TargetTalk

Just curious, has anyone who shoots 32 in CF ever calculated whether it'd make much of a difference if 32 had to be scored as 32 instead of 38? I'm intending to start shooting CF with a S&W K38 (having shot the event as Sport Pistol with a 22, so far). I can't help noticing that the only 32s available are Pardinis and Walthers. Presumably they have an advantage over the 38 revolvers for several reasons inherent in the gun and the caliber. I do wonder how much more help this little fiddle in the scoring rules brings to the 32.

Without doing the analysis at a guess I'd say a few points per match if they all landed in identical spots, but its easier to shoot better groups with a .32.

Manuhrin make .32 match revolvers, a few others make autos.

I played the same game, using a .38 auto and revolver. There is NO scoring advantage since the .32 holes are scored with a .38 plug if you don't like what your scorer said. .32 holes are the same size as .38s for scoring purposes in Itnl. competition, but not in Bullseye. Liking a .45?

We need to remember that the "score as .38" also benefits .38 Special revolver shooters (although not as much).

You get the same thing in the.22LR and air events where the score is computed at the nominal calibre, rather than at the actual projectile diameter.

Of course, when using electronics the score is calculated from the centre of projectile rather than at the edge.

Try this scoring...International 13 shot Blackpowder is shot with so many different
calibres that it is scored with half ball scoring.
You have to get the centre of the shot over the line to score the higher score.
This makes the 10 ring very small.

David M wrote: ↑Fri Jan 29, 2021 5:51 pm You have to get the centre of the shot over the line to score the higher score.

That is exactly the same principle as ISSF score measurement.
The score is based on the centre of the shot, but its relationship to the scoring ring is checked either with oversized plug gauges or electronically.

Rover wrote: ↑Fri Jan 29, 2021 9:14 am I played the same game, using a .38 auto and revolver. There is NO scoring advantage since the .32 holes are scored with a .38 plug if you don't like what your scorer said. .32 holes are the same size as .38s for scoring purposes in Itnl. competition, but not in Bullseye. Liking a .45?

I have to wonder what the history of this is. I'd say it works to make the sport less accessible at the club level. The European .32 auto pistols are very expensive (and seldom available used, it seems). Good .38 Spl revolvers like my K38 are much more easy to find, new or used. They're inherently less accurate than the European .32s, I suppose, and do recoil noticeably more (even with 148 gr Wadcutters). On top of that, those shooting the Euro pistols get the advantage of scoring as if they were shooting the larger projectile (.357/9mm). This is not the way to encourage gun club members in North America toward ISSF shooting. It's a much higher barrier to entry than the ISSF rules for the .22 events since decent used European pistols are more available at reasonable cost, and US made handguns can be sufficient too, especially if you're used to one already. I have to wonder if the ISSF put this .32 scoring rule in place, back in the day, to give European shooters a leg up over all those Americans with their .38 Spl revolvers and autos. (I speak as a Canadian who's trying to grow ISSF pistol shooting in my town.)

The rules state that you can use any pistol (or revolver) from .30 to .38 that fits in the box...
That gives you plenty of choice.
You don't have to go strait to .38 for american revolvers, S&W did make some pretty decent revolvers in .32
That said, recoil is a non issue in center fire pistol. You don't have sustained fire...

Hope this helps

David Levene wrote: ↑Sat Jan 30, 2021 2:58 am That is exactly the same principle as ISSF score measurement.
The score is based on the centre of the shot, but its relationship to the scoring ring is checked either with oversized plug gauges or electronically.

In ISSF the electronic may use the centre of the shot to read but not how its scored.
ISSF if you gauge to the line you get the higher score, in MLAIC you need half of the shot over the line to get the higher score.
Many a time I have cut the 10 ring only to score a 9.

David M wrote: ↑Sun Jan 31, 2021 8:21 pm

David Levene wrote: ↑Sat Jan 30, 2021 2:58 am That is exactly the same principle as ISSF score measurement.
The score is based on the centre of the shot, but its relationship to the scoring ring is checked either with oversized plug gauges or electronically.

In ISSF the electronic may use the centre of the shot to read but not how its scored.
ISSF if you gauge to the line you get the higher score, in MLAIC you need half of the shot over the line to get the higher score.
Many a time I have cut the 10 ring only to score a 9.

I didn't explain myself well. If the diameter of all ISSF scoring rings was increased by the nominal diameter of the projectile then it would be exactly the same: half the shot over the line.
The scoring rings really are only one way of giving the result. Moving the rings does not mean that you are shooting better or worse; that's controlled by the centre of the shot.

[quote=Hamster post_id=304380 time=1612035908 user_id=19526]
[quote=Rover post_id=304337 time=1611929699 user_id=3828]
I played the same game, using a .38 auto and revolver. There is NO scoring advantage since the .32 holes are scored with a .38 plug if you don't like what your scorer said. .32 holes are the same size as .38s for scoring purposes in Itnl. competition, but not in Bullseye. Liking a .45?
[/quote] I have to wonder what the history of this is. I'd say it works to make the sport less accessible at the club level. The European .32 auto pistols are very expensive (and seldom available used, it seems). Good .38 Spl revolvers like my K38 are much more easy to find, new or used. They're inherently less accurate than the European .32s, I suppose, and do recoil noticeably more (even with 148 gr Wadcutters). On top of that, those shooting the Euro pistols get the advantage of scoring as if they were shooting the larger projectile (.357/9mm). This is not the way to encourage gun club members in North America toward ISSF shooting. It's a much higher barrier to entry than the ISSF rules for the .22 events since decent used European pistols are more available at reasonable cost, and US made handguns can be sufficient too, especially if you're used to one already. I have to wonder if the ISSF put this .32 scoring rule in place, back in the day, to give European shooters a leg up over all those Americans with their .38 Spl revolvers and autos. (I speak as a Canadian who's trying to grow ISSF pistol shooting in my town.)
[/quote]

I seem to recall that the record, world or Olympic not sure, was shot with a 7.62 TOZ revolver, so possibly no disadvantage shooting either a 30cal or revolver.
Also revolvers don't usually jam when the fired case catches in the brass catcher so maybe the Euro 32s need scoring help to compensate for all their reliability problems, just a thought.