TargetTalk

Can anybody that shoots a Pardini K2S give me some info on pellet sizes? I've notice that there are different size pellets available so perhaps one size is mo betta than another? I've been shooting RWS Diabolo Basic 4.5mm with no problem. Should I just stick with that or spend a few buck and experiment with others? Thanks
Rebecca

You should really use .177 pellets.

You could check this out....

viewtopic.php?t=23073

Did you enjoy Hawaii?

Rover wrote:You should really use .177 pellets.

I presume that was a joke, wasn't it?

.177 = 4.5mm

Rebecca Smith wrote:Can anybody that shoots a Pardini K2S give me some info on pellet sizes? I've notice that there are different size pellets available so perhaps one size is mo betta than another? I've been shooting RWS Diabolo Basic 4.5mm with no problem. Should I just stick with that or spend a few buck and experiment with others? Thanks
Rebecca

RWS are excellent pellets but not always suited to every pistol also i die tested these pellets and they vary in size even though they are supposed to be 4.5mm my sizer is 4.52 and they either drop so far through or stay proud and to me if 4.50 are sticking out of a 4.52 die i think quality control is not too good
experiment is best ok so you pay for a few different pellet brands but the end product should be a tighter group than you may be getting now, what suits one pistol may not suit yours even the same make can have a different barrel you cannot really go by a test that someone else has done they may be in death valley when they tested their gun you could be in the arctic circle so the variation in atmospheric presure/humidity could alter them.
hope this helps
Will

What he said...

But, the RWS Basics are so good that I would stay with them, especially with their low price.

The RWS Basics are great for their cost, but are no match (no pun intended) for a premium pellet. I found that going from the Meisterklugens (a step up from Basics) to the R-10 7gm pellets shaved 10 points off my score.
Sorry to disagree Rover but I don't see the logic of spending $1000+ for a pistol then trying to save a buck and a half on a lesser pellet that is 'nearly' as good as the better pellet.

bobtodrick wrote:.......... I don't see the logic of spending $1000+ for a pistol then trying to save a buck and a half on a lesser pellet that is 'nearly' as good as the better pellet.

I couldn't agree more.

Even when training, if the success of that training is judged by shot hole position then you should be using the very best pellet that's available for your gun. Anything else will be giving you false results.

well i dont agree with you david .. in practice we must focus on other things like trigger, sight alignment and so on ... in other words to correct our mistakes .... a good exercise is to shoot on a blank target ... if we do get our act together then scores will come. Also i never noticed a shooter transitioning from meisterkugeln to R10 and gain 10 points. i shoot JSB match at the moment and i do have some JSB standard tins but only because my supplier didnt have more JSB match.

ghostrip...okay so here's the scenario. You're shooting at a blank paper, trying to improve, say your trigger release. An R-10 gives you a 5 shot spread off of a rest of .15" and the Basic gives you .25"(these are only examples, but within reason).
You don't feel that narrowing the of shot placement due to pellet descrepancy helps you decide when you have 'hit' on the proper release technique for you and your gun?
I think your wrong.

guns of 1000$ put several shots within the 10X ring. even with meisterkugeln how much the group will open? i dont care where the pellet landed on practise. i strive to pull the trigger without messing the sight picture. this can be done and its similar to dry firing .... live firing the gun just makes it more realistic and it can be done with the cheapest pellet.

ghostrip wrote:i dont care where the pellet landed on practise. i strive to pull the trigger without messing the sight picture. this can be done and its similar to dry firing .... live firing the gun just makes it more realistic and it can be done with the cheapest pellet.

That's fine, providing you don't judge the results of your trigger/sight picture concentration by where the shots appear. If you just treat it as dry firing but with the feel of live firing then you can just keep going all evening without changing the target.

certainly you dont look the target ... but my humble opinion is that most modern airguns are so consistant that going from meisterkugeln to R10 is more of a mental thing. In my Izh R10 (.45grams) puts 150m/s, JSB Match/schak 135m/s and H&N Finale Match rifle 120m/s and they all group very well. The only thing is they not land verticaly on the same spot

Sorry ghostrip, but chinzing to save $1.50 is never going to get you into the winners circle in any sporting event. The only way to guarantee improvment is to cut out all equipment variables. If you're only competing on an informal basis fine...but if not...you talk of the "ability' of a pellet to consistently land in the 10 ring (Meisterkluglen)...I highly doubt if any 'shooter' who can repeatedly hit the 10 in competition, as they practice hours every day would agree that saving a buck and a half is a worthwhile saving.
If there are any shooters here that are at this level I'd be interested in their opinion.

ghostrip wrote:... but my humble opinion is that most modern airguns are so consistant that going from meisterkugeln to R10 is more of a mental thing.

That's a big enough difference for me, and justifies using the best pellets even if they are more expensive.

Just my 2 cents worth. I very carefully test a number of top quality pellets and select the one that performes best in the oistol I am training and competing with. Then I purchase as many of the best pellet I can afford. of the same lot number. My training is based on having the shot be on call every time I shoot. I contend that training with any thing less than the best pe;;et is detrimental to consist progress. Pound wise and penny foolish is just not the right way to go. Good shooting Bill Horton

dollars does not buy you tens bobtodrick. otherwise with my hubble izzy i would have to be at the bottom of the lists in regular matches in my country and i am not. there also many stories from top shooters that shoot great results with cheap ammo (even world records) ... i am not saying do not buy the expensive stuff (if you see i have pellets from all major brands in my country and i have tried maisterkugeln as well) but analyze everything and if you can all test your gun with all brands

Obviously a dead thread. No matter how many people are going to disagree ghostrip is 'right'.
BTW, your statement about all these top shooters who use the cheap pellets, my ISSF magazines do not seem to bare this out.

While the link was posted earlier I assume folks did not go there because the link seemed to refer to building a home range...
http://www.pilkguns.com/buildrange.shtml

Just so you don't have to go to the link following is a quote from our host Scott who knows a bit about pellet manufacturing...

I agree and think that the pellet is the least of the worries for an aspiring shooter. For those at the Olympic levels it probably matters more psychologically, but hey - whatever works.
Jim



Pellets
The most most common question we are asked is, "Which is the best pellet for my gun?" This of course a difficult question to answer, but before we get too involved, let's put it into perspective.

As long as we're talking good quality match pellets (such as H&N, RWS, Vogel, etc) even the worst grouping pellet will still easily hold the x-ring on a pistol target. This means that even a high level competitor is not likely to ever benefit much from batch testing to find the ultimate grouping pellet in his pistol. Having said that however, it's a nice feeling to know that your gun/pellet combination shoots a tight one-hole group, and the effort of testing for peace of mind could be considered time well spent, if only from a self-confidence point of view. But you should never have the illusion that it will make a noticeable difference to your scores.

Air Rifle is a little different, since a ten ring of .5mm makes the best possible accuracy far more important. Anything less than a tight slightly oval hole would mean perfect scores are not possible.

Just to further cloud the issue, simply knowing the diameter of the pellet used in the factory to shoot the best group does not mean your gun will always shoot the best group with that diameter. We see just as much variation between pellets of different batches, even if they are sized exactly the same. So you may well have one testing session when a 4.49mm .53 gram pellet may shoot the best. Twelve months later, with different batches, the winner could easily be a 4.50mm in .50 gram. There is no way of knowing in advance.

Our advice? By all means if you can test your gun easily, do so. If you shoot a pistol and have no way of testing it, stick to the factory test diameter and be happy. If you shoot something like an IZH, which comes with no test target, try standard sized good quality pellets and you will have great accuracy. Testing single stroke pneumatics and spring powered guns is very difficult anyway. But try to keep the whole concept in perspective, it's not worth losing any sleep over.

You guys...

You know what they say about opinions...everyone has one and very few will bear close inspection.

Apparently, some did not check out the tests at the beginning of this post, so we're talking opinions here. We don't want to look at THOSE!

In the tests; yes, the R10s beat the Basics....by .007" (7 thousandths of an inch), but the results were reversed with the other gun. The difference between the best and worst groups was 1/10th inch.

The test was with 25 or 30 shot groups, not misleading 3 or 5 shot groups.
All shots fired in the test would have hit the "11" ring and the hole of the worst group would support a cigarette filter.

As far as cost; I can buy about three sleeves of the Basics for the price of one sleeve of the expensive pellets.

Rebecca, buy the Basics, save your pellet money and buy an entry into the (formerly) 3X Air. Buy one of the "Big Boys" a beer at the Phantom Canyon and pick his brain, then go forth and conquer.

Disagree with this? Do your own damn tests!