TargetTalk

I shoot both NRA and International pistol. I'm in the process of buying a new wad gun for NRA competitions. Most wad guns use a Red Dot sight as NRA rules allow for this. Since I still enjoy and want to continue shooting International pistol as well I am curious as to if I should use a red dot or stick with iron sights. I am afraid that learning a new sight system may affect my international shooting where I am required to use iron sights. What do you all think?

Thanks
Jim

kpuscg04 wrote:I shoot both NRA and International pistol. I'm in the process of buying a new wad gun for NRA competitions. Most wad guns use a Red Dot sight as NRA rules allow for this. Since I still enjoy and want to continue shooting International pistol as well I am curious as to if I should use a red dot or stick with iron sights. I am afraid that learning a new sight system may affect my international shooting where I am required to use iron sights. What do you all think?

Thanks
Jim

Last summer I shot in a 22 BE league using a Pardini with a red dot. I switched over to iron sights (IZH35) for some of the BE matches and found myself doing much worse. Could have been the switch, could have been the gun. It certainly felt very different. I wouldn't recommend it, if you are going to be shooting red dot and irons in the same time frame. Might be OK if one is summer, the other winter.

If you want to shoot IP, and you can see the sights well enough that it doesn't limit your performance, shoot iron sights. In everything.

In my very limited experimentation with red-dot sights on a pistol so far I have found that I can shoot better with the iron sights. All (most, some?) red-dot sights have parallax problems to some degree -- unless your eye position is very consistent (almost impossible with a pistol at arm's-length), the point-of-aim will move around considerably with shifts of eye relative position. The red-dot is far easier to use (especially with older eyes, floaters, etc) but (apparently) not as accurate.

I am thinking of trying the JPoint/Tasco Optima 2000 as I read that it has less parallax than most sights. Too bad that red-dots don't have adjustable parallax like scopes.

Best,

Joe

Joe,
The Ultradot is said to have the least amount of parallax. I have found that the point of impact can shift 1-2" at 25yd when the dot moves from the top to the bottom of the field of view. I keep the dot centered in the field of view - I think of it like maintaining alignment with iron sights. Biggest issue, for me, is that my wobble is much more apparent with a red dot.

jrmcdaniel wrote:...Too bad that red-dots don't have adjustable parallax like scopes....

The benefits would be negligible over the ranges pistol scopes are used and not worth the added cost and complexity.

Keep the dot centered in the field of view and your dispersion due to parallax will me almost too small to measure and very close to the dispersion one has with irons due to the natural limits of resolving power inherit in the human eye.

A red dot does show your natural wobble area more readily and this can be distracting and is typically the reason for those who perform at a lower level with optics versus irons.

Hope this helps.

Years 2000-2004 when I was seriously shooting for my Distinguished Badge, I practiced iron sights much more than with the Ultradot. I truly believe my mental and trigger skills were better off then. Now using the dot more than irons, I have digressed in my trigger control.

jrmcdaniel wrote: I am thinking of trying the JPoint/Tasco Optima 2000 as I read that it has less parallax than most sights.

Joe,

My Optima 2000 has the worst parallax of any red dot I have ever tried - probably an order of magnitude worse than my Ultradots. That's only one sample, of course, but beware...

FredB

Well between the replies in this forum and the Bullseye-L forums I've decided to stick with iron sights. The first person I asked, who is a distingished pistol shooter, but does not shoot international was adament that I should use a red dot. I'm glad I looked for a second opinion.

Thanks for you help.
Jim

Fred wrote: Joe,

My Optima 2000 has the worst parallax of any red dot I have ever tried - probably an order of magnitude worse than my Ultradots. That's only one sample, of course, but beware...

FredB

Make that a sample of 2. My Optima had terrible parallax. The POI would shift 2-3" at 50 feet when the dot moved from the center to the side or top/bottom (i.e. a circle of 4" diam). I never checked it at any other distances.

My Ultra-Dots are much less than an inch at 50-75 feet and maybe an inch at 50 yds. and that is moving it from the center all the way to the side of the tube.

Now back to the original question...
If you are a mid-level shooter or better then there is no question, stick with open sights. I agree with JackH that shooting open sights really keeps you focussed on what's important. In my experience, dots can encourage a certain relaxed attitude, even laziness.

However, when I was a new shooter, I found it beneficial to shoot dots. With a dot sight I was able to bypass my bad sight alignment and see my bad hold and trigger pull. Once I was shooting good scores with the dots, I could not blame my lousy open sights scores on anything but my own sight alignment.

Steve Turner

Bought an Ultradot on eBay and must say that the advice above was correct -- the parallax is far less than the Leapers I had bought and was low enough that I could shoot as well or better with it. The weight was far lower, too, although it is much smaller in diameter. Highly recommended (although I would like a bit smaller dot).

Joe