TargetTalk

I am having an issue with a box of pellets that I got
Vogel 4.50mm. 0.53g
I bought a used FWB 80 not long ago to get my feet back into AP
So I orders a box of Vogel just to get started
The first 2-3 times that I went shooting was not all that great
Now I know I have a lot of practice to do
It has been a long time
But I couldn't even make a group of shots
It was all over
I did not think much of it and said to myself I just need a lot of work!
Tried to adjust the rear sight the best I could based on the poor shots
Shortly after I orderd more pellets but got something else
Diablo 4.5mm made for champion's choice
(Made in Germany) The Vogel are made in USA
So a couple weeks ago went shooting and grabbed the CC pellet box and started shooting and wow! Here's the group I was looking for
Not too bad maybe the size of a quarter
(And then some shots somewhat not so good if you know what I mean)
Are pellets really that much different from one to another?
Are some brands that I need to stay away from?
Anyone experienced things like that?
Could it be my pistol?
Jerry

I would assume pellets are the least likely variable to impact performance. However, like all manufactured items, some times something goes wrong. If you have a reloading scale, you could weigh a sample for consistency. Visually examine them for symmetry. Pistol shooting is demanding of your technique, small divergences from what you should be doing can have a substantial impact on the target. That said, if you find some pellets that you shoot well with, keep using them. Give away the pellets that don't shoot well. I use H&N pellets.

Wow! How tight is your hold that you would see a dramatic difference?

Motor Oil is Motor Oil.

I suspect that you are the difference. If you just pick up the gun and start shooting, your skill go's from zero to ok fairly quickly. If you shot Vogels at the beginning of the rapid learning curve and changed to another brand while still getting a bunch better each time you shoot the gun, it would be easy to blame the pellets..... I went thru this with my 777 a while back and was ABSOLUTELY convinced Vogels turned it into a shooter, when the reality was that I shot enough to get "over the hump".

Telling the real difference between quality pellets is beyond me, I'm sure you can measure the differences if you shot lots of groups out of a Ransom Rest, But High End pellets are indistuinguishable at my skill level....

Try light pellets, too; the FWBs are kind of puny.

Rover wrote:Try light pellets, too; the FWBs are kind of puny.

Don't shoot pellets that are too light though, or the piston wont have any cushion before smacking into the front piston wall. Many spring rifles have been ruined that way.

Andre wrote:

Rover wrote:Try light pellets, too; the FWBs are kind of puny.

Don't shoot pellets that are too light though, or the piston wont have any cushion before smacking into the front piston wall. Many spring rifles have been ruined that way.

Light pellets that are usually available for air pistols weigh 7 grs.; lighter pellets won't be more accurate nor will it be detrimental to most spring piston pistols on the market. Shooting light weight pellets in more powerful or "magnum" spring piston airguns will have the effect you mentioned.

Let me clarify something before we go too far
I know I just got started and yes I did blame myself
However yesterday I started too use the Vogel and the result was terrible after having a pretty good time with the CC the week before
So after shooting about 10 shots I switched to the CC and voila! Nice groups!
I did get some poor shots but that's OK for now
So am I right to think that maybe it's not me but more like the pellets that I used?

jerber wrote:So am I right to think that maybe it's not me but more like the pellets that I used?

The only sure way to know is to clamp your pistol in a vice and test both kind of pellets.
Remove the human factor altogether (or almost...)

Anything else is just a guess.

Hope this helps

Maybe your 80 needs resealed????

I'm wondering whether 0.53g might be a bit too heavy for a model 80.

What weight are your other pellets.

David Levene wrote:I'm wondering whether 0.53g might be a bit too heavy for a model 80.

What weight are your other pellets.

Based on the website they are both the same. 0.53

PFribley wrote:Maybe your 80 needs resealed????

I'm also thinking of that too
I'm going to test again this time I will start with the CC then try the Vogel and see if that does anything

jerber wrote:

PFribley wrote:Maybe your 80 needs resealed????

I'm also thinking of that too
I'm going to test again this time I will start with the CC then try the Vogel and see if that does anything

To check the seals, just open the breech. Newer seals are blue/green color, the buffer is also green or black. If they are white and yellow, they are the older seals and need to be resealed. Also, you should checkout the two mainsprings.

jerber wrote: I'm going to test again this time I will start with the CC then try the Vogel and see if that does anything

Next time you "test" do a real test. Have someone put 20 of each type of pellets in unmarked boxes while you are not looking. Then pick one box and shoot its pellets and repeat with the other box. I'm betting you won't see any difference in grouping.

FredB wrote: Next time you "test" do a real test. Have someone put 20 of each type of pellets in unmarked boxes while you are not looking. Then pick one box and shoot its pellets and repeat with the other box. I'm betting you won't see any difference in grouping.

Here is a story about Melentiev, the 581-record setter in free pistol, as told by his coach.

(To the younger readers let me explain that the Olymp is an old Soviet cartridge Russian shooters would still commit a crime for to get their hands on till this day. Sergei Martynov shot 600/600 in smallbore with his old stash of Olymp at the London games.)

"His pistol was very picky. For example R-50 cartridge barely fit into the 9-ring, but with the Olymp cartridge it shot better than many rifles. One time, several days before the Moscow Olympics, I fired several groups of cartridges from various manufacturers. I shot on the white side of a pistol target, but did not mark the results, so it was not possible to tell which cartridges were used -- this was written on a different piece of paper. When he looked at the targets, Sanya unmistakenly pointed to the Olymp target and said that he would not use it. Then, without hesitation, he pointed towards the Tenex target and said: "And here is my cartridge!" Sanya recognized only that cartridge. However, at that time Tenex changed the technology. The old Tenex had a distinct garlic smell. Frankly, I wanted to make him use Olymp for several reasons, including political ones. But I was a shooter myself and recognized the importance of the shooter's mindset during the execution of a shot, therefore I supported Sanya and saved for him some old Tenex. Nonetheless, during our discussions I tried several times to convince Sanya that he was wrong and that he would not be able to tell T from O if I were to load his pistol. I fired both cartridges from his gun and could not feel any difference. To my surprise Sanya was able unmistakenly to tell them apart. I was puzzled until I realized that upon unloading his pistol he was bringing his pistol close to his face and could smell the garlic."

Just an update
Went back shooting yesterday and tried both pellets
The CC still gave me pretty good groups
The Vogel showed a better result than last time but no cigar!
I have noticed that when loading the Vogel
They somewhat felt a little easier to push in?
Very very faint difference so just out of curiouasity when I got home I grabbed my digital caliper and checked to see maybe there was a difference in size
I measured 10 of each at the head of the pellets
I got an average of 4.46/4.48mm on the CC
For the Vogel I got 4.44/4.46mm average
So a very small difference but I wouldn't think this could affect the shots?
Could the Fwb 80 be that sensitive?
Not trying to make a big deal out of it
I'm going to put the Vogel away and use the CC
Thank you all for your input
Jerry

jerber wrote:So a very small difference but I wouldn't think this could affect the shots?
Not trying to make a big deal out of it

I do think that the very small difference makes a BIG difference and is a big deal since most match grade pellet manufacturers offers pellets with different head diameters so they can be the most compatible for a particular gun.