a range-officer during 50m FP-matches. If i say NO it is NO, even if a shooter is standing in his rights. The shooter can complain after the match to the match-leader about my decision, or stop immedately and leave the shooting-area to make a complain. He will not re-enter the session which is going on even if he is right. A shooter is allowed to bring completly forward the target and back after each shot. Is this wise? At our place no, transporting the target back and forwards will cost him each time more than one minute of his time. If he has to do 60 shots in 2 hours minus transportation time he wil have less then a minute for each shot.
I experienced once a shooter who brought back the target halfway to see the score and then returned the target. In that case i told him to stop doing this because he was now disturbing the other shooters. after some words his site and seeing my faceexpression he was so clever to stop doing it and went on with the match. Shooters next to him where thanking me after the match.

As a shooter i would tell him to buy a scope.

Thanks for your input. To put this clear: When the first range-officer said his "no" the shooter stoped immediately the "in-out-procedure" and the RO brought him a scope. The "yes" of the second RO came after the match. Now it seems clear to me: Any shooter can bring the targets in and out as often as he wants. And I have to concentrate more on the target than on my neighbour´s doing ;-)
Regards
Max