TargetTalk

What a disappointment!! Looked at the ISSF schedule for 2018 and didn't find any 50M prone. I did hear they wanted to drop it since is was for men, not women. Guess the logical thing to do is then drop it instead of having both a womens & mens 50M prone.

Found an article that mentions for the 2020 Olympics, to make room for some mixed gender events they dropped 50M prone and 50M pistol.

http://www.guns.com/2017/06/12/olympics ... -for-2020/

"The shooting events cut are some of the longest running in modern Olympic history.

The 50m Rifle Prone has been a staple of the Olympics since 1912 while the 50m Pistol – commonly called Free Pistol – has been in the games since 1896, in both cases with Americans winning the first gold medal awarded for the events"

WOW. They took all the joy out of watching the summer Olympics and ISSF world cup events. First they ruined 50M prone changing the format then allowing the spectators to start clapping, annoying, rude and distracting right at the final round. Now it's just gone.

This has been discussed on here previously, do a search. Yes it is disappointing, of course they could have ADDED Women's prone, but that wouldn't achieve the IOC's goal of reducing the number of sports so that they could introduce new "sports". The IOC wanted to remove some sports/events to make room for new ones, and they targeted the gender-biased ones in order to achieve that. That's my read of it anyway.

Modena wrote:This has been discussed on here previously, do a search. Yes it is disappointing, of course they could have ADDED Women's prone, but that wouldn't achieve the IOC's goal of reducing the number of sports so that they could introduce new "sports". The IOC wanted to remove some sports/events to make room for new ones, and they targeted the gender-biased ones in order to achieve that. That's my read of it anyway.

Except there are exactly the same number of shooting events.
But as said, this topic has been beaten to death.

Sorry, I meant to say that they wanted to reduce the number of athletes.

Modena wrote:Sorry, I meant to say that they wanted to reduce the number of athletes.

You were also right when you said that the IOC wanted to reduce the number of events.

There were 306 in Rio but, under recommendation 9 of Agenda 2020, the IOC want to limit it to approximately 310. With 5 new sports entering the Olympics in 2020 it is obvious that some of the existing events would have to go.

The ISSF did a good job of retaining 15 shooting events. They couldn't all be the same events as in 2016 because of recommendation 11 of Agenda 2020.

Sorry if my post caused some discomfort. I did a search but the discussions were back in 2017 & 2016 and didn't mention much about the ISSF World Cup events which still had the 50m prone throughout 2017.

Now it's here. 2018 and the ISSF events don't have 50m prone. It used to be fun to watch, something to look forward to. When you young people get older you may find sitting, kneeling and even offhand may get more difficult and prone may be what you have left.

matchguy wrote:Sorry if my post caused some discomfort. I did a search but the discussions were back in 2017 & 2016 and didn't mention much about the ISSF World Cup events which still had the 50m prone throughout 2017.

Now it's here. 2018 and the ISSF events don't have 50m prone. It used to be fun to watch, something to look forward to. When you young people get older you may find sitting, kneeling and even offhand may get more difficult and prone may be what you have left.

You can still see prone at WC Munich.



I don't know why the absence of 50m rifle prone would take "all" the fun out of watching. I enjoy watching 3x40 and 10m air rifle and I am an older shooter that still shoots three position and air rifle.

Everyone that has followed the ISSF and IOC actively knew this was coming. We knew 2017 would be the last year for 50m prone in the World Cups and that prone was dropped form Tokyo 2020.

Now it's up to us to support the events that we do still have.

ShootWithStyle wrote:I don't know why the absence of 50m rifle prone would take "all" the fun out of watching.

As a new targetshooter, I don't know why there's been so much gnashing of teeth over how men's 50m prone was so critical as a separate Olympic discipline when no one seemed to mind that women's 50m prone wasn't a separate Olympic discipline.

Because men's 50 m prone and mens free pistol were existing events, shot on the same course as that used for men's and women's positional. Free pistol was one of the original sports of the modern Olympics and 50m prone rifle was the small bore version of 300m prone.

They were sports that I watched in all of the world cups and world championships.Prone rifle was a sport that the US performed particularly well in. That's about it for why I am still bothered by it.

Prone is also happening at the World Champs later this year in Korea, but similarly to the Grand Prix above, there is no final.

Modena wrote:Sorry, I meant to say that they wanted to reduce the number of athletes.

Correction: Reduce the number of male athletes!

Modena wrote:Prone is also happening at the World Champs later this year in Korea, but similarly to the Grand Prix above, there is no final.

I do enjoy the World Championships. A chance to see all of the shooting events of yesteryear. I would love to shoot 300m, but I can't afford to take on another discipline.

I'm sad prone is gone, but there are still shooting events to watch and participate in. I'm not on board with the IOCs move to make the Olympics more like the X-Games. It works for the Olympic Winter Games because the Winter Games are so much smaller than the Summer Games.

The winter games topped 100 events for the first time in PyeongChang and still have room to grow. Now they are talking about winter equivalents of summer sports. There was an exhibition of snow volleyball. They can add sports to the Winter Games without removing others. The Summer Games can't accommodate more without dropping others.

And don't forget E-Sports.....they did have an IOC sanctioned competition in South Korea the week before the start of the Winter Games.

Aren't they going the other way too though (winter --> summer)? I seem to remember "summer biathlon" in the last Summer Olympics, where they replaced skiing with running. The only reason I remember it was because I thought it was hilarious that they made everyone run through little corrals inside the stadium -- it looked like they were in line for a ride at Disneyland!

marky-d

marky-d wrote:I seem to remember "summer biathlon" in the last Summer Olympics, where they replaced skiing with running.

That was probably the Run/Shoot stage of the Modern Pentathlon. Nothing to do with the ISSF, they use laser pistols.

David Levene wrote:

marky-d wrote:I seem to remember "summer biathlon" in the last Summer Olympics, where they replaced skiing with running.

That was probably the Run/Shoot stage of the Modern Pentathlon. Nothing to do with the ISSF, they use laser pistols.

David you are correct. That was part of the Modern Pentathlon competitions...the dead giveaway is the laser pistols. Modern Pentathlon has it's own governing body (Union Internationale de Pentathlon Moderne - UIPM) not related to the ISSF.

That part of the MP competition took place in the same stadium they used for some of the equestrian events. It's also part of the IOCs push to reduce the number of single use venues at the games. Utilizing the venue of another sport and using laser pistols allows for more flexibility. If you watched any of the MP competition you would have seen spectators seated directly behind the targets that the competitors were shooting at. No danger to them as they are only firing harmless infrared lasers.

ISSF does have a summer biathlon equivalent which has been named "Target Sprint". It's been contested at some of the World Cups, mostly Junior World Cups. Walther is marketing a line of LG400s with a different stock specifically for Target Sprint.

http://www.carl-walther.com/products/sp ... 24710.html

Hmmm, I could have sworn they were shooting rifles, not pistols, but I'm sure you're right.

It wouldn't be the first time my memory played tricks on me.... :)

marky-d wrote:Hmmm, I could have sworn they were shooting rifles, not pistols, but I'm sure you're right.

It wouldn't be the first time my memory played tricks on me.... :)

Yeah, it was definitely laser pistols.



The newish Target Sprint put on by the ISSF uses Air Rifles, but unlike true biathlon the competitors run without the rifles. The rifles are kept near the firing point in rifle racks and they competitors grab their rifles from the rack when they get to the firing point. And since it's air rifle there is no magazine with which to load and shoot successive shots from. Each shot must be loaded manually.

To be honest, Target Sprint, is quite exciting as a spectator sport.

I wonder if a pistol version of target sprint is possible in the future?

With actual pellets and actual knock down targets rather than lasers and lights!