TargetTalk

miata55 wrote:(snip)...I did everything I thought I was supposed to do (FFL sent - Cashiers check sent, verified sellers address and phone) and here it is three weeks later and no rifle, and no further contact with seller. (snip)

Once it is certain that a fraud has occurred, and not some sort of unfortunate event affecting the seller, do the group a favor - name names and point fingers.

That said, I run a North Texas 4H Rifle program about a hundred miles from your location. We shoot 3-position smallbore like your group. We have a great supporting rifle club, so the 4H students get all their equipment and ammo to use at no charge, and in certain cases the parent can take a rifle home for practice between scheduled classes. Someone the size of your student would get to use either a Savage Mk I FVT (6 lb.), an Izhmash CM-2 Cadet (7.5 lb.), or an Anschutz 1903 Junior (8.2 lb.). We also own Anschutz 1903 full size, but at 10 pounds they are too heavy for any of our current students to handle.

I like the Izhmash CM-2 Cadet for students under high school age or even older - it is accurate, light, youth-sized, and has a good trigger.

The CM-2 has some drawbacks but they can be overcome easily enough. First, the rear aperture has an oddball thread pattern. This means one needs to retain the extra different sized Izzy aperture discs that come with the rifle to be able to change rear aperture size. Second, the odd size front aperture prevents using standard Anschutz-size apertures, including the plastic ones that I prefer. It helps to have a full set of the original Izzy front apertures. It is possible to file some off a Parker-Hale aperture set, available from many suppliers.

Last drawback is the odd-dimension of the accessory rail on the Izhmash - but for $12 and some screws and time using a Dremel, a drill, and hacksaw, one can replace the rail with one that accepts Anschutz (or Winchester) standard dimension gear (use Annie rail size, it's easier to obtain accessories).

A new CM-2 Cadet with sling and accessories costs $585 or so, about half the cost of a new Anschutz 1903. When outgrown, it retains about 80% of its value especially if none of the sights or accessories are lost, or one could donate it or loan it to the club for another young shooter to learn with.

There have been many good suggestions. I hope your current difficulty gets resolved to your satisfaction soonest.

miata,
The one thing you did not mention, did you contact the bank to see if the cashiers check was cashed. I am not sure what kind of recourse might be available thought the bank system but at least they should be notified and perhaps can work with law enforcement.

I know if I was going to commit a fraudulent firearm sale I would not be picking an Anschutz 1903 as my bait. Too much of a niche market. But that is just me and I tend to avoid felonious activities. (Life is simpler that way) I hope it works out without anymore undue hassle.

'Dude

Texdance,
While the CM-2 is a great club gun for all the reasons you mention I often encourage individual owners to look at something more universal. (ie the 1903).

The issue with the CM-2 is that it seems like EVERYTHING needs to be modified to fit. As I have told a few parents of juniors taking the step of getting their own gear, something like a 1903 will take pretty much any of the mainstream accessories out there, then when the shooter fleets up to the next level of rifle, all the accessories, sights, sight accessories, handstops, fore end riser blocks, etc will all go right on the next rifle if it is Anschutz and most everything (front sights being biggest issue) will also go on a FWB or Walther.

Just my 2 cents on the subject.

'Dude

I agree with you about the drawbacks of the CM-2, which I tried to point out in detail and how to get around them. For someone buying a starter rifle, not knowing if the student is going to compete for years, the price difference between a new CM-2 Cadet at $585 (plus $13 and some time to install an Annie rail) and a new Anschutz 1903 Junior ($1045 at CMP) could be important.

I have four of the CM-2 Cadets in our club, and even with only a simple swivel attachment they are more popular than our two Anschutz 1903 Juniors, mostly due to being lighter by over half a pound and appearing less bulky to the eye.

I replaced the rails on two of them with Anschutz standard rails, available from CSS for $13. One 14" rail section cut in half makes two Cadet rails. It took me a half hour each to widen the channel and install a new rail, not counting the time I spent chasing down my misplaced Dremel tool. Now I can use all our Annie stops and swivels and rests with the CM-2 rail.

I have received surly comments from people with lots of money whenever I try to point out cheaper alternatives, not saying anyone here is doing that, but it has happened. One club I had the misfortune to work with charged high fees to the kids - $100 annual plus $25 weekly for ammo - and when I asked did their club ever provide even one student scholarship I was told in effect "hell no the fees keep out the riff raff", and we all know who they are here in Texas - anyone not like us.

When buying two, three or more rifles for a club, the cost calculation is necessarily different. Since these rifles never wear out, I would agree that it is better for a club to bite the bullet and if at all possible buy the more expensive but standardized Anschutz or other top brand instead of the Izhmash. But for an individual or even a club on a tight budget, the CM-2 Cadet is a great youth target rifle. At current used resale a good one has a sells for about $375 - $450; better make sure it comes with its accessories because they are impossible to buy except with the rifle.

The Scot and hobbyist in me is always looking for value, and the Izhmash CM-2 , while not for everyone, certainly gives good value, and lots of fun.

Texdance,

I do hear your point on the cost vs the uniqueness of the accessories. This is exactly why my position is the clubs should go with the Izhmash while the individuals go mainstream with the Anschutz 1903.

In most club operations you can usually find some one who can do a professional job on modifications. An individual parent might not have the skills nor know how to find someone to make some of the desirable changes to a Izhmash. As clubs are often of limited funding and the rifles will usually be in the presence of someone who understands their idiosyncrasies a set of five Izhmash as opposed to two Anschutz 1903s (by the time you get sights in there I think the new 1903 is close to $1500) is clearly the way to go.

An individual parent who may be a very talented amateur gunsmith or have the mechanical skills of a donkey something more mainstream can be a safer more advisable route. As I have told every parent willing to listen, the 1903 is really a transition rifle, plan on your son or daughter shooting it for about 2 years, if they stick with it you can likely sell the rifle for 75% of what you paid for it as you fleet up. If they don't stick with it you can likely sell the rifle for about 75% of what you paid for it as they go do something else.

In my area, (Mid Atlantic) a 1903 is a pretty easy sell and most are sold with the new owner waiting before the previous owner receives their new upgrade and is ready to pass their 1903 along. The Izhmash is much less sought after, and while the residual value percents are about the same they can take much longer to find a buyer.

Now, all that being said, if it comes down to being able to buy an Izhmash and a few other important articles, (own coat, own sling, own glove) or an Anschutz and still have to borrow everything else, buy the Izhmash, build some positions and start putting lead down the line.

Cheers,
'Dude

Well surprise surprise surprise. I sent the seller a letter stating he had two days left to contact me and in my note I stated exactly what I was going to do if he did not respond. I think that one of the facts that I was going to pursue federal mail fraud charges got their attention because low and behold his wife wrote me almost immediately and the Anschutz was sent UPS the same day. I just picked it up from my FFL this morning. My grandson is on vacation with my son in North Carolina (where the rifle was originally) and my son was going to take a side detour and knock on the guys door if I had not gotten it. Grandson is VERY happy and the seller not only doesn't have to deal with my lawyer (yes, I was even going to have him contact a friend of his (the Texas State Attorney General) in Austin, but having a 6 ft. 4 in 275 pound interested party showing up on his door wasn't going to be a pleasant experience either. Anyway, we have it, now comes the fun part of buying the needed accessories that so many of you all have readily suggested previously. Thanks for listening!

Nice to know it worked out in the end. Unfortunate you had to deal with the hassle and your grandson had to go through the roller coaster of gonna get a rifle not gonna get a rifle.

Cheers,
'Dude

Great news! Thanks for sharing and please keep us posted on your grandson's progress!