It may be totally off-board-topic but I hope nobody objects to me expressing my sympathy for those affected by the Hurricane.
It is put into perspective when you think that the affected area is the size of Great Britain.
Katrina
Moderators: pilkguns, m1963, David Levene, Spencer, Richard H
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Jose Rossy
- Posts: 414
- Joined: Wed Sep 08, 2004 8:17 am
- Location: Troy, Ohio, USA
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ted
shooting friend in Louisiana
Can anyone tell me if Mickey Brondum is ok? I met him abuot a year ago when he headed a coaching instructor course in Louisville, KY. I have tried to call him but, can't get through.
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Steve Swartz
1) Mickey lived directly in one of the most devastated areas. He has not returned phone calls or emails. I would like to think- and hope- he had the sense to obey at least one of the two evacuation orders; he is most likely out of town for the foreseeable future.
2) Hmm. "Massive Help" is probably a gross overstatement of what has been reported. Whether or not the EU is actually going to release - sell - oil from their strategic petroleum reserves (the nature of their "promised aid") is somewhat in dispute. Different stories have come out from different "officials." Some "Officials" are quoted in news reports saying Yes, the EU is going to release (sell) oil; other "Officials" say No, the story is not true. The track record of major EU member nations making good on promises of aid- to anyone- is somewhat, shall we say, "inconsistent." Today's Wall Street Journal, as a matter of fact, reported both stories (Yes and No) in different sections. Either way, selling oil from their reserves at today's inflated rates hardly constitutes "aid" to any rational person.
Steve Swartz
2) Hmm. "Massive Help" is probably a gross overstatement of what has been reported. Whether or not the EU is actually going to release - sell - oil from their strategic petroleum reserves (the nature of their "promised aid") is somewhat in dispute. Different stories have come out from different "officials." Some "Officials" are quoted in news reports saying Yes, the EU is going to release (sell) oil; other "Officials" say No, the story is not true. The track record of major EU member nations making good on promises of aid- to anyone- is somewhat, shall we say, "inconsistent." Today's Wall Street Journal, as a matter of fact, reported both stories (Yes and No) in different sections. Either way, selling oil from their reserves at today's inflated rates hardly constitutes "aid" to any rational person.
Steve Swartz
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David Levene
- Posts: 5617
- Joined: Mon Mar 01, 2004 12:49 pm
- Location: Ruislip, UK
Any of us only know what we are told by the media. BBC News - Oil Reserves StoryJose Rossy wrote:I saw briefly on the TV news that "Europe was providing massive help with oil". Do you know anything about that in more detail?
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Jose Rossy
- Posts: 414
- Joined: Wed Sep 08, 2004 8:17 am
- Location: Troy, Ohio, USA
Obviously their offer of help is having a positive impact already by helping to lower oil and gas futures prices, even if the offer doesn't meet your standards of "massive help".Steve Swartz wrote:2) Hmm. "Massive Help" is probably a gross overstatement of what has been reported. Whether or not the EU is actually going to release - sell - oil from their strategic petroleum reserves (the nature of their "promised aid") is somewhat in dispute. Different stories have come out from different "officials." Some "Officials" are quoted in news reports saying Yes, the EU is going to release (sell) oil; other "Officials" say No, the story is not true. The track record of major EU member nations making good on promises of aid- to anyone- is somewhat, shall we say, "inconsistent." Today's Wall Street Journal, as a matter of fact, reported both stories (Yes and No) in different sections. Either way, selling oil from their reserves at today's inflated rates hardly constitutes "aid" to any rational person.
Steve Swartz
I personally want to thank our European friends for anything they might do to help.
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ted
I heard from a mutual friend of Mickey's last night that he indeed did get out with five other family members and is staying with friends in another state. I am relieved to hear this. My friend also said that Mickey was pretty sure his house was gone based on its location. My thoughts and prayers are with him and everyone else that has lost homes/loved ones to this tragedy.
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Steve Swartz
Important Things first: Good news about Mickey; I figured he (being retired military) would obey the orders (hmm in the US is an "order to evacuate" legally binding? Or does it just mean you "stay at your own risk?") of both the mayor and the Governor. There are many who suffered a much worse fate than having to evacuate. The death toll I fear will be large. The cost to rebuild will be large. The cost to the regional economy will take years to recover. I fear the disaster will be akin to the one that spurred Holland to rebuild/revamp their dyke system in recent history. Perhaps US officials should ask for assistance from the Dutch engineers when it is time to rebuild . . .
Minor Gripe Second: Thanks for the link David; selling 60 million barrels of oil (2 million per day for 30 days) on the open market- even if it all goes to China- is a nice gesture.
I mean if I have this wrong, and they are *donating* refined gasoline and jet fuel directly to affected areas then I am obviously being a pompous ass and I apologize in advance!
[Poetic justice that it is at least probably in part purloined Iraqui oil from the scandal, right?]
The article was inaccurate in one respect at least; it implied that the 2.7% Wednesday-Friday drop in crude price was in response to these oil futures being put- hard to go that far, since 1) the spike was artificially high in response to "worst case assumtpions" and 2) right before the price correction the damage estimates to Gulf Coast production and refining capacity were revised significantly downward.
Anyhow- I know I am sounding ungrateful- but I do thank the IEA for the gesture of solidarity.
Not to be too stubborn- but offering to sell 0.015% of your reserves (60 million out of 4 billion) at a time when the prices are artificially high in the first place *still* doesn't really sound like "Massive Aid" to me. They will reap a huge profit on the sale now; when they replace the oil they will be able to replace it for much less than the current sale price + margin from original purchase. In order for them to lose money on the deal, they would have to replacement purchase the oil at somewhere north of $100 per barrel.
Anyhow, nice gesture but somewhat akin to rushing in "aid" to the affected area in the form of plywood for 25$ a sheet . . . good work, YES, and needed help, YES, but not obviously altruistic?
Steve Swartz
Minor Gripe Second: Thanks for the link David; selling 60 million barrels of oil (2 million per day for 30 days) on the open market- even if it all goes to China- is a nice gesture.
I mean if I have this wrong, and they are *donating* refined gasoline and jet fuel directly to affected areas then I am obviously being a pompous ass and I apologize in advance!
[Poetic justice that it is at least probably in part purloined Iraqui oil from the scandal, right?]
The article was inaccurate in one respect at least; it implied that the 2.7% Wednesday-Friday drop in crude price was in response to these oil futures being put- hard to go that far, since 1) the spike was artificially high in response to "worst case assumtpions" and 2) right before the price correction the damage estimates to Gulf Coast production and refining capacity were revised significantly downward.
Anyhow- I know I am sounding ungrateful- but I do thank the IEA for the gesture of solidarity.
Not to be too stubborn- but offering to sell 0.015% of your reserves (60 million out of 4 billion) at a time when the prices are artificially high in the first place *still* doesn't really sound like "Massive Aid" to me. They will reap a huge profit on the sale now; when they replace the oil they will be able to replace it for much less than the current sale price + margin from original purchase. In order for them to lose money on the deal, they would have to replacement purchase the oil at somewhere north of $100 per barrel.
Anyhow, nice gesture but somewhat akin to rushing in "aid" to the affected area in the form of plywood for 25$ a sheet . . . good work, YES, and needed help, YES, but not obviously altruistic?
Steve Swartz
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Steve Swartz
. . . oh sorry one more thing; the reason why I am being so peeved about this has much to do with the response of "the world community" to the tsunami incident last year . . . anybody want to look up the numbers for aid pledged vs. delivered; both public and private; for various countries involved? I remember quite distinctly the US being publicly trashed for not "doing enough" at the time . . .
Katrina
I feel that any aid should be water, food, and shelter to the people before they worry about oil. I know it is important for transport in these devastated areas, but immediate aid to keep people alive should be the first priority.
As to the tsunami aid - well, the millions of $s are sitting there and not being spent. I hear that only 2% of the money has been used so far.
Glad Mickey and his family are safe, but sorry he has lost everything.
As someone from another country, we can sympathise, in part, as we can clearly remember Cyclone Tracey - which wiped out Darwin on Christmas Eve a few years ago.
AlexL.
As to the tsunami aid - well, the millions of $s are sitting there and not being spent. I hear that only 2% of the money has been used so far.
Glad Mickey and his family are safe, but sorry he has lost everything.
As someone from another country, we can sympathise, in part, as we can clearly remember Cyclone Tracey - which wiped out Darwin on Christmas Eve a few years ago.
AlexL.
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sdesrocher
- Posts: 20
- Joined: Tue Apr 27, 2004 8:05 pm
Like this?I feel that any aid should be water, food, and shelter to the people before they worry about oil. I know it is important for transport in these devastated areas, but immediate aid to keep people alive should be the first priority.
http://www.cbc.ca/story/canada/national ... 50906.html
http://www.cbc.ca/story/world/national/ ... 50909.html
http://www.cbc.ca/story/canada/national ... 50907.html