TargetTalk

For those of you who've seen the demo at the OTC Coaches College and other places (SHOT show?), is this it?



http://www.pyramydair.com/cgi-bin/zoome ... el_id=1564

$900 isn't exactly "entry level" in my book...

More info:

Second stop was Air Arms, in their corner was a new PCP pistol. As luck would have it is produced for them my Alfa Proj. The pistol looks similar to the CO2 cousin but has the air reservoir in the grip. When full production will start is still in the air. But I did find out it will have a velocity of 430 fps which will give about 80 shots.

From http://www.citlink.net/~schattler/ar28.htm

So it sounds like this IS the pistol that was supposed to be an entry level AP. I'm disappointed. :/

ShootingAir.com

What the....?

That looks like a prototype for a plinker! Haha no way that will sell, just look at it! That grip? The trigger looks like it's not adjustable except for the distance to the grip. The barrel isn't even nearly as low as a normal target pistol.

Jesus H Christ, I can think of at least 900 reasons not to buy that thing, even for an "entry level" shooter.

The grip makes sense for an entry level club pistol, but with that price that is definitely not an entry level club pistol.

-Ted

Looks like "bolt action" loading and separate spring-loaded cocking.

If spring-loaded cocking (the two "bolts" on either side of the frame are pulled forward against a spring, engaging a sear) then I shudder to think about what that trigger must feel like.

Let alone the effect on your alignment and settle when the sear does let go and that spring-loaded horse collar goes slamming into a release button.

And is that really a PCP cylinder enclosed inside the grip?!? Do I see that right? With 3200 psi you would get what, 10 shots per fill?

This would be very disturbing if it weren't April Fool's Day!

Maybe I should follow that link just to make sure . . .

Steve

Steve Swartz wrote: This would be very disturbing if it weren't April Fool's Day!

Maybe I should follow that link just to make sure . . .

Steve

The head pistol coach here said he'd seen this while we were at practice on Monday night. He was asking if I knew about about it or had seen it, so I looked it up. Not an Aprils Fools on my part, and I can't see Pyramid pulling that kind of stunt. But that's why I asked if this is what was presented to those who have seen the real thing.

FWIW, here's something similar in CO2 by the same company:

http://www.bb-guns.org/index.asp?PageAc ... ProdID=169


Edit: A little more digging found this:

http://www.topgunairguns.com/Alfa%20Proj%20Article.htm

ShootingAir.com

Yep I followed the links and it looks legit . . . but I can't see how they are going to be able to sell many.

Steve Swartz

The cocking mechanism looks very similar to the TAU 7. IIRC back in the 90's (or was it the 80's) the MIT teams under Coach Pat M got some very excellent results using TAU 7's. I never heard of anybody complaining about the triggers, and obviously the poor kids never knew about "horse collars." Funny how much can be achieved without "electronic" triggers!

Yeah and Paw-Paw fed a family of 11 with his black powder flintlock too.

Apple, meet Orange!

Steve Swartz

(Who said anything about electronic triggers?!?)

Exkewz me! It was a preemptive mention of electronic triggers - figured you were going to get there eventually. Apples and oranges only in your mind. The forward-pull cocking of the TAU and the Alfa have more than superficial resemblance. No mocking reference to your grandfather's flintlock can make the fact go away: those university team shooters weren't bothered excessively by that "spring-loaded horse collar" or by the trigger you "shudder to think about." But why am I wasting my time?

Steve Swartz wrote: Apple, meet Orange!

Steve Swartz

(Who said anything about electronic triggers?!?)

Ho, ho.
Looks like a hybrid of an old Tau-something, and an even older "from behind the iron curtain" Telly spring-cocking AP from the 70s.
I am simply thrilled by the looks of that grip!
Yes, Steve, an electronic trigger simply is a must for this sci-fi pistol.

The grip angle seems more like a 1911 than a typical European ISSF pistol. If so, it would seem to setting up a hurdle for the kids when and if they graduate to better pistols.

Stan

IPshooter wrote:The grip angle seems more like a 1911 than a typical European ISSF pistol. If so, it would seem to setting up a hurdle for the kids when and if they graduate to better pistols.

Stan

The same could be said of the Tau 7 Jrs.... they look exactly the same. But then again, the kids who are using the Taus (and those who would be the market for this, if it were priced right) are all going to be shooting basic supported, advanced supported or 2-handed standing. Yeah, there might be some exceptions, but we try to encourage our one handed shooters to move onto one of the 2 FWB 100's or IZH46m's we own.

In the 3 positions before one handed, you're so far from any semblance of technique in regards to grip and rather focusing on learning the basics of trigger control and sight alignment that it would appear to be a non-issue.

Brian

ShootingAir.com

Brian M wrote: The same could be said of the Tau 7 Jrs.... they look exactly the same. But then again, the kids who are using the Taus (and those who would be the market for this, if it were priced right) are all going to be shooting basic supported, advanced supported or 2-handed standing. Yeah, there might be some exceptions, but we try to encourage our one handed shooters to move onto one of the 2 FWB 100's or IZH46m's we own.

In the 3 positions before one handed, you're so far from any semblance of technique in regards to grip and rather focusing on learning the basics of trigger control and sight alignment that it would appear to be a non-issue.

Brian

Agreed. It just seems odd that a Euro pistol would have a grip angle different from what the adult Euro pistols have.

Stan

its not on the air arms site, so I think we can all hold on to the pleasure of knowing 'it'll be a few months' like we have for the last x years!

edster99 wrote:its not on the air arms site, so I think we can all hold on to the pleasure of knowing 'it'll be a few months' like we have for the last x years!

Or you Could call Pyramid Air (888) 262-GUNS ~ they list them as In Stock. Might be a Better indicator of availability.

Brian

ShootingAir.com

I think you'll find that this is manufactured by Alfa Proj

http://www.alfa-proj.cz/en/products/fir ... -arms/co2/

the air arms on the barrel is a red herring...

[/u]

Brian M wrote:For those of you who've seen the demo at the OTC Coaches College and other places (SHOT show?), is this it?



http://www.pyramydair.com/cgi-bin/zoome ... el_id=1564

$900 isn't exactly "entry level" in my book...

I dry fired one of these yesterday. IMHO it is a mathmatical impossibility that they could sell it at a low enough price to make it value for money.

The grip was horrible (it felt like it had been designed for a totally different pistol and a different species of mammal), the balance was non-existant, the sights were at different angles, the build quality was terrible (there were so many sharp edges that it should be supplied with a pack of Band-Aids) and the only worse trigger I can remember was a Gamo Compact.

Just my opinion of course.

I was talking to Steve in City Air Weapons (Birmingham) the other day and had a dry fire of one of these, and have to agree its not that great... Apparently there were some Air Arms contribution on the design side to this, for some components, but it is produced by the Czechs. And apparently AA are not happy about Alfa using their designs, because use of these particular components on this gun wasn't agreed. As I understand it, anyway...

were did you come up with the price of $900. ? last price I saw was $525 ( intro price)and that was with shipping included. The price is going to be( I think) around $590. thats no were near the $1700 I paid for my gun .so my vote (without ever touching one) its an ok starter gun. I would rather see everyone buy a morini so the used gun market on quality guns would improve.

david alaways wrote:so my vote (without ever touching one) its an ok starter gun.

My worry is that really bad guns can be so difficult to shoot that they turn people away from the sport.