TargetTalk

It appears that the basic answer might be get a Star or read about what drops what and how much for whatever your effort and goal.

It would also appear that if you are simply reloading to reload, I suppose the above might be relevant to some.

It might also appear that if your target is at 25 yards, then maybe the gnat's butt aspect is not as important if the target is at 50 yards.

HOWEVER, "the proof is in the pudding" as they say.

The answer might be better answered by providing the results of each of the above efforts by submitting pictures of load technique along with sanctioned match targets, match scorecards, or aggregate scorecards. Each, or any, will surely eliminate the "pretenders" with their ideas and efforts.

My own efforts have been with using an RCBS Chargemaster to automatically weigh each charge. May not be gnat's butt, but the loads are consistent. I use a Dillon 550 with RCBS Cowboy dies. Powders used vary between N310, BE, and Clays. Bullets in the past were mostly Speer 98 and Lapua 83. Have used a Walther GSP Expert with a faster-twist barrel and an Older GSP ("KA" - 1990). The latter is more accurate.

My NRA classification has varied throughout the NRA Expert level.

I am starting to get back into much more regular shooting after running NRA tournaments and CMP matches for several years.

Lately, I have been using T&B bullets - 64 SWC with 1.5 Clays and 100RNFP with 2.0 BE. I use a heavy roll crimp (started with feeding for a Pardini HP for the same reason as now). I seat both level with the case edge. They look funny with the bullet side well inside the case. The result is consistent function without issue and they have produced great target scores in testing. I will be competing in several CMP Pistol Matches (50 and 25-yard targets) in the next few months.

I have also used 1.1 N310 with the 64 SWC for the short line. Because I wear hearing protection, I barely hear a "puff" ("wuss" gun to some competing along side) when the gun fires. No recoil. Don't do that when also shooting the long line with the 100RNFP because I would then have to adjust my scope.

Earl at Carlwalther once told me that trying to hit something at 50 yards with a WC bullet was like trying to hit something at 50 yards with a beer can. Just wasn't met to be.

This is what I did. Had 20 off brass blocks milled and drilled out a series of holes in 0.1mm steps.
I can swap them over quickly and know exactly what charge its going to throw, no spending time tweaking and weighing.
Also a round hole should throw a more consistent charge than a slot.

JamesH wrote: ↑Thu Jun 27, 2024 5:05 am The expander is critical, full length and correct diameter.

James, Should the "correct diameter" be the size of the bullet or (say) one thou oversize to allow for brass springback?

Also, your brass charge bars are interesting - wish I had the facilities to make such stuff. A while back I bought a similar set-up from a guy called Steve Rutledge in NSW. He was a machinist (unfortunately retired now) who made and sold a charge bar with alternative inserts for different loads. You had to drill out the pilot holes to the size required to give you the charge you wanted from each powder. I bought a tapered reamer off eBay to ease out the holes to get just the right loads. Inserts are easy to change without emptying the reservoir. See attached PDF flyer. New inserts are no longer available but they are not difficult to make and, failing all else, the holes can be drilled out and an aluminium rod glued in, faced off and drilled to the size required.


Bob.

PS I've just realised that Iwent through all this back in August 2022! Apologies.

JamesH wrote: ↑Fri Jul 05, 2024 4:55 am
...a round hole should throw a more consistent charge than a slot.

Agree wholeheartedly. I am currently using up what little Bullseye powder I have left and, using the SRF powder bar I am getting remarkably consistent loads of 1.58-1.60gn (using a GemPro 250 scale) even though the powder level is now well below the baffle in my RL550B reservoir. I'm being really careful though by weighing every 5th charge. I have only 355gn left - 220 loads, but think it might be about time to break out the VV N310 and give the remaining Bullseye to someone who can use it - pistol powder a bit scarce at the moment!

Bob

I found it simplest to just have a machinist knock out a bunch of brass bars, then drill them out as I needed them.
Easier than getting parts milled and turned and fitting together.
Now I need another batch.

It’s probably trying to teach grandma to suck eggs but after a number of years of reloading with my previously loved RL550B and the extra-small charge bar and getting significant (in my view) variations in powder load, I've found that load consistency depends on allowing the powder to drop! That is achieved by pausing on the down stroke to give the powder time to drop from the charge bar
through the powder funnel and into the case. I now get very repeatable loads to within +/- 0.02gn* with Bullseye - a flake powder, and no spillage. Fancy that…

* I use a GemPro 250 electronic scale (which has to warmup to be consistent). Don’t know why they are not made anymore.

Bob

Just switch to a better powder measure, problem solved.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=daSIAaQvDJw&t=256s

Graham

Shiloh wrote: ↑Fri Jun 28, 2024 1:29 pm
Earl at Carlwalther once told me that trying to hit something at 50 yards with a WC bullet was like trying to hit something at 50 yards with a beer can.

Well ... yeah ...

But a beer can full of lead...

Thrown with a perfect 'spiral' ...

I load 32 S&W long loads with a progressive reloader in a 2-stage process for a Pardini with a Dave Wilson barrel that holds X-ring from a Ransom Rest at 50 yards with my loads.

I have tried many of the suggestions in this thread and all over this and other forums to get accurate/consistent powder loads along with correct case resizing, correct case flare, consistent bullet seat, and appropriate crimp for the 32 S&W Long. I load with Dillon RL1050 and use it as a 2-stage progressive. Because I could not get consistent power charges from the X=small powder bar - no matter what I did (e.g., slow loading, vibrator on the powder tube,...). And, my loads are so small that the 25% variation I was getting resulted in unacceptable long line accuracy. The long line load I shoot is a 98 gr HBWC (Bear Creek) over 1.52 gr of Bullseye.

The first stage is case prep. I deprime, resize, prime, and flare (the bullet seater and crimp dies are removed). This goes as fast as the loader can be cycled which is pretty fast.

Next, I charge each case with powder (accurate to 0.02 gr) using an autotrickler https://autotrickler.com/pages/autotrickler-v4. This powder measure system was developed for rifle long-range shooters. But, the developer was kind enough to make some minor tweaks to his code to allow pistol shooters to get consistent small loads (e.g., for the 32 S&W long).

Stage 2 of the process is to seat and crimp the bullet.

Sure, my process limits the production rate to just a couple hundred per hour. But, I don't shoot it all that much because it is setup pretty much like my 22 SP.

The Dillon powder drop system works good enough for short line loads (Lapua 98 gr HBWC over 1.42 gr Bullseye). I use HP and Starline brass for the long line and Lapua for the short line.

For what it is worth, there is so much more work/trial & error that went into developing a load that will hold X-Ring and reliably cycle my gun. But, the question in this thread was just about reloading on a progressive.

Lastly, to answer the question – small caliber pistol loads may be loaded on most any progressive. It all depends on what the shooters desire is. It takes very little effort to get a load that goes bang. It took me a lot of work and outside of the box thinking to tailor a load that will cycle consistently and hold X-Ring in my gun. And, the underlying assumption was that my gun would hold X-Ring.

This mimics my experience.
The reason why I don't reload the .32 S&W Long Wadcutter progressively is the powder charge.
Sure, it can be done and it goes bang, but from a ransom rest the story is very different.
And before anyone says it, yes, I can't shoot as well as a ransom rest, however, having a reload that I know how it groups, gives me the confidence to approach a match with no excuses.

Gravy, what velocity are you getting from your loads?
I use H&N 98 gr HBWC with 1.4gr VV N310 and get around 720fps.

As I previously posted, I was hand loading on a single stage press. Then tried on my Dillon and finally bought a fully reconditioned STAR press from the new owner of the company. What a pleasure. Double crimp die set up. Once you know what powder bushing to use, just start cranking them out. Set up for only 1 caliber but I have 3 .32 S&W Long WC pistol’s and also load for two friends with them.

Re RMCA: Gravy, what velocity are you getting from your loads?
I use H&N 98 gr HBWC with 1.4gr VV N310 and get around 720fps.

Sorry man, I don't get out to the forum often. My velocities are:

• SL - 98 gr Lapua HBWC over 1.42 BE ~ 670 fps (BTW, not enough umps for cold weather - have to bump it up 0.1 gr). This is my favorite load to shoot and one of my favorite pistolies. This load holds X-Ring on the SL; but, I could throw the bullets and do just as good at 50 yrds.

• LL - 98 gr Bear Creek over 1.52 BE ~ 720 fps (I also have shot the 100 gr Meister DEWC and get acceptable 50 yrd groups; but, the bullet weights are so inconsistent that I group them by 1/2 gr groups and load).

I don't see much of the H&N 98s; so, you have been playing this game for a while. I have a few hundred of them left.

Thanks for sharing your info.

For what it is worth, I am classified expert in precision 22 and have shot a hand full of master scores and one HM (wind must have blown them back in the 10 ring - accident?). I shoot the 32 expert; but, am still classified SS - I just don't shoot it enough. One of the most incredible loading experiences I have had is with the 38 Mod 14-3 that I was shooting in CMP; simply changing bullets from SWC to RN brought the groups from 19+" to ~2" on the LL off a RR.