Advice please (handiness and eye domiance)

[conradin]

As you ALL know I know NOTHING about rifles. I jsut recently purchased a Haemmerli AR20, for the pure purposes of learning posture, holding, aim, etc. I don't really care if I really shoot it or not.

I am an AP and FP shooter, right hand, right non dominant eye. I always set my trigger weight at featherlight (never more than 5g on FP, and 400g first stage at AP). I have no intention of learning any other type of pistol. I do not know how to operate a semi-automatic. Revolver is my fun toys, but I never use them for competition, maybe just for tin shots.

Since i have no experience whatsoever in rifle, I have a question.
My dominant eye is left, and the dominance is major. I cannot shoot pistol without at least +1.5 lens, while my left eye is as clear as a telescope. I learned to shoot right on pistol only because all the pistol I found was right handed.

Now I have a chance to shoot left. I wonder if it is wise to learn to shoot left, since I have NO muscle memory at all. Misses showed me how do you pull a trigger on a rifle, and it has NOTHING to do with a FP or AP trigger pull. The only problem I find is my right forearm needs to be stronger, while if I shoot right, there is less strength problem.

I do not intend to buy iris or other lens to make up for the tiny murkiness of using my right eye. I want to keep my AR20 as simple as possible. I treat it no more than a dummy with the ability to shoot sometimes.

Essentially the question is, should I shoot right hand before I feel comfortable holding the trigger, or left handed with absolutely no problem aiming the front sight (three times the length of my FP). If I choose to shoot right handed, will I have a chance to screw up my muscle memory, while if I shoot left, there is no chance of screwing it up?

Is eye dominance a #1 or #2 reason for deciding handiness?

Also, does anyone here shoot rifle one hand, while sidearm with the other hand? I was told by my misses that is actually normal for hunting.

Advice please.

[jhmartin]

I'm a youth coach ... and a 4-H one at that.
In 4-H we have many shooting disciplines - rifle, pistol, shotgun, archery.

I tend to go with eye dominance as if the shooter wants to shoot shotgun I think it's easier to shoot a SG at moving targets with both eyes open, so I begin getting them used to using their other hand in rifle and learn with the dominant eye.

If a kids resists, then we go with how their hand is and put an occluder on the rifle or even a piece of tape on their glasses.

I've seen great shooters come out of either way ... go with what is comfortable.

[conradin]

Thank you, several people suggested to me about "being comfortable". I don't even know what that means since I do not even know how to hold a rifle correctly. Today the misses demonstrated YET another way of holding it while marching. To me right hand or left hand is the same. It makes no difference since it feels like it is a totally different item and has nothing to do with pistol. Other than the act of holding the grip and moving the trigger finger there is nothing in common. In fact, not even the trigger finger movement is the same as my pistols. Since my FP and RP are Morini grip, while AR20 is just a cheap plastic grip, I also do not feel the difference between right and left.

Hence the confusion. Handiness vs. Eyeness.

So many top class shooters shoot right, I wonder if they are truly right eye dominant, or were forced to shoot right when they were young. For the record I am right handed.

Sonja Pfeilschifter seems to be the only world class shooter who shoots left. Peter Sidi told me to shoot left, but I will double check with him after he came back home.

[C. Perkins]

Conradin;

Are your eyeglasses a recent/current prescription ?
Do you occlude your left eye when shooting pistol ?

Clarence

[conradin]

Conradin;

Are your eyeglasses a recent/current prescription ?
Do you occlude your left eye when shooting pistol ?

Clarence

Clarence, I never have a prescription since school days, and when I got a prescription a few years ago I actually got vertigo. I know I am not 20/20, but I don't see my situation is seriously enough to wear a pair of glasses. It did not go well a few years ago, and I don't think it will go well now.

In addition to the natural dominant eye, my right eye is also weaker because of having a professional disease. I am a watchmaker so I use the loupe, but sometimes doing quick work I will not wear it, as my teacher used to insist we must wear the loupe under ALL circumstances no matter how small a job it is. 15 years later my right eye is simply not as good as it used to be. But consider I can still do work without a loupe, obviously my right eye is still pretty good...it is just not good enough when compare with my left eye, which I NEVER use as a watchmaker. We do not use blinders for the left eye, we just close the left eye.

When shooting pistol I close my left eye. I used to use blinders. Initially a scotch tape when I started, then a white blinder clip on a pair of normal non-prescription glasses, then a true blinder on my shooting glasses. I have developed a habit of closing my left eye nowadays in regardless of whether I have a blinder or not.

A little off topic since this is a rifle forum. I have both right and left hand grip for my FWB65 air pistol. When I shoot my FWB65 left handed alone and close my right eye I did ok (hit the target 10M). I never did good enough on it (never made the bull), but it has a lot to do with the weight of the pistol and the trigger weight I set on it, then the sighting. Shooting it both hands left handed make little difference since I do not know how to shoot with both hands.
Since I do not have a left hand grip for my Steyrs, I cannot do a similar experiment. All my FP are also right hand gripped, so I cannot do experiments either.

[C. Perkins]

Conradin;

After reading everything you have stated I will give you my opinion, for what it is worth.

My suggestion is to shoot the rifle with your left hand and eye.

Good luck and let us know your progression no matter which way you decide.

Clarence

[conradin]

Thank you Clarence, a good friend of mine who is a military contractor, his wife has the same problem. Right handed but dominant left eye. He trained her to shoot pistols using right hand for combat/defense purposes. But for the rifle CZ-452, he taught her to use her left hand. It works out well.

[KatoomDownUnder]

Conradin, since you're just starting in rifle go with your eye dominance.

I'm left eye dominant but due to years of not knowing any better and the Army being what it is I'm a right handed shooter using a lense and blinder.

24 years ago as a young recruit if I'd had the knowledge and chance I would have learnt to shoot as a lefty.

[conradin]

Thanks. Right now I am doing nothing but using my Hämmerli AR20 to do basic handling drills as my misses is teaching me. Things like how to hold it, how to walk with it, how to "at rest", how to "present", etc. Looks like her JROTC days came in useful. I am not ready to "aim" yet. Both my hands and the rifle has not achieved a nice solid triangular shape strong enough to be stable. I was told my waist is the main part that control the left-right movement of the rifle. My right hand is for extremely fine adjustment more about up and down.

Since most people want me to go for the left I am going to give it a try. So far I have yet to shoot the air rifle. I am just trying to remember that my left hand should hold the end of the stock/butt of the rifle at all times regardless of whether the trigger is towards me or not when holding it up. This is because my trigger finger is on my left hand. I need to get rid of my natural tendency to go right because that is my shooting position for free pistols. I also hold my free pistol up with similar hand positions when transporting it from one firing box to another.

Having to be able to shoot both left and right may be a blessing in disguise. It wont stop me from shooting right, but it certainly will make me a good shooter as leftie.

This rifle thing, even as air rifle, is HARD, as far as footwork and holding is concerned. She pulled out her Enfield SMLE for demonstration, it is light compare to my Hämmerli. How Hämmerli decided to use this AR20 for teenagers is beyond my understanding.

[23's Dad]

You don't need to worry about the parade positions! Just the postitions you use to shoot. I never use "order arms", "present arms", "trail arms", "right/left shoulder arms" for any shooting purposes. Maybe a quick "port arms" while moving the rifle.

Grab any target shooting text and study the 3 or 4 positions there. Establishing good shooting positions is much more useful than being able to execute "inspection arms".

As long as you and the missus are having fun, do as you wish!

[conradin]

Thank you for your advice. The reason why I am also learning the parade position is that one I am curious and two, I want to use that to develop muscle memory. My natural instinct is still right handed, so by doing these parade position I can gradually develop an instinct on how to pick up, carry and eventually shoot left handed without having to think about it.

I put the rifle on the off hand stand, and I still have to memorize I have to be on the right side of the rifle. Doing parade will help me.

Anyway, it has been fun. Although it was not fun for my misses since in JROTC all she did was parade, she was given a plastic fake rifle while all the boys were given the real thing.

[Pat McCoy]

If you are going to shoot left handed (the best idea) then you are just making things harder on yourself by including the "close order drill" positions (because ALL of those are done right handed with the exception of "left shoulder arms".

Simply begin, immediately, by getting into position without the rifle and getting your body used to the position. After a day or two add the rifle, and just hold it (not even dry firing, just dry holding). Within thirty days of dry holding, then dry firing, and eventually shooting, you're body will have developed the muscle memory needed.

[conradin]

Thanks for the tip, I'll start doing that soon.