TargetTalk

Hey all, I am starting a new 4h rifle team immediately and have no clue what rifles to try to acquire.
I have talked with crosman and daisy.
I will have approx 10, 4th - 6th graders.
Want to hear what you think would be good air rifles. I have looked at the 853 887 888 the crosmans, need some input from you guys that have already been there. I can't waste the cash.
Other than ears and eyes, and a stand what do I need?
Should shoot targets and silhouettes.

I am a 4-H coach, have been about 1 year now, lots of fun.
As far as rifles go, 853 are fairly cheap, 75.00 from CMP used. But for the younger kids the 853 are much harder for them to charge. The 888/887 being CO2 are much easier for the younger ones to shoot, less effort in charging. but the 888/887 are 300.00 each. If you have the adult help and they are willing to charge the rifles for the kids that works well also, down side to that is when the kids get to the point of match shooting, they must be able to charge on their own. I would also sujest trying for grant monies, Freinds of the NRA, DNR or where ever you can get the funds.
Ottawa County Shooting Stars
NW Ohio

Ditto to what 22Long64 said.

If you call Daisy and speak to Denise Johnson, she can get you the 888's for about 250 I think .... 887's are now about $310.

Denise Johnson
Daisy Outdoor Products
National Account Manager Special Market
479-621-4317
djohnso@daisy.com

On the 888's, you might have to shorten a stock for the younger/smaller ones, but if you ever need a replacement, they are inexpensive.

I like the Lujan Style target traps as we can hang all three positions easily ... but modify the dimensions for 2 foot wide cardboard.

For cheap offhand stands: http://www.vc4hss.com/_Coaches/images/Offhand_Stand.pdfYou can make these for about $30 now I think

Monard USA has great prices on youth gloves.

Again to reinforce the previous post .... Friends of NRA is your friend. Get in touch with your state rep and find out when your grant deadlines are.

Another vote for the Daisy 888 rifles and Friends of the NRA grants.

As for equipment, rifles, off hand stands, gloves, eye protection, targets, pellets, pellet traps, some sort of back stop for the errant shots so you aren't putting holes in the wall. The kids will also need some sort of spotting scope or binoculars to spot their shots and adjust their sights.

Off hand stands are pretty easy to make out of some PVC pipe and a coffee can filled with concrete.

If you haven't already, get yourself some training. The NRA coaches course is fantastic and may be required by your sponsoring organization.

OK I am new, we will shoot 4h and where ever I can get us in. I heard nothing about "Off Hand" shooting. All I know is 3p and Silhouette standing. When would you use a stand?

Mike ...

Offhand is standing.
The OH stand is used to rest the rifle on between shots.

You'll see some manufactured ones and also some of our "bucket" stands at the Lubbock cup match

Joel

Ohhhhhhh!
Duh - is my green showing?

Try the daisy 499's.

They are BB guns, but that is what my club starts people out with at that age.

I think they are under $100.00 new.

The 4h has a national competition (I.B.B.G.C.M.) in which these are the only guns I have seen used.

In order to get to this match, you have to qualify at the state competition.

What state are you from?

Not sure what state you are from> I am in Ohio, the 4-H training for rifle is somewhat lacking. The 4-H teaches how to work with kids, if you need experience in shooting, techniques, equipment, formats or any other shooting information, I would highly sujgest going to a NRA coaches school. I have also learned a great deal from being a RO at CMP events and from working with other coaches.
In the fall there will be the Youth Conference, I believe in Colorado. A wealth of info if you can make to one. A week of class and loads of time to speak with people from all over the country about what they do at there programs.
I have found that there is a LOT TO LEARN and THE MORE I LEARN, THE MORE THERE IS TO LEARN.

Thanks, I am in New Mexico. My first official practice is next week. I am reading through coaching instructions everywhere I can find. On info overload! Would appreciate your thoughts on getting started and keeping it simple. This being "Day One" we are totally without resources. I will apply for grants but they will be 6 - 8 months off. I have a guy building target stands with donated wood. How do you fund your club?

We have a 20.00 per child fee, if there are more than 1 youth in a family we do 10.00 for each additional.

We have had some fund raisers, bake sale, sold drinks and snacks at local shoots,

We had practice lastnight and had 29 kids. we went thru 1000 pellets. Pellets are 70.00 per 5000 from CMP. We are looking for other ideas to generate funds.

While you are waiting to get into a coaching class, CMP has a real good basic manual-CMP Rifle Instruction Guide- for $4.95 on their website. I know they are having extensive backlogs right now, but it's an option. I have been giving them out to our coaches and it gives them a chance to get an idea of what is going on without having to learn it all while on the line.

Have you had a pre meeting to know what kind of response you will have?
One of the biggest things I would recomend is to keep parents involved!
They will help lots. If you have more than 6-8 kids you will need others to help with the coaching, ROing and keeping things on track.

Keep safety first and foremost, we have the new kids go thru a safety briefing and give them a quiz, now of course noone fails the quiz. Keep going over safety!

Start your kids on prone, and depending on ages and abilities you can advance thoes that are ready to learn standing and kneeling.

We have 5 853 club rifles, we received and NRA grant to buy 2 887. It seems as though the kids start and then parents buy the kids their own rifles. That way they can practice on hteir own as well.

Also I think it is important to make sure the kids have fun, if they enjoy it they will be back and probably bring a freind.

Hey,
Appreciate the input. Yes I had a pre-meeting with parents 16 families represented, 4 decided thier schedule was to busy. 4 dads filled out releases for background check so they could help out.

Our 4-H club averages about 100 youth per 6 week session. We are set up primarily to introduce youth to safely enjoying shooting sports. We are not competition oreinted (although we do have end of session tourniments, and field a decent sized group at the state tournament (and quite a few of our shooters have competed successfully at nationals).

Due to our location, most of our youth have already been introduced to shooting by their parents - as such we start with small bore on an outdor range. I think bb gun could be an excelent tool for introduction under other cercumstances. (I will probably use it with my sons - my daughter was introduced with small bore).

I think building a club is a progressive thing. Our funding is primarily from an annual raffle (this probably brings in 5-10k annually). We charge $10 for enrollement (plus a fee for any books required), and encourage each participant to sell a minimum of $50 of raffel tickets.

Our secondary source of funding is donations and grants. We apply for Friends of the NRA grants every few years - these grants are for specific equipment used for club development. Due to our size we get occasional used equipment donated as well (last year we almost 10 rifles donated by a retired coach (who found out about our program and understood we could put his no longer used equipment back to good use).

If you're looking for cheap, yet decent, pellets try ordering RWS Basic from Champion Shooters Supply (about $35.00 for 5,000). They shoot nearly as well as anything out there and more than good enough for your crowd.

They may be able to help you with used equipment as well.