TargetTalk

I have had no luck finding Passport Program Pins or other awards under the former USA Shooting (and now 4H) Passport Program. My search found a 2011 TargetTalk article saying USA Shooting turned over all the pins to the 4H supply site. So I went to the 4H sales site and could find no pins as of today. I have an email in process asking 4H sales about these award pins.

If anyone has information about this Passport Program and its awards please let me know. Is the Passport Program still alive? If so, where can I buy the award pins and stuff?

I think there is a youth shooter award program from Winchester/NRA that I will look into next to help our county rifle program have some sort of formal award structure.

The quick answer is yes it's gone. While at Nebraska in June I was talking to a National 4-H committee member about the program because we use/used it. He make a quick remark that I better hurry up and buy all the medals because once their gone their gone.

I know lots of programs that use Winchester/NRA patches in a developmental way. If you want the goal setting if the USA passport let me know and I can send you a passport or two and probably bronze/silver starter medals.

Kinda bummed since I've had youth working hard and one was on track for gold star in air rifle this year.

I concur that this was a great program. I attribute much of the early success we had with shooters in our program years ago to this.
The downside (to the coaches pocket) was that I paid for these awards myself and at $3/pin it did get expensive in some years.
But, I look thru the CMP 3-P air national records and every one of the kids that is/was in our program that is on that list was greatly motivated by the Passport program.

I stopped the program a few years ago because I could not get the "Basic" pins anymore. I probably have a scattering of pins still, but at the higher levels. If someone may be interested, let me know and I'll inventory what I have.

This program cost USA Shooting little in administrative time, but as youth directors moved on, the corporate knowledge and reasoning for these types of youth programs die at USAS. Bob Foth was a great promoter of this program ... if he sees this he knows how grateful I am to his early work and patience w/ me as a coach.

I figured it was defunct. Too many different pins and such to keep in inventory. Too bad, I am just starting as a 4H coach and this program looked perfect to me.

Now I'm thinking of paper certificates, with the only effort needed is to make up an original, or add to something already existing design, then printing one when needed.

For wearable awards, simple colored pins, gold-silver-bronze, all having the same design, and only three levels of award total, would simplify things.

Or maybe better yet, new designs suitable to send to an applique or machine embroidery company. Fabric badges of all shapes are old school from the earliest Boy Scout merit badge days, and modern automated embroidery machines allow people to send designs anywhere and get patches/badges made up to order, no inventory required, just send us the Photoshop design by email attachment.

Heck maybe I'll just get with a local awards company and make up award badges with my local club info on them.

I appreciate the offers of pins but I will try some other method. I already have a small box full of pins, the kind with two lower loops so additional award levels can be displayed below the main badge. But mine say only 'Marksman" or "Sharpshooter" and I don't have any idea what they were originally for.

If anyone with 4H Passport Program at any time is reading this, please get in touch with me and maybe we can work out a method to keep some or all of the awards available, maybe in a different format, but without the expense of a large inventory.

I contacted USAS about this a few weeks ago since they were not sold on the 4H site anymore. Got an email back that USAS had contacted 4H and 4H decided not to sell them anymore. 4H apparently decided this without consulting USAS.

Real shame; we use this program and really like it.

jhmartin, I sent you a PM about your pin inventory...

Would be nice to find out who has the inventory and then see if they would give it up to at least exhaust the stocks.

It's hard for any sanctioning organization to take 4-H seriously. I think (hope?) that most of the 4-H programs follow a common set of rules ... those laid out for the Nationals which are a combination of NRA or CMP rules, but too many organizations, counties, and yes, even states make up their own mix and match rule sets.

This causes great consternation when after a match (run by these mix & match - made up - rules) parents/coaches, etc contact USAS, NRA, CMP and complain ... and these organizations rightly state that since the match was not run according to published rules and not a sanctioned match, they can do nothing .....
In the end it is up to the parents and most importantly the shooters to push the agenda of using published rules and then sanctioning the match ... with the appropriate governing body ... USAS, NRA, CMP ... it does not matter.

After over 10 years of 4-H coaching (archery, rifle) I no longer get irritated when I get the "eye roll" when I state I coach for a 4-H organization ... I just grudgingly accept it ... and let my shooters scores do the talking ... not all 4-H programs are unorganized

I am sad to report that the National 4H Supply no longer sells the Passport achievement award pins due to the lack of sales and interest.

The remaining inventory was disposed of without consulting USA Shooting due to the fact that the National 4H Merchandise Manager left the organization and the new person in charge did not know to contact USA Shooting about this decision to stop sales and throw out the remaining inventory instead of sending it back to USAS.

Because USAS was not getting much interest or sales of the pins, it was decided to ship all the inventory to National 4H Supply back in 2011 to get more visibility on their store website. From the last sales report that I saw, 4H has not sold that much more than USAS (slight increase, but not significant).

If there had been more interest and pin sales, I'm sure that 4H National would have continued the program.

At this time there are no plans to re-start the Passport program.

Mike Theimer
Youth Programs Manager
USA Shooting

Just curious, I hear the tenor from Mike but IMHO the reason the program failed was lack of support from either organization not "lack of sales and interest".

I have never heard USAS say, "hey you know what is a great way to get kids involved is through the USAS-4H Passport program." Not that I know the whole internal politics, When I stumbled across the program tucked in the archives of the USAS website I was just trying to be involved with a program to grow my shooters, but it looked like USAS just shoved it off onto 4-H who had no idea what to do with it and so it disappeared. Is it surprising there was a lack of sales?

To expand the discussion, Mike do you really feel the necessary effort and cross roads have been established to fully optimize the relationship with National and State level 4-H organizations and make the attempt to develop the base that they have?

Just to be upfront my politics are neutral here. Our state 4-H is stubborn and unwilling to work with USAS, CMP or NRA and even in the face of being wrong they wont move. I found USAS as an avenue to take the youth I coach to a higher level of competition and they used the passport program with some success. However, now with our involvement with USAS I dont hear USAS promoting 4-H either. The closest I heard was at Coachs College where 4-H was identified as a "resource" that needed to be tapped to help expand the USAS base.

Just curious I guess. It seems the real connectivity (of 4-H and USAS) comes from coaches in 4-H searching for a way to elevate their shooters or give them other shooting avenues in the off season. Is that a fair assessment Joel?

To set the record straight, I have made every effort to work with 4H National, but there is no 4H National Shooting Program coordinator that I have been able to find. I do know about the 'instructor training committee' and I have a very good friend who is on that committee, the Arkansas 4H shooting program coordinator, Rex Roberg.

Two USAS national assistant pistol coaches went to the 4H National Convention this year. We attracted some attention. Its been several months and I have not received any calls from any state 4H shooting program coordinators who expressed an interest.

The bottomline is that the state 4H shooting program coordinators run their programs the way that they want to run them. We have reached out to them and very few responded. For the most part state 4H shooting programs are about gun safety and recreational shooting. For the most part they are not interested in competitive shooting (e.g. Olympic or NRA or CMP). As you have recognized in your posting.

As the USAS Youth Programs manager, I am a one person department with a part time intern. I run many programs, events and the PPP Nationals each year. I do not have time to 'politic' with all the state 4H shooting program coordinators to convince them that they need to provide a competitive shooting program. My time is better spent working with those who are interested in competitive shooting programs.

If you would like to volunteer to contact each state 4H shooting program coordinator for USAS to try to get them interested in competitive shooting programs, I would welcome your help.

COBelties wrote:It seems the real connectivity (of 4-H and USAS) comes from coaches in 4-H searching for a way to elevate their shooters or give them other shooting avenues in the off season. Is that a fair assessment Joel?

Opinion: After 10 years of coaching in 4-H I've met very few coaches that are interested in working hard enough to help elevate the youth ... (note that by that statement there ARE indeed some)
Most wish it to happen, but work only a few months of the year (if that!)with the kids ... If you are wanting to bring shooters along and get them into the 80% and above bracket you need to work with the kids 10-11 months (min) of the year. 4-H just does not encourage that. Why??? Lots of reasons ... short signups (Here in NM we run signups Feb-Sept ... that's it ... short season) 4-H is a volunteer run organization ... the leaders (club & project) are the heart of the programs and they get burned out quickly and often.

Mike has a valid point ... When I was REALLY gung-ho I went and got my Level-3 Rifle/Level-2 Shotgun/NCDS certs with the idea I'd crusade in the 4-H ranks and get a bunch of coaches trained up and we'd have a really strong system to bring kids into the ranks of the national competitions. His predecessor, Bob, thought I was crazy ... our new national coach thought I was crazy (he ran the coach program for the NRA at the time) ... and you know what? I WAS crazy ... I not only got told "NO" , it was a very impolite way of being told NO.
As Mike has suggested, over the years I've chatted with many county, state and national directors in the 4-H program ... pleaded with them, and there is really nothing to show for it. Well, not totally true ... AT LEAST the rules fiascos are gone ... everyone at 4-H Nationals should have a good idea what their kids will be shooting when they get there ... THANKS to Nebraska for picking up the rope and tugging on it for the next few years!
There are very few states (any???) where rules are the same from county to county ... Puuuleeeze!!! I'm an engineer and some standardization would be welcome. Much of our time in our program was focused on CMP 3-P air just because of that rules standardization across the state in the high schools ... my 10&11 year olds shot head to head with the high schoolers ... and did well.

As Mike T wrote:The bottomline is that the state 4H shooting program coordinators run their programs the way that they want to run them. We have reached out to them and very few responded. For the most part state 4H shooting programs are about gun safety and recreational shooting. For the most part they are not interested in competitive shooting (e.g. Olympic or NRA or CMP).

It's very sad & unfortunate ... I'm cutting way back on my 4-H support this year (I'm burned out). I'm only basically dealing with the kids I've brought up so far that are interested in competing and putting in the effort.
I am not going to blame or criticize the kids who have many interests and many cards they are playing at the same time, but I'm looking to work with the athletes willing to do what it takes to give a serious try to get to the JOs, shoot well at national events, and possibly continue shooting in college (NCAA or Intercollegiate Club).
I'll help the parents that want to take on the "coach" title too ... but they have to be serious ... I consider taking the time to get a Level-1 the bare minimum.

In terms of the 4-H passport ... when we used the program heavily, I was told I was about the only one purchasing the pins ... so, for a while I had a great supply, but as we ran out of the early pins, Basics & Bronze's, it was hard to keep it going.

(Note I've not done my inventory yet ... got called by a cute girl to go watch a match at UNL last week ... reminder to self.....)

I have been struggling to communicate and encourage collegiate coaches to attend coach clinics, conferences and coach courses. I have sent out surveys to 3PAR coaches, club coaches, etc. I get very little response except from the most dedicated coaches which are few and far between unfortunately.

What I hear from those few dedicated coaches is that its hard to 'recruit and retain' not only potential Olympic athletes, but parents who are needed to carry on the program after the others have 'burned' out or became discouraged at the lack of support that they got from parents, school administration, anti-gun education board members, liberal media ...and the list goes on.

If I could clone those dedicated coaches all over the country, competitive shooting sports would become an excepted and respected scholastic sport in all of our public schools and universities.

Which brings me to where I have chosen to focus my efforts... coach education and development. Without the coaches, there are no youth shooting programs. Coaches are the 'multipliers'. We need more dedicated coaches. What good are skill achievement pins without a coach to encourage and develop the athletes.

76Olympian wrote:What good are skill achievement pins without a coach to encourage and develop the athletes.

Mike... they are one of the tools a coach can use to encourage. The younger or new kids in this sport are very extrinsically motivated, those are the "barbs" on the hook that can keep their eyes bright & shiny. These have to be available quickly and in a timely fashion for them to be an attraction (and colorful too!).
(A note here, one of my daughters received an NRA medal the other week for a match in February, she could not even remember what it was for... laughed and tossed it in a drawer ... did I mention timely?)

As the kids mature, and they begin to develop a sense of what is possible in the sport, and move into the "serious" shooting with USAS/NRA/CMP the hook then becomes the high level shooters they meet (some of the best motivation are the National Team members) and get the chance to talk to, as well as the lifetime friends they make at camps, matches and places like their dorm room at events like Winter Airgun, Rocky & the JOs.

This has been and still is a great sport for my own kids and having the opportunity to learn and progress with them has been fantastic ... but unfortunately not all parents enjoy their kids as much as I have ... and then again, some truly don't have the time I've been willing to give them.

Thanks to Joel for steering this in the right direction. I suppose I am the minority crazy supportive volunteer, I've completed through the Level 3 Coach's program, done all the NRA certifications, coached youth in national competitions and been a state coach at National 4-H events as well.

We started with a small amount of shooters and built our local program, four years ago we didnt even know USAS existed, and now we have almost 10 youth shooting year round in either Rifle or Shotgun with USAS, CMP and 4-H. Yes its a small minority compared to the 200 youth in our 4-H shooting sports program, but its gaining. That was monumental grass roots doing the heavy lifting, but I'm thankful to the volunteers who have stepped up.

I agree with you both, and I dont think realistically outreach (in 4-H) is through the national or state level 4-H coordinators, it has to be through the coachs, which I think everyone recognizes. Keeping the interest of the youth and supporting coachs is really where I see USAS could make some great in roads.

I was at a meeting last night with coaches who run a grassroots NRA indoor precision club, and I'm doing an outreach meeting in 2 weeks to help inform their shooters and parents about opportunities outside of their local club. Not that I know alot, the timelines and scheduling of postals, CMP, NRA, and USAS (not so much) is so convoluted I can barely figure it out. The interest is there to reach beyond to the local programs. They want to see their shooters move beyond the base and are willing to learn about it. Whats the solution? Whats the here and now pathway we can provide them? What helps move them in the right direction now while their interest is there? Strike while the irons hot so to say.

We enjoy USAS and I have been lucky to be introduced and have shooters involved that are equally as passionate. I do understand the frustration of parents, coaches and youth on the outside who dont know how to get in, since I had to figure it out on my own, and in my small way I try my best to help others understand, encourage them to coaches level 1 and navigate rules, expectations, etc.

I greatly appreciate what you both are doing for our shooting sport, the young athletes that you work with, and hope that you don't get burned out doing what you do. We need you to be around awhile and mentor others to follow in your footsteps.

I'm always open to ways to better communicate the Olympic path to athletes, coaches and parents. I have links to the video "Olympic Shooting sports" on the Youth Program web pages which explains the 15 Olympic shooting events and seven athlete interviews. It makes for a great stand alone presentation to groups of parents and kids.

I'm updating that video with results from 2012 London Games. I should have the link updated in about two weeks. Feel free to circulate that video.

The Olympic path for junior athletes poster is also downloadable from the Youth Program web pages. Its usually at the bottom of each page.. with a few exceptions. I will post a downloadable high res jpg version if you want to print large format 2x3 foot posters.

Feel free to contact me anytime.
Mike Theimer
USA Shooting

Our 4-H club uses the Winchester/NRA Qualification program.
http://mqp.nra.org
We teach/train in 4P BB gun, 3P Sporter, 3P Precision, International Air and Smallbore.
There are separate qualification forms for each discipline and we also encourage parents to qualify if they would like. Our club purchaces the beginners Pro-Marksman medal when they complete the first level,then we just use the paper awards from the NRA and the gold stars as they make the bars(different levels). When they complete a discipline to the end, we purchase the Distinguished Expert medal and patch for the shooter. This helps keep the cost manageable, but they get enough in return for their work, that they usually keep pushing. My oldest daughter is DE in 3 disciplines and my younger daughter is DE in one and close on #2.
Hope this helps.

I will say that while the program through 4-h has defunct I am glad to have the information and knowledge of what expectations need to be met for shooters interested in continuing on to upper levels. I saw USAS as something different from CMP and NRA programs but a nice middle ground for a long term perspective. Those goal levels are still needed to give shooters a clear vision and pathway to follow.

For us the NRA program is a good jumping off point but doesn't go far enough for my upper range shooters. It looks good that they have finished it but most of my scholastic shooters can easily muster through it in a 3 month season.

The CMP JR EIC programs is great but with new points ranges it will become more difficult to achieve when we live so far from CMP shooting venues and support programs. CMP has some great things if you are close enough to their program hubs.

I guess I am a gung-ho supporter of youth programs. I train shooters 11 months out of the year. 3 months varsity scholastic and 8 months through out precision 4h club. I appreciate the work so many do and hope I can make more coaching clinics and forums in the future.