TargetTalk

I'm looking for a small table to put in front of me to more accurately recreate an AP competition during training. When I shoot at the local club, we use the standard folding 8 foot long tables, which are probably 28" high. I was about to buy a small 36" version of one of those, but remember that when I shot in Colorado Springs, those "tables" are significantly different. They were much more shallow and taller as I recall.

It would make more sense to recreate the table's used in Colorado Springs --if that's the standard for ISSF-type matches. Since they are smaller, it would be the lowest common denominator from which to train -since it's easier to go bigger and lower when at other matches than it would be to go smaller and higher.

Curious what anyone else might use to recreate the table at an ISSF AP/AR match?

Oz

Under ISSF rules the firing point must be equipped with "a bench or stand, 0.7 m – 0.8 m high" (Rule 6.3.12.2.1).

Also, Rule 6.3.15.1.1:-
"The nearest edge of the bench or stand must be placed 10 cm forward of the 10 m Firing line. The use of a board as a firing line is not permitted."

Hope this helps.

Ah, thanks. I'm surprised that there's nothing about the depth of the table or how much width is allowed for each shooter's station.

If the only standard is 70-80cm, that's enough for me! I would have sworn that the table height at the ranges at the US Olympic Training Center were significantly taller than this, but I'm certain that they would be ISSF compliant in this matter. I know the line is 10cm in front of the edge of those tables.

Oz wrote:Ah, thanks. I'm surprised that there's nothing about the depth of the table or how much width is allowed for each shooter's station.

6.3.15.1 "The firing point must be a minimum of 1 m wide."

There's nothing I know of that gives width or depth of the table top.

The patheticly low table height imposed by the ISSF is because of the paralympics.

j-team wrote:The patheticly low table height imposed by the ISSF is because of the paralympics.

It's not 'pathetically low' if you're a short ar$e.

And most of the taller shooters shoot off of their gun case, to get a more comfortable height for them. I don't need to, see above ;)

Rob.

There were other reasons for table height etc. Back in the good old UIT days when target heights were 1.5-m and table heights were higher, the UIT were lobbied by far East countries because their shooters were on average much shorter than European/Western shooters plus more and more juniors from all over the world were taking up the sport.
The UIT re set the target height to 1.4-m and the table height was correspondingly lowered. I really don't remember what the old dimensions were but when the ISSF came into being, they really got very strict on these new dimensions.

A Rob said, for very short people the tables can be too high and for tall people too low. Most rifle shooters now will probably be using a rifle stand so table height is not so much of an issue, but pistol shooters who have no option but to use the table will have to make compromises.
It would be interesting to find out what the ISSF think of a tall pistol shooter placing his/her pistol case on the table to raise the resting suface for the pistol?
Peeps

peepsight wrote:It would be interesting to find out what the ISSF think of a tall pistol shooter placing his/her pistol case on the table to raise the resting suface for the pistol?

I have looked for anything about this in the rules many times over the years but never found anything. I shoot with my 8" deep case on the table.

It's interesting that in the 2001 rules and the first printing of the 2005 rules the bench or stand had to be "removable or adjustable". Those words disappeared in the 2005 second printing (and remained out in the third printing and the 2009 rules).

David, just carry on doing what's best for you and if a range officer taps you on the shoulder, ask him to produce the rules [if there are any], if he can't then you have every right to continue shooting.

I have seen many pistol shooters at ISSF run matches use their gun box or similar to rest their pistol on during the match and none to my knowledge have been challenged for doing it.
Peeps

Very interesting. I didn't even consider that using the pistol box as a prop could be questioned by the judges. I'm about 6' 2" (187cm) and the 70-80cm tables are painfully low.

I put a towel folded up to create a triangular wedge which then sits on my pistol box. That is the ONLY way I can comfortably rest my pistol on the table while holding it between shots and for loading.

We will do what we must.

Oz

Oz wrote:Very interesting. I didn't even consider that using the pistol box as a prop could be questioned by the judges. I'm about 6' 2" (187cm) and the 70-80cm tables are painfully low.

Oh I never thought it was a problem Oz. It doesn't matter how well you know the rules though, it doesn't hurt to double-check now and again.

I could just imagine the ribbing I would take if I was to be pinged for breaking a rule like that (if it existed). When you normally run the ranges you have to be "squeaky clean" when you are shooting.

David Levene wrote: I could just imagine the ribbing I would take if I was to be pinged for breaking a rule like that (if it existed). When you normally run the ranges you have to be "squeaky clean" when you are shooting.

LOL... Oh the added pressure! They should spot you 3 points extra!

---

Now this is odd! The latest issue of USA Shooting has pics from 3XAir in Colorado Springs. I know that most of these guys shown are in the 5'10-6' range (175-185cm). As you can see from where they hit the tables, it's obvious that the US Olympic Training Center is not using ISSF compliant table heights.



Which makes me feel much better because I thought I was going crazy![/img]

Oz wrote: As you can see from where they hit the tables, it's obvious that the US Olympic Training Center is not using ISSF compliant table heights.

No, they probably just applied common sense when they built the range!