What foods are good and/or bad for holding steady?
Thanks in advance,
Don
Diet...Holding Steady....accuracy?????
Moderators: pilkguns, m1963, David Levene, Spencer, Richard H
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PAL_177
Depends on whether you are competing against me or not, Don: mmmmm ... try some yummy chocolate glazed donuts, or those cheezy puffs, have a can of Jolt to go with! Nyah ha ha! The range crew will make sure to pop some corn while you are shooting!
Actually I have nothing to offer beyond the broad guidelines: no caffeine or sugar, carbonation is discomforting, etc. You'll have to think about what foods or drinks make you uncomfortable, & stay away from them. For me, caffenated coffee in the morning is a big no-no, same for carbonated sodas during the day of a match. I find that I do need to keep eating - not just a cracker or two, but granola bar, or banana, figs, cookies, sandwich, etc or else I get the jitters. Other shooters will tell you to shoot on an empty stomach. I won't - there's nothing so disconcerting as having a grumbly tummy to keep you company in standing position!
One important thing - if you are traveling to a match, try to carry your favorite foods/bevvies with you, so you don't depend on "road food" all the time. Stick to foods that you are used to from home. Before the match is no time for culinary experimentation! Save that fried possum for your victory celebration. %^}
Actually I have nothing to offer beyond the broad guidelines: no caffeine or sugar, carbonation is discomforting, etc. You'll have to think about what foods or drinks make you uncomfortable, & stay away from them. For me, caffenated coffee in the morning is a big no-no, same for carbonated sodas during the day of a match. I find that I do need to keep eating - not just a cracker or two, but granola bar, or banana, figs, cookies, sandwich, etc or else I get the jitters. Other shooters will tell you to shoot on an empty stomach. I won't - there's nothing so disconcerting as having a grumbly tummy to keep you company in standing position!
One important thing - if you are traveling to a match, try to carry your favorite foods/bevvies with you, so you don't depend on "road food" all the time. Stick to foods that you are used to from home. Before the match is no time for culinary experimentation! Save that fried possum for your victory celebration. %^}
Re: Diet...Holding Steady....accuracy?????
I am not sure about what foods will yield a solid hold, but I can tell you what not to eat!DonC wrote:What foods are good and/or bad for holding steady?
Thanks in advance,
Don
You definitely do not want to eat at McDonalds right before a match. I did it once, had a yummy egg sausage mcmuffin and hash browns, and then went to shoot an AP match, oh man, I learned just how difficult it was not releasing gas down below while trying to keep focus up top side :-p
So yeah, not that you should be eating at McDees anyway, but definitely not before you want to shoot.
trinity
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Nicole Hamilton
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The biggest things to avoid IMHO are the sugars and/or carbohydrates that increases your blood glucose level. As an low level type 2 diabetic, I find that when my blood glucose level is too high---the "wobble zone" is absolutely mind boggling. On the contrary when my blood glucose is 80-104 the wobble zone is more predictable. I find that keeping hydrated is most important as the stress of shooting can definitely produce dehydration which will have a very negative effect on your shooting. The term "steadiness" is misunderstood here, I use the term related more to gun movement, which always occurs when lifting a 2+lb firearm. Of course we would all want those days where it's at a minimum where all you have to do is neglect motion and squeeze---bang a 10. Of course there was the time I shot with a bad cold and that cough medicine had me floating off the floor---couldn't make a mistake happen if I tried---best score ever for me in FP. Hurry I want a urine test on that shooter!!!!!
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Lanning R. Hochhauser
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Diet...Holding Steady....accuracy?????
Don,
Are you still smoking?
Ideally, not smoking goes along with diet when trying to limit things that could adversely affect on match performance.
Steve, Bruce, ED,
How many top shooters are smokers?
Are you still smoking?
Ideally, not smoking goes along with diet when trying to limit things that could adversely affect on match performance.
Steve, Bruce, ED,
How many top shooters are smokers?
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Steve Swartz
My $0.02
Two separate issues here; one, the issue of match prep, and b) the issue of optimizing your performance long term.
1) Match prep: caffeine, simple sugars as well as nicotine are no-nos for all the obvious reasons.
b. Long Term: think about the physical tasks required for shooting at the world class level. Top shooters aren't gymnasts or speed skaters, but things like mental acuity and intensity, visual acuity, fine motor control, endurance are very critical to peak performance. Obviously if you are quite "out of shape" (as my daughter tells me- "Spherical is a Shape") then you won't have efficient delivery of oxygen to your retina, brain, muscles, etc. This will affect many of the major systems that must be operating well in order to perform well.
This is certainly not to mean that in order to shoot well you must be a marathon runner/triathlete/power lifter; quite the contrary- those skillsets do *not* overlap well with the shooting sports. But you do need a particular *type* of fitness that is not compatible with poor cardiovascular conditioning, obesity, tobacco use, or even frequent/excessive alcohol use.
As the performance levels required to place in the elite levels increases over time (and they are), the days of being able to put down your doughnut and pop, stub out your cigarette, then walk to the line and medal are over.
Jeeze that sounded an awful lot like a health-nut sermon . . .
Steve Swartz
Two separate issues here; one, the issue of match prep, and b) the issue of optimizing your performance long term.
1) Match prep: caffeine, simple sugars as well as nicotine are no-nos for all the obvious reasons.
b. Long Term: think about the physical tasks required for shooting at the world class level. Top shooters aren't gymnasts or speed skaters, but things like mental acuity and intensity, visual acuity, fine motor control, endurance are very critical to peak performance. Obviously if you are quite "out of shape" (as my daughter tells me- "Spherical is a Shape") then you won't have efficient delivery of oxygen to your retina, brain, muscles, etc. This will affect many of the major systems that must be operating well in order to perform well.
This is certainly not to mean that in order to shoot well you must be a marathon runner/triathlete/power lifter; quite the contrary- those skillsets do *not* overlap well with the shooting sports. But you do need a particular *type* of fitness that is not compatible with poor cardiovascular conditioning, obesity, tobacco use, or even frequent/excessive alcohol use.
As the performance levels required to place in the elite levels increases over time (and they are), the days of being able to put down your doughnut and pop, stub out your cigarette, then walk to the line and medal are over.
Jeeze that sounded an awful lot like a health-nut sermon . . .
Steve Swartz
For Bullseye 2700s that last all day (8:30AM to about 3:30PM or so) I have adopted a very specific diet. Several other shooters seem to do about the same.
I normally do not eat any breakfast. I tried a couple of different ones on shooting days but universally found I did worse with the change of habit so, now, I have no food for breakfast on competition days. My normal start-of-day is one cup of regular coffee and one cup of decaf, both with a little 2% milk and NO SUGAR. I now do the same on competition days. Although that one cup of caffeinated coffee probably affects my steadiness, I find it a plus for mental sharpness (in my very subjective opinion, of course).
I eat a banana between 22 and CF, about 10:30AM.
Lunch is a 6" turkey sandwich at Subway or its equivalent. I have provolone cheese on the sandwich, oil and vinegar dressing, bell pepper, tomato, olives, fresh spinach (if they have it) or a small amount of lettuce if not, and lots of black pepper. Lots! I drink only water with lunch (and throughout the day as desired).
If we shoot a hardball match after the 2700, I've tried a second banana but, with my shooting of that gun, I can't say it helps or hinders.
When the Subway near the range was closed for remodeling at a recent 2700, I ate a 1/2 cup of pasta with garlic and olive oil (from the deli section at a grocery) and a 4 oz. packet of turkey slices for lunch and think I did as well on that as with the turkey sandwich from Subway. (Pasta gets a plus vote from me, too.)
Some of the key features of this are 1) eat only enough to keep you going -- a less than full stomach is a must, 2) the turkey contains something (tryptophan? sp?) that has a calming effect (as do chicken and tuna but to a lesser extent) which is beneficial, and 3) the banana seems to have the right balance of natural sugars (for mental sharpness) and potassium (which is a muscle relaxant if I'm not mistaken).
Sugar is bad, real bad, at any time when shooting for accuracy. Sugar in my coffee or a cookie at lunch will definately mess me up. (I'm slightly hypoglycemic so I'm very sensitive to refined sugars.) For similar reasons, any kind of sports drink (or "soft" drink) is a big no-no. Based on my experience, I would recommend plain water only to drink but make sure to get enough to keep your blood flowing easily: dehydration will lessen the oxygen flow to the brain and your aim will suffer (in my inexpert opinion).
Overall, you want to keep your heart rate low. If the competition has you walking back and forth to the targets, walk slow. If there is a 30 second or longer lull in the competition, sit down. Pick up banana and lunch (and water) before the competition, eat at the range rather than going out with "the guys and gals" and sit calmly. Keep everything low key. (If you clean a target then, OK, you can do a little victory dance, but only a really little one, and then forget the target and concentrate on shooting only the very next shot.)
Relaxed but alert is probably the bottom line.
--
Ed Skinner, ed@flat5.net, http://www.flat5.net/ (shooting notes)
and http://conventionalpistol.blogspot.com/ (shooting blog)
I normally do not eat any breakfast. I tried a couple of different ones on shooting days but universally found I did worse with the change of habit so, now, I have no food for breakfast on competition days. My normal start-of-day is one cup of regular coffee and one cup of decaf, both with a little 2% milk and NO SUGAR. I now do the same on competition days. Although that one cup of caffeinated coffee probably affects my steadiness, I find it a plus for mental sharpness (in my very subjective opinion, of course).
I eat a banana between 22 and CF, about 10:30AM.
Lunch is a 6" turkey sandwich at Subway or its equivalent. I have provolone cheese on the sandwich, oil and vinegar dressing, bell pepper, tomato, olives, fresh spinach (if they have it) or a small amount of lettuce if not, and lots of black pepper. Lots! I drink only water with lunch (and throughout the day as desired).
If we shoot a hardball match after the 2700, I've tried a second banana but, with my shooting of that gun, I can't say it helps or hinders.
When the Subway near the range was closed for remodeling at a recent 2700, I ate a 1/2 cup of pasta with garlic and olive oil (from the deli section at a grocery) and a 4 oz. packet of turkey slices for lunch and think I did as well on that as with the turkey sandwich from Subway. (Pasta gets a plus vote from me, too.)
Some of the key features of this are 1) eat only enough to keep you going -- a less than full stomach is a must, 2) the turkey contains something (tryptophan? sp?) that has a calming effect (as do chicken and tuna but to a lesser extent) which is beneficial, and 3) the banana seems to have the right balance of natural sugars (for mental sharpness) and potassium (which is a muscle relaxant if I'm not mistaken).
Sugar is bad, real bad, at any time when shooting for accuracy. Sugar in my coffee or a cookie at lunch will definately mess me up. (I'm slightly hypoglycemic so I'm very sensitive to refined sugars.) For similar reasons, any kind of sports drink (or "soft" drink) is a big no-no. Based on my experience, I would recommend plain water only to drink but make sure to get enough to keep your blood flowing easily: dehydration will lessen the oxygen flow to the brain and your aim will suffer (in my inexpert opinion).
Overall, you want to keep your heart rate low. If the competition has you walking back and forth to the targets, walk slow. If there is a 30 second or longer lull in the competition, sit down. Pick up banana and lunch (and water) before the competition, eat at the range rather than going out with "the guys and gals" and sit calmly. Keep everything low key. (If you clean a target then, OK, you can do a little victory dance, but only a really little one, and then forget the target and concentrate on shooting only the very next shot.)
Relaxed but alert is probably the bottom line.
--
Ed Skinner, ed@flat5.net, http://www.flat5.net/ (shooting notes)
and http://conventionalpistol.blogspot.com/ (shooting blog)
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pointingdevices
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Supplements
I've found that using a Super-B complex helps the hold. You must choose the B complex vitamin supplement carefully. It must contain at least 100% RDA of C and should also contain Choline as either the inisitol, bitartrate, or preferrably the phosphatide form. The B complex and C are the water soluable vitamins and as such the body does not readily store them. A, D, E and K are oil soluable and the body does store them. The B complex and C are classed as the "STRESS" vitamins, these are the ones that are 'eaten up' as the body endures stress. As they deplete the nervous system is left more suseptable to ordered, yes ordered, firing between nerve bundles. This 'ordered firing' is the rythmic or periodic motion of the muscle also known as spasm. The nervous system needs to be in a state of 'active desyncronization' to avoid spasm or in our case its called 'fatigue tremor.' Choline is metabolized into Acetylcholine, one of the four major neurotransmitters. It plays a major role in nerve function and specifically memory. Some B complex vitamin supplements contain a whopping load of Niacin. Extremely high doses of Niacin can turn you beet red and effect perception noticably so avoid any supplement with one thousand % RDA Niacin. They do exist out there. None of this is to be taken as medical advice and I recommend a nutritionist be consulted. A nutritionist can test for and recommend changes in your glucose level, carbohydrate, protein, mineral, salt and water metabolism. Mineral supplements (copper, manganese, zinc, ect.) can be really tricky. Some can have the opposite effect, specifically if recently started or in high doses. But the B complex and C are pretty safe at normal dosage as any excess is simple excreted via the urinary tract.
The vitamin B complex and C have worked well for me with no adverse effects.
The vitamin B complex and C have worked well for me with no adverse effects.
Water, protein, carbs.
I usually eat breakfast, but have thought that I should cut back. Fast food generally makes me feel off-kilter anyway, so perhaps some fruit and maybe a bagel or something a couple hours before the match.
No caffeine, less sugar. I've found that even drinking a non-caffeinated soda like a Sprite will throw me off.
At the last match I shot, I ate a Power Bar after the .22 section and again after CF and it seemed to stave off hunger.
Pointing Devices, your advice regarding B vitamins is interesting. I think I'll give that a whirl.
I usually eat breakfast, but have thought that I should cut back. Fast food generally makes me feel off-kilter anyway, so perhaps some fruit and maybe a bagel or something a couple hours before the match.
No caffeine, less sugar. I've found that even drinking a non-caffeinated soda like a Sprite will throw me off.
At the last match I shot, I ate a Power Bar after the .22 section and again after CF and it seemed to stave off hunger.
Pointing Devices, your advice regarding B vitamins is interesting. I think I'll give that a whirl.
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Steve Swartz
Here int he states the official advice is "don't take supplements- not because of what IS on the ingredients label, but because of what ISN'T."
Many supplements are *not* regulated by USDA/FDA/etc. because they are neither "food" nor a "drug." In their unregulated state, most "brand name" supplements are manufactured in somewhat questionable conditions in third world countries (sorry folks) and contamination with substances that may either be banned or triger false positives are common enough to merit the caution.
Remember, no matter whose "FAULT" it is, it is always the athletes "RESPONSIBILITY."
Our USADA also recommends that athletes NOT take vitamin supplements either- for the same reasons.
Steve Swartz
Many supplements are *not* regulated by USDA/FDA/etc. because they are neither "food" nor a "drug." In their unregulated state, most "brand name" supplements are manufactured in somewhat questionable conditions in third world countries (sorry folks) and contamination with substances that may either be banned or triger false positives are common enough to merit the caution.
Remember, no matter whose "FAULT" it is, it is always the athletes "RESPONSIBILITY."
Our USADA also recommends that athletes NOT take vitamin supplements either- for the same reasons.
Steve Swartz
Steve,Steve Swartz wrote:Here int he states the official advice is "don't take supplements- not because of what IS on the ingredients label, but because of what ISN'T."
Our USADA also recommends that athletes NOT take vitamin supplements either- for the same reasons.
Steve Swartz
I understand what you are saying as this has been a favorite topic of mine for over 20 years. As far as supplements go, you are correct. Not knowing the source of the supplements leaves one open to throwing all kinds of stuff down your own throat. That's why I would stop taking anything, for several months before a competition, that was not from a major drug company.
Personally, I am a fan of supplements from natural sources, and there isn't enough bandwidth here to explain why. But, even reputable companies using this approach can get you into trouble if you are tested. My solution to this issue, after talking with the USADA about it, was to convert to vitamins sold by a recognized manufacturer prior to a major competition. In my case, I chose to go with Centrum.
One more point. If the USADA really is recommending that athletes not take any vitamins for any reason, my personal opinion is that position is horrifically irresponsible. If you want to short-change yourself, you can abuse your body all you want when you are young. But, you will pay for it later. And, not making certain you are meeting your minimum RDA's is surely one way of abusing your own body.
Stan
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pointingdevices
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Contaminated nutritional supplements
Here are a couple of applicable papers on this matter:
Analysis of Nutritional Supplements for Prohormones Geyer, H. Mareck-Engelke, U., Wagner, A., Schänzer, W. Institute of Biochemistry http://www.dshs-koeln.de/biochemie/rubr ... _nah01.pdf German Sport University Cologne, Germany Abstract of lecture presented at the Manfred-Donike-Workshop 19th Cologne Workshop on Dope Analysis 18th till 23rd March 2001
Contaminated nutritional supplements Striegel, Vollkommer, Horstmann, Niess. – legal protection for elite athletes who tested positive: A case report from Germany. Journal of Sports Sciences www.ingentaconnect.com/content/tandf/rjsp Volume 23, Number 7, July 2005, pp. 723-726
GlaxoSmithKline seems to be leading the way in quality control and testing procedures and have paired up with a laboratory affiliated with WADA 'addressing the needs of the athlete for a reliable supplement supply chain through their Lucozade Sports Science Academy www.lucozadesport.com to supply a range of sports nutrition products.'
"GSK will implement an extensive program of checks and safeguards to assure the purity of products provided to players. Features of this program will include:
�� All GSK raw materials suppliers will be required to certify that their raw materials are contaminant-free.
�� All products will be batch-tested by HFL, the UK’s largest WADA approved testing lab, for the presence of banned substances."
-Hope this helps
Analysis of Nutritional Supplements for Prohormones Geyer, H. Mareck-Engelke, U., Wagner, A., Schänzer, W. Institute of Biochemistry http://www.dshs-koeln.de/biochemie/rubr ... _nah01.pdf German Sport University Cologne, Germany Abstract of lecture presented at the Manfred-Donike-Workshop 19th Cologne Workshop on Dope Analysis 18th till 23rd March 2001
Contaminated nutritional supplements Striegel, Vollkommer, Horstmann, Niess. – legal protection for elite athletes who tested positive: A case report from Germany. Journal of Sports Sciences www.ingentaconnect.com/content/tandf/rjsp Volume 23, Number 7, July 2005, pp. 723-726
GlaxoSmithKline seems to be leading the way in quality control and testing procedures and have paired up with a laboratory affiliated with WADA 'addressing the needs of the athlete for a reliable supplement supply chain through their Lucozade Sports Science Academy www.lucozadesport.com to supply a range of sports nutrition products.'
"GSK will implement an extensive program of checks and safeguards to assure the purity of products provided to players. Features of this program will include:
�� All GSK raw materials suppliers will be required to certify that their raw materials are contaminant-free.
�� All products will be batch-tested by HFL, the UK’s largest WADA approved testing lab, for the presence of banned substances."
-Hope this helps
I would agree with you on GSK (but then I work for them so I would ;-) ). Same with other respected household brands. Where I would be much more cautious is smaller brands and ones that seem to promise miracles. It's also worth checking the same brands if you buy abroad - there's been more than one athlete banned taking a over the counter product which was fine in one country but contained extra, banned, ingredients when purchased abroad.
The bottom line is it's your responsibility to check everything as it's only you that will suffer if you inadvertently take something on the banned list.
Rob.
The bottom line is it's your responsibility to check everything as it's only you that will suffer if you inadvertently take something on the banned list.
Rob.
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pointingdevices
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GC/MS + Supplement = Hold
I'm seriously considering getting a Gas Chromatograph / Mass Spectrograph off of eBay for a few hundred, http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... :B:EF:US:1 fix it up, get a big ol' tank of nitrogen, TFA, hook it into the computer, and testing everything within range. (That way my hold will improve.) Animal endocrine glands are ending up in everyday stuff, cosmetics, supplements, hair products, and gelatin.
J-E-L-L-Oh no, banned for 2 years !!!
J-E-L-L-Oh no, banned for 2 years !!!
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Guest
Um. Isn't that what a "balanced diet" is for? To make sure you get all your nutritional needs, including vitamins and nutrients and minerals?IPshooter wrote: And, not making certain you are meeting your minimum RDA's is surely one way of abusing your own body.
I'm a vegetarian (have been for years) and perfectly healthy despite taking no supplements of any kind. I seem to be managing fine on a balanced diet. ("Fine" as in I'm on my country's national squad...)
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pointingdevices
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B-12
Guest - How do you get your B-12? Are you Vegan or Ovolacto? Do you find that a vegetarian diet helps your hold?
I would love to be a full vegan vegetarian but have an occasional steakhouse steak that does not come from an organic farm fed source. So surely it has been injedted with BGH. Anyone know if BGH shows up in the drug tests? My best friend is full vegan and has been for decades. He was actually the one who got me involved with target talk. He reads but has not posted. He shoots international air rifle. Hey indigo, if your out there it's your kind of topic, nows the time to post!
I would love to be a full vegan vegetarian but have an occasional steakhouse steak that does not come from an organic farm fed source. So surely it has been injedted with BGH. Anyone know if BGH shows up in the drug tests? My best friend is full vegan and has been for decades. He was actually the one who got me involved with target talk. He reads but has not posted. He shoots international air rifle. Hey indigo, if your out there it's your kind of topic, nows the time to post!
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Guest
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pointingdevices
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Chocolate
Does anyone know how CHOCOLATE affects performance?
It contains many chemicals in the zanthine group of which caffeine is a member plus many calming, soothing compounds like theobromine. I'm not sure if chocolate contains much if any caffeine. Then their is the light vs dark chocolate to consider. Any elite shooters out there want to wolf down a few hershey bars and give us a report?
It contains many chemicals in the zanthine group of which caffeine is a member plus many calming, soothing compounds like theobromine. I'm not sure if chocolate contains much if any caffeine. Then their is the light vs dark chocolate to consider. Any elite shooters out there want to wolf down a few hershey bars and give us a report?