TargetTalk

Hey guys,

My 'dream school' has always been MIT and I desperately want to get accepted there. The problem is of course that it's not easy. I've done a lot of research online and how admissions appears to work is that you need a sort of 'hook'. Obviously you can't get in because of shooting alone, but I'm wondering how much of a 'hook' is shooting? My air scores fall in the middle of their team right now but I have no SB scores. How much do you think shooting could help? I've heard that it's very good to get in contact with the coach but I'm not very sure what to ask? Anyone have any ideas? I'm very paranoid about getting doxxed so I won't post my extra-curricular activities and grades here but I'd love to PM them to anybody so they could offer their feedback.

Thank you,
Ketchup

Go right to the source. Anything anyone tells you here is pure speculation.
Contact Coach Melissa Mulloy-Mecozzi at m_mulloy@mit.edu and tell her what you have posted here.
She is very approachable.

I think they are after a hook because they have so many more applicants than they have space for. They don't like to just use scores, because among all the excellent candidates, there are a lot of people who can ace the tests, but not have that spark that sets them apart from the crowd.

I don't think shooting is important to MIT in the sense that they would pick you just because they hope to get a good shooter on their team. However, I think that what will count for you is that you are on a team, and less so if you are #1 on the team. There are way too many kids these days whose passion is to play video games, rather than go out and challenge themselves. The fact that you are showing interests, and the dedication to follow those interests, is what counts.

If I were you, I would make it a point to attend Camp Perry in a few months, and to shoot in the National championships. As stated, I think how well you do is less important (ok, doing well won't hurt), but showing the dedication to go so far as to attend the nationals shows that you can stick to something, rather than just be casually involved.

PS, Hap, thanks for the lead on Melissa's name. I used to work in the high speed photography lab at MIT, and after my vision went (and my front sight disappeared), I started to look at the optics of shooting, and discovered that the unique optical needs of shooters are better solved by applying photographic principles than eye doctor principles. So I'm willing to get involved with the MIT team to see how I can help them.

Mr. Ketchup,

If MIT is your dream school and you wish to be accepted then your first step would be to proof read your post and anything else you write and post. Be careful how you write your application essays because, if they are written as your post was, you will not make it past the first admissions view. That was not intended to be mean. The admissions office is very picky, and they can afford to be.

As for a 'hook' to get you noticed, shooting is just as legitimate as cello, chess, or cheerleading. It is the passion, quality of effort, length of participation, and level of achievement they notice. For shooting, success in high level competitions will help. Also, contact the coach, as Hap mentioned, because the coach can send a letter to admissions that could help your odds of acceptance. The coach will need to know your scores in approved matches, especially National Championships. Hap posted Melissa's email address; contact her and she will know what to do.

Keep in mind that MIT will not admit you simply based upon you extracurricular activities. You must be academically qualified.

Best of luck

The term admission committees use is "softs" (what you call "hook"). What admission deans of top schools look for in an applicant is his/her potential to develop into a leader in some field, engineering, science, business, politics, they really don't care. They want to count leaders of the society among their alumni. It helps your application if you have impressive achievements in something. The key word is "achievement." Merely being interested in something, e.g. shooting, is a weak "soft." However, if you can back your interest with a win at some major competition, your "soft" will look a lot harder.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_UYhTylqC9o

Start from 2:15

Admission guys see 20,000 different "passion" hooks on their application. Most not very genuine. But if you can convey your joy, not "passion", through shooting; and admission officers buy your joy, you have a great shot.

I would advise against trying to communicate the "joy of shooting." The liberal academia will easily believe you... and turn you away as a custom nut job. It would be equally believable (and equally useless) if you try to communicate your joy of videogaming. Don't even mention guns, shooting, unless it is in reference to an organized athletic activity.

Seek evidence of drive and passion (if you actually have it) from coaches to submit on behalf at the application stage.

Probably worth building relationships with coaching staff, too. See if they will go in to bat for you.

There are plenty of ways to communicate effectively the benefits of precision target shooting.

"Focus", "Discipline of Motion", "Discipline of Action", "Value of Training in the pursuit of expert performance."

Probably every kid who applies to an advanced University uses some sort of passion hook - I know I did. I would send in with my application a 100/100 card, but that's just me.

All the best, work hard. Life is short, love what you do.

Will Hart wrote:Words...

Mr. Hart knows. Probably worth reading his post twice. http://mitathletics.com/genrel/2010-11/ ... ent_090210

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Addendum: I have often found that people are more candid during a phone conversation.
Email has a paper-trail and quite often people are cautious because of that fact.

Hap Rocketto wrote:Go right to the source. Anything anyone tells you here is pure speculation.
Contact Coach Melissa Mulloy-Mecozzi at m_mulloy@mit.edu and tell her what you have posted here.
She is very approachable.

I'll definitely do that, but the thing is that I don't have any good competition scores yet since it has been a long time since I competed. I think I should wait about a month or so until I contact her so I have competition scores.

Thanks guys for for your response. The general consensus seems to be that I should get my official scores in order to have a shot. I'll definitely do that as soon as possible.

Frankly, shooting is not worth s**t in admissions. With no major wins under your belt, don't even think of wasting your essay on shooting.

shaky hands wrote:Frankly, shooting is not worth s**t in admissions. With no major wins under your belt, don't even think of wasting your essay on shooting.

I know it's not worth much for most schools but what about for a school with a team? It's speculation but I'm almost certain I'll get the scores I'm getting in practice in a competition. Can't that help me get recruited for MIT's team?

Re-read Will's reply: If you submit an essay resembling what you've written here, I doubt anybody will even notice the content beneath the weak composition. Stop it already with the, "I want. I want." What can you offer the MIT community? And it had better be more than some shooting scores and enthusiasm.

Ketchup wrote:

shaky hands wrote:Frankly, shooting is not worth s**t in admissions. With no major wins under your belt, don't even think of wasting your essay on shooting.

I know it's not worth much for most schools but what about for a school with a team? It's speculation but I'm almost certain I'll get the scores I'm getting in practice in a competition. Can't that help me get recruited for MIT's team?

Are you saying that you have no competition scores at all? If so, assuming that your comp scores will be the same as your practice scores is very optimistic.

Erud wrote:

Ketchup wrote:

shaky hands wrote:Frankly, shooting is not worth s**t in admissions. With no major wins under your belt, don't even think of wasting your essay on shooting.

I know it's not worth much for most schools but what about for a school with a team? It's speculation but I'm almost certain I'll get the scores I'm getting in practice in a competition. Can't that help me get recruited for MIT's team?

Are you saying that you have no competition scores at all? If so, assuming that your comp scores will be the same as your practice scores is very optimistic.

I didn't shoot for about two years because of an illness but before then my practice scores were identical to my competition ones. I never knew people tend to score higher in practice; is it because of stress? If so: I'm generally a very calm person.

Generally, how much lower do people score in competitions?

william wrote:Re-read Will's reply: If you submit an essay resembling what you've written here, I doubt anybody will even notice the content beneath the weak composition. Stop it already with the, "I want. I want." What can you offer the MIT community? And it had better be more than some shooting scores and enthusiasm.

Hello

I'll definitely write a better college essay than a forum entry! I didn't mean to come off as narcissistic, I'm sorry if I did. I know I need to offer MIT more than shooting enthusiasm, I just didn't want to post my test scores and extra-curricular activities online publicly. I'd be more than happy to PM them to you for you to judge if I have a shot at getting recruited.

Thanks

Ketchup wrote:

shaky hands wrote:Frankly, shooting is not worth s**t in admissions. With no major wins under your belt, don't even think of wasting your essay on shooting.

I know it's not worth much for most schools but what about for a school with a team? It's speculation but I'm almost certain I'll get the scores I'm getting in practice in a competition. Can't that help me get recruited for MIT's team?

Remember, we are talking here about a school that fancies itself as (and might well be) the #1 engineering school in the world. You are looking at a wrong place to expend your effort. Shooting 550 at some competition will not make much impression on admission officers. If it earns you a letter of recommendation from the coach, it won't hurt, but I would focus on academics and, unless you win some impressive-sounding (for a non-shooting person) title, devote my essay to something else (you mention research and entrepreneurship, right?). Also, recognize that there is no such thing as to "have requirements" of MIT (by the way, if you are not a native English speaker, you might be given some slack in essay-writing, but you have to make your essay count content-wise nonetheless; still have someone proofread it). Look up medians and 75th percentiles of the test scores of admitted MIT class and use those as your reference point. And remember that many very well qualified applicants will still be denied acceptance.

I commend you on your worth goal. I have a nephew in the current MIT MBA graduating class, I believe he pretty much aced the GMAT, his undergrad was computer science plus he worked for a Wall Street firm, so they look at a lot but I'm sure academics are more of a deciding factor for undergraduate admission. Being a top junior shooter might be considered well down the list in tie breaking admission decisions, but I doubt it since you are not trying to get in on a shooting scholarship, focus on academics to get in. Winning national level or state HS engineering competitions would have a much greater impact on your admission package.

Totally agree. It is about academics for admission.

It is your SAT/AP/top class rank, and how vigorous are your classes that determine first tier college admission.

Banking on a "killer" essay is literally barking up the wrong tree. Been there with my daughter this year. Don't bank on that "super killer" essay to carry the day. Don't.

I was sort of in your position in 1993. I was a junior shooter with the Cherry Creek Junior Rifle Club in Denver. I was applying to MIT, and at the time it was my top choice. I was an OK junior shooter (won my state smallbore championship one year and got an invitation to the JORC), but was a better student (I skipped the JORC because it would have interfered with school).

I did contact the MIT coach at the time, who was very interested and did what he could to encourage my application, but I was not accepted. I ended up going to Cornell, where they had a club shooting team. In later life (I stayed in academia, and am now a professor at Arizona State), I learned I would have probably not liked MIT very much, but YMMV.

-Chris