TargetTalk

I have the opportunity to buy a Rika and as I do not have access to any coaching would this be a good idea, I shoot average 358/400 Air and am not improving on that.

Short answer: YES!
When I first got my Rica I used it for routine dry fire. It made dry firing interesting and I solved several problems. It is very useful to try out different variations of grip and stance. Instant feedback. Now I get it out only for problem solving and occasional checks. There is so much information in your movement shown by the Rica that it will take some time to figure out what it means but a great deal of useful information is obvious from the beginning. Thanks for the reminder, I should use it more often.

Bob Fleming

Noira wrote:I have the opportunity to buy a Rika and as I do not have access to any coaching would this be a good idea, I shoot average 358/400 Air and am not improving on that.

Our club recently purchased a used RIKA system. We had some initial problems getting it going (wasted a lot of training time), but the problems were resolved.

Learning to analyze the data is the trick. Some of the shooter's problems are immediately obvious, but other problems take more time to figure out. It can also be a distraction to the shooter at times. Be careful not to be in a hurry to see your shot playback on the screen, it's like looking through the spotting scope right after you let the shot go - not a good habit to get into.

One of our better rifle shooters saw how very small movements change her natural point of aim, and began to fine-tune her position more. Her scores immediately made a big jump. She had been told that before, but the RIKA showed it to her in a way that really made her think.

The RIKA shows you the quality of the combination of your position and your technique, but won't help you build a good basic position if you don't already have one. Regular coaching, training seminars, and good technical info are a lot better for that in my opinion.

P.S. Edited post slightly - thought we were talking about air rifle for a minute...

Jay V
IL
www.aiac-airguns.org

I love my rika. during the summer I don't have access to an indoor 10 m range. It helps so much. You see your movement and your hold improve. If have access to an a range, you really should do both.
Teresa

Noira wrote:I have the opportunity to buy a Rika and as I do not have access to any coaching would this be a good idea, I shoot average 358/400 Air and am not improving on that.

Hi Noira.

I'm a pistol coach and have been using the Rika with my junior team over the last year. I think that it is a great tool, but would I recommend that people use it for dryfire practice and/or daily training? Simply stated, no.

I work with just over a dozen athletes and I regularly put them on the Rika for a 30-40 shot test. I then take the data, enter it into Excel (Rika does not have an export function which seriously limits its practical use), perform some calculations and then compare the data against other shooters (some National team members) and previously recorded athlete data.

With each assessment I review the following data: X and Y Deviation, Product of the X and Y deviation (calculated), how many shots break within their area of aim, where their shots break in relation to their area of aim, % of Time Holding the 10 (Pointing Focus Related - actual hold size of 10, not in relation to the target location), and % of Time Holding the 7 (Pointing Focus Related - actual hold size of 7, not in relation to the target location.) I calculate the Standard Deviation of the % Holding 10, % Holding 7 and XY Product. I'd also recommend extending the recording time for the shot, so you can see the whole shot, and not just the last few seconds before delivery.

With this data, I make recommendations on their training plan. A month or two later, I reassess the athletes performance, review the new data in relation to the old data, and restart the process of training recommendations.

The Rika gives objective data which you can interpret and store. It allows you to take a snapshot in time of what the shooter is actually doing. Unfortunately, the data does tell you its meaning. Your interpretations can be subjective and that is its only drawback.

I rarely watch the traces now. They give some help as to how to interpret some of the numbers. As well, I can see if they have a consistent approach to their area of aim. I would suggest that you stick with the advanced statistics: Average Hit and Holding, Time Charts, Elapsed Time, and Analysis of Last Second Before Shot (specifically Pointing Focus Related.) This will give you lots of data, which you can expand upon with a spreadsheet application.

I like my Rika and believe that as a coach, it is an invaluable tool, to assess the training needs of an athlete. As an athlete, use it as such, but not as part of your daily training regime. Save the money and dryfire against a blank wall. What what the gun does. You'll get almost the same results from a daily perspective. If I wasn't coaching, I would probably not get the full value out of electronic trainer.

Hope this helps.
Patrick Haynes
NRA/USA Shooting Advanced International Pistol Coach
http://www.targetshooting.ca

. . . on the other hand . . .

There are some things you can monitor during training witht eh Rika as a "self coached athlete."

For one example- set the trace colors to catch the last 300/100 milliseconds and you can directly determine trigger squeeze quality based on distance travelled during that time. Also, determine quality of subconscious release (indirectly) by observing direction of trace prior to shot release- was the trace moving toward or away from the center of the target?

While you can't tell much from the "statistics" during training, you can certainly assess many attributes of your training regimen (try different foot positions and compare % time in 9 ring for example) to determine which technique parameter is better.

Anyhow, I agree (almost totally) with Patrick- but would modify by adding that for MOST shooters, the capabilities of the Rika can provide more aof a distractiont han a help.

Pzarticularly since the "instructions" are somewhat err thin and if you don't know how to interpret the many stats etc. you are pretty much lost.

Steve Swartz

Steve Swartz wrote:For one example- set the trace colors to catch the last 300/100 milliseconds and you can directly determine trigger squeeze quality based on distance travelled during that time.

Surely just looking at the last .3 second will not show anything about the trigger. You actually need to be looking for a change in the speed of movement compared to the preceeding period.

Good points, Steve.

I find that most people looking into the electronic trainers are hoping to get alot more out of the purchase, thinking that it will get them further along in their shooting. In most cases, it ends up sitting in the corner gathering dust. BUT not in all cases.

Part of the problem with the Rika is that there isn't a very good tutorial on how to interpret the data. Most that is written on electronic trainers is on the SCATT from a rifle shooter's perspective. For instance, Target Rifle Australia includes SCATT analysis in their coaching certification prgram. Marcus Raab is also very good at reading the data. Unfortunately, pistol looks/feels different than rifle. I don't kow if the wisdom of triggering while moving into the centre versus away is valid for pistol. The consistency is the issue of concern for me.

Noptel had a couple of excellent reports on their tool and how the data related to shooters of various ability. Probably the best that I've read yet. If I recall, it determined that the best hold will produce the greatest benefit to the athlete, in front of triggering and aiming (the latter two which reduce the effectiveness of the hold.) The latter two will reduce the outcome, but the better the triggering and aim, the smaller the negative impact. What does this tell us: work on hold first and foremost (at least in precision shooting. I'm not sure on the data from rapidfire shooters.) Hold gives the greatest advantage, which is then undone by triggering and aim. Hmmmmm: guess we need to work on those two as well! ;-)

As for the .3 second, David, I think Steve is talking about the reaction time (.2-.3 seconds) and whether or not the shooter is consciously reacting to the sight picture. If I see steady x-y lines prior to the shot release, and then a discernible variance at the .2/.3 second mark, then I have a fair indication that the shooter is consciously pulling and trying to make the shot happen. I think that we're talking the same thing.

I think that the average shooter would get more benefit for their money by travelling to see a coach they trust and working with him/her in several sessions over the course of a few months. Remember: electronic trainers are a feedback tool, and the data isn't the most user friendly. A coach, on the other hand, is a feedback tool with which you can speak in the language you understand.

Just a thought.
Patrick

Patrick Haynes wrote:As for the .3 second, David, I think Steve is talking about the reaction time (.2-.3 seconds) and whether or not the shooter is consciously reacting to the sight picture. If I see steady x-y lines prior to the shot release, and then a discernible variance at the .2/.3 second mark, then I have a fair indication that the shooter is consciously pulling and trying to make the shot happen. I think that we're talking the same thing.

That's exactly my point Patrick. Just looking at the last .3 second tells you nothing. You have to compare it to the previous period.

I think we have to be careful about how we treat the reaction time. It is perfectly possible to conciously pull the trigger, if you have a good trigger technique, without increasing the amount of movement of the gun.

It is also highly possible, with a sub-concious shot, for the pistol to drift away from the X-ring. The eyes/brain recognise a good sight picture but by the time that the shot has been fired sub-conciously the gun will have moved away from the centre.

Some of the best shooters I have worked with, or studied the Scatt traces for, show no change in what we normally refer to is the reaction time. The reason for this is that they are firing the shot automatically. Once the brain has recognised that the gun is aiming in the right area the "Go" signal is given. At some stage after that, probably a few seconds, the shot will break without any further positive input. For a shooter who is fit enough to hold the pistol in the 10 ring (or in the high 9s) this automiatic shot release gives fantastic results.