TargetTalk

Hi all,

I am struggling to improve my AP scores, but also like to play with different pistols.

I remember reading an interview with Mikhail Nestruev where he refers that training with some pistols was harming the overall performance, and was struggling at the time to match compatible characteristics of pistols in AP, FP, CF etc.

I also recall a recent training program were lots of attention was on the trigger operation.
So I ask your opinions.
My main pistol is am Morini 162EI, and this is the pistol I shoot in matches. However I also enjoy soothing my Baikal IZH 46M, my friends FWB C20, FWB 65, etc from time to time.

Trigger settings are very different from one pistol to the other, so one wonders if shooting different pistols will slow progression in match performance?

Thank you.
Luis

"...but also like to play with different pistols."
That's the question, isn't it: Are you in it to play, or are you in it to work & improve?

william wrote: ↑Wed Nov 18, 2020 7:09 am "...but also like to play with different pistols."
That's the question, isn't it: Are you in it to play, or are you in it to work & improve?

Well said.

If you want to improve I would stick with one gun because different guns have different characteristics and two of the most important characteristics are grips and triggers.

In order to grip exactly the same shot after shot it will be confusing for your muscle memory if you use different guns. As for triggers you may be able to get them fairly identical but the actual trigger pull will activate different muscles in the hand due to different grips.

If one wants to shoot for instance air pistol as well as 25 m sport pistol or standard pistol one could have identical grips made to “even out” the different feel of the guns.

Right now I only shoot 10m air pistol due to the above and due to lack of time to shoot multiple events.

However, of course one can become good within several types of events and it may be worth it to be a “jack of all trades” but “master of none” of it means you can shoot 3 events in a day instead of one. Especially if you traveled far to compete.

Ragnar Skanakers main event was 50m pistol but with time he also became world class brilliant in Standard Pistol and Air Pistol just because he thought it was a waste of time to travel all over the world and only shoot one match per location. But then again, he spent most of his time awake training or competing...

Thank you JonPersson and all others for your inputs.

Makes sense, I will stick to one pistol, to see if I get the most out of the time spent in training.
Not only trigger have different characteristics, as grips are also different in size and shape.
Best regards,
Luis

I’d shoot everything you can get your hands on.
Keep top of mind that each shot is working towards perfecting marksmanship.

For myself I really enjoy dragging out a service pistol with such as a P35 with an 8 pound gritty trigger.
For me it focuses the mind to what I have refined on the perfect light triggers on the competition pistols.

One can get so tied up in a refined approach that it is impossible to perform outside of strict metrics- perfect trigger you know well, the right light, stance, breakfast and god forbid No COFFEE etc ad nauseam.
I often stand on one leg when I dry fire practice.
I should try it standing one leg on a beach ball.

Loosen up.
Lighten up.
Practice shooting well when the stars are not perfectly aligned.
They often won’t be..

Hi trboat,

your view certainly sounds more fun, so I guess it couldn't hurt, maybe at the end of the season.

Thank you for your input.

Best regards
Luis

"...your view certainly sounds more fun, so I guess it couldn't hurt,...."

Two thoughts which may fall on deaf ears.
1. Long ago in a galaxy far away I was working with a defensive pistol instructor/coach. I told him that something felt much more comfortable than another. His reply; and I'll quote it verbatim: "Do you want to be comfortable, or do you want to hit your target?"
2. What you don't know CAN (and probably will) hurt you.

I'd have to say one pistol for the reasons already mentioned although I firmly belive I pushed through a block (mental or other) by using a second pistol. I'd seem to have run my course with the Steyr Evo e and hankered for my old Walther LP 400. I was fortunate enough to get hold of one secondhand and going toe to toe with both of them and really giving my level best I pushed through the 550 barrier I'd want to break since I started a few years ago. I'm pretty sure the Steyr is better, went with it alone for this months AP league. Shot well over 100 rounds today with the Steyr for the 10m and a 6 yard comp I'm doing. Tbh, if I hadn't kept it fairly tight today I already had a new Walther LP500e in the basket in a online store ready to go!

william wrote: ↑Thu Nov 19, 2020 9:21 am "...your view certainly sounds more fun, so I guess it couldn't hurt,...."

Two thoughts which may fall on deaf ears.
1. Long ago in a galaxy far away I was working with a defensive pistol instructor/coach. I told him that something felt much more comfortable than another. His reply; and I'll quote it verbatim: "Do you want to be comfortable, or do you want to hit your target?"
2. What you don't know CAN (and probably will) hurt you.

Well I try to be as comfortable as possible as it hightens my chances of getting good hits on my target, but I guess its harder to make that sound tacticool

william wrote: ↑Thu Nov 19, 2020 9:21 am "...your view certainly sounds more fun, so I guess it couldn't hurt,...."

Two thoughts which may fall on deaf ears.
1. Long ago in a galaxy far away I was working with a defensive pistol instructor/coach. I told him that something felt much more comfortable than another. His reply; and I'll quote it verbatim: "Do you want to be comfortable, or do you want to hit your target?"
2. What you don't know CAN (and probably will) hurt you.

I thought we had a sort of unspoken rule to keep tactical stuff off this forum?

I would say that one takes every possible opportunity to work on conditioning.
I have for years stood on one foot to put on my shoes and socks each morning and take them off each evening.
Taking the time to roll the socks and tuck the laces in the boot placing them on the floor all on one foot.
Such practice yields that fine motor control and tone in the ankles and lower legs and helps as one takes a formal position before the target on the line and costs nothing- we need to put on our shoes every single day.

All training is good training to my experience.
I firmly believe that my body works for me- I am in charge and am not summiting to demands that I bend my will to fussy demands to make a shot.
For that matter the pistol works for me too.
It is like any other management problem- the employees are not perfect but I know how to work with them to get the job done.
Practice outside of ideal conditions strengthens my management skills.

So I go to the range with service pistols and endeavor to shoot them well.
I practice out of position and demand that my body still makes the shot.

Everyone has to decide who is in charge- ceed that to the body and you will be charting breakfast cereals effect on scores.
Learn to shoot a trigger with a bit of creep or some grit and not be slaved to perfectly uniform conditions to shoot well.
These are traps to avoid...

"I thought we had a sort of unspoken rule to keep tactical stuff off this forum?"

If I hadn't used the word "defensive" I guess all would have been well. As it was, the thing we were working on - working on, not playing with - was the relationship of the hand to the pistol. The lesson applies to any pistol discipline from free-pistol to the all the spray 'n pray games, including the one I have the least respect for (hint: It involves dressing up and pretending to ride a horse).