Worst gun?

[MG2-owner]

MG2-owner.
Thanks.
it is you NOT the gun.
Julio

I think I hve to clear up the matter a bit:
My MG2 has, during my 4 years of ownership, jammed and malfunctioned steadily, no matter what kind of ammo I use.
Repeded replacement of parts, and rebuild with upgraded aprts, by the importer, have not cured the malfunctioning. It is the gun, not me.
I have owned guns that did not malfunction very often. The MG2 do malfunction very often. Much more often than anyy other gun of its type, that I have owned, or used.
It is the gun that is malfunctioning, not me....

Good results? Whenever the gun shooses to work reliably for half a match or so, the result are comparable to results achieved by use of guns of similar type. No better, no worse.
But my MG2 wil more often than not, malfunction more than twice during a match. At the third jam, one is out of the match, as you know.

[Tycho]

For one, I can't believe that there is a MG2 that can't be cured. Every, even the meanest one here got running after enough time and parts. You still haven't told which version of the inner parts you're using, or when, by whom and on which basis those rebuilds were made. It's well known that the V2 update is tricky to install as the cradle axis has to be set differently, and most not-so-savvy people try to get around that. Won't work without it. Last MG2E upgrade I saw changed nearly everything including hammer, sear, hammer spring, cradle, BIL, mag holder and mag holder spring (!) and new mags. That was from a 20xx to 24xx standard. As long as you're not willing to disclose any details, you can't expect anybody to take you serious or to help you, neither here nor in Parma. So, to repeat myself, stop flaming and whining and start analysing.

Secondly, read the rulebook - you're not out after the 3rd malfunction, it's just that you don't get any more malfunctions. If your problem descriptions are as accurate as that, that explains a lot.

[Richard H]

MG2-owner.
Thanks.
it is you NOT the gun.
Julio

I think I hve to clear up the matter a bit:
My MG2 has, during my 4 years of ownership, jammed and malfunctioned steadily, no matter what kind of ammo I use.
Repeded replacement of parts, and rebuild with upgraded aprts, by the importer, have not cured the malfunctioning. It is the gun, not me.
I have owned guns that did not malfunction very often. The MG2 do malfunction very often. Much more often than anyy other gun of its type, that I have owned, or used.
It is the gun that is malfunctioning, not me....

Good results? Whenever the gun shooses to work reliably for half a match or so, the result are comparable to results achieved by use of guns of similar type. No better, no worse.
But my MG2 wil more often than not, malfunction more than twice during a match. At the third jam, one is out of the match, as you know.

Which other "gun of it's type"? I don't know of any other of it's type.

Here's another suggestion all the work seems to have been done by the same "importer" ever think maybe he's the problem? Send it back to the factory, I'm sure it will be fixed.

I think Mark told me that even his pistols that work well, but when he lets one particular person shoot it they have issues, and the only thing that he can figure is that they don't hold it firm enough to let the recoil reset everything (hopefully he'll pop in and confirm this or clarify it), so maybe it is you, maybe you have the hold of a wet noodle ;)

I know if I was as unhappy as you I would have gotten rid of it and moved on, it almost seems like you like the punishment.

[julioalperi]

MG2-owner
My bad english probably.
I thought I had been cautious enough and "just in case" before writting "it is you, not the gun" I wrote: if your MG2 works like mine.......
Mine happens to work very very well indeed.
I myself like Tycho before, do believe that today,Cesare is capable of putting your pistol to work with no flaws.
Julio

[MG2-owner]

The MG2 do malfunction very often. Much more often than anyy other gun of its type, that I have owned, or used.

Which other "gun of it's type"? I don't know of any other of it's type.

You don´t know of any other gun in MG2 category? No?

"Gun of its (MG2) type" translates to "match type .22 auto, well suited for, and probably even designed with the ISSF Standard Pistol Programme" in mind. (Junior/Ladies Sport Pistol Programme" may be included).
(To divide that type of gun from "plinkers".)

And you do not know of any other gun in that category, you said?
Then, I think, neither me, nor any other individual, may be able to help you out. Sorry about that.

Regards,
MG2-owner

[Mark Briggs]

To respond to Richard's comments...

One particular female who competes at national-team level has the capacity to make my MG-2 fail to cycle. She can do this 100% of the time. She has no troubles with her Hammerli. This is the funniest thing to watch. I can hand the MG-2 to anybody else and it will function perfectly. I'll load up a magazine with five rounds, hand the pistol to this lady and poof! it fails to feed on every shot!

What it comes down to is that she shoots with a very limp wrist and a very weak grip. I have no idea how she can possibly shoot any sustained-fire events like standard pistol (or if she even tries those events). But she shoots Sport pistol quite well, so obviously she's figured out how to make things work for her. Although she's told me she likes the feel of the MG-2 I think we've both agreed it's not the right gun for her!

By comparison, my MG-2's have been shot by a very wide range of people, including very experienced "burly-man" male shooters who are able to shoot .45's all day, and young girls who had never shot a .22 before in their lives. I hand them my MG-2 with confidence because I know it will shoot well and that they will have a good experience. The MG-2's perform flawlessly in all instances, except for this one gal who can make it fail every time. Ah, such is life.

As for MG-2-Owner... If you haven't sent the pistol back to the factory for repair then you're nothing short of a darned fool. You spend SO much time here bad-mouthing the pistol when, if you would spend even 10% as much effort in developing a relationship with the factory you would have had the problems resolved a long time ago. But this point has already been made to you many times here, in this thread and in others. What it really comes down to is that you're far more content to bitch about things than to fix them. Thank goodness you're in another country. I feel sorry for your fellow countrymen who have to put up with your incessant whining. There's a little rule we teach our kids on the road to becoming responsible members of society - it's called GROW UP, PUT UP, or SHUT UP. You need to either grow up and take responsibility for getting your gun fixed, put up with the problems, or shut up about them, because the rest of the world is sick of hearing from you.

Now let's move on to more pleasant topics...

[julioalperi]

I liked your post Mark.

[Richard H]

The MG2 do malfunction very often. Much more often than anyy other gun of its type, that I have owned, or used.

Which other "gun of it's type"? I don't know of any other of it's type.

You don´t know of any other gun in MG2 category? No?

"Gun of its (MG2) type" translates to "match type .22 auto, well suited for, and probably even designed with the ISSF Standard Pistol Programme" in mind. (Junior/Ladies Sport Pistol Programme" may be included).
(To divide that type of gun from "plinkers".)

And you do not know of any other gun in that category, you said?
Then, I think, neither me, nor any other individual, may be able to help you out. Sorry about that.

Regards,
MG2-owner

I'm talking of the actual mechanical workings of the pistol of which there IS NO SIMILAR pistol, do you understand that now? Is that simple enough for you to understand.

I guess you couldn't have figured that out on your own.

I see you have nothing bright, ignorant or witty to say about the rest of the points contained in that post.

Help form the likes of you is the last thing I would seek.

Sincerely in contempt,

[MG2-owner]

What it comes down to is that she shoots with a very limp wrist and a very weak grip.

A loose grip may cause some outoloading pistols to not cycle fully. In .22 r.f. and even more powerful calibers. This is a well known fact.
Btw: I have a normal, firm hold on my guns during firing.

A .22 ammo brand with slightly higer Vo often solves the problem.

As for MG-2-Owner... If you haven't sent the pistol back to the factory for repair then you're nothing short of a darned fool. You spend SO much time here bad-mouthing the pistol when, if you would spend even 10% as much effort in developing a relationship with the factory you would have had the problems resolved a long time ago.

As I have written several times, and as have been comfirmed in this forum by my contries agent/importer: two attemts have been made to return the guns (my, and the importers own!) to Italy for repairs.
The guns have on both acations been stopped, - the last time even seized for some time, by the Italian customs. Then the guns were returned from the italian customs to my countries agent without any repair.

The agent has then put quite some effort into solving the problems of my MG2 (and his own MG2) by importing and installing spares and upgraded parts.
To no avail, yet.

Thank a lot, Mark, for nicknaming your apponents "darned idiots".
That brings respect....
I will not subcide to that level of (bad) rhetoricks.

Regards,
MG2-owner

[David Levene]

As I have written several times, and as have been comfirmed in this forum by my contries agent/importer: two attemts have been made to return the guns (my, and the importers own!) to Italy for repairs.
The guns have on both acations been stopped, - the last time even seized for some time, by the Italian customs. Then the guns were returned from the italian customs to my countries agent without any repair.

The agent has then put quite some effort into solving the problems of my MG2 (and his own MG2) by importing and installing spares and upgraded parts.
To no avail, yet.

You cannot blame MG for the failings of Italian customs or the possibility that the agent in your country, although obviously helpful, might not have the same technical abilities as the factory technicians when repairing MG guns.

Just because you live in a country where the circumstances make it difficult to get the gun repaired does not make the MG2 a bad gun. It just indicates that it might not be the best choice for shooters in your country.

[The crowd has spoken]

...
does not make the MG2 a bad gun. It just indicates that it might not be the best choice for shooters in your country.

And in many other countries, as the poll indicates.

I have to remind you about the poll, David. It is not just my gun, there is a lot of nonreliable MG2s out there.
The MG2 will have to struggle hard to overcome the "troublesome gun" label it deservedly has earned.

I think verybody now is aware of the "cover up campaign" for the less successful MG2.
Until, some sunny day in the future, my gun, after its n´th upgrade, eventually may become a functional gun, I feel obliged to inform the public about the miseries the MG2 ownership has brought to me.
As it has brought miseries to many, many owners of MG2s.

[David Levene]

I think verybody now is aware of the "cover up campaign" for the less successful MG2.

On the contrary. As an "outsider" to this discussion who would love the opportunity to again buy a Standard Pistol in my own country, I am more aware of what seems to be a smear campaign by a very few people, most of whom always stay anonymous.

[Richard H]

...
does not make the MG2 a bad gun. It just indicates that it might not be the best choice for shooters in your country.

And in many other countries, as the poll indicates.

I have to remind you about the poll, David. It is not just my gun, there is a lot of nonreliable MG2s out there.
The MG2 will have to struggle hard to overcome the "troublesome gun" label it deservedly has earned.

I think verybody now is aware of the "cover up campaign" for the less successful MG2.
Until, some sunny day in the future, my gun, after its n´th upgrade, eventually may become a functional gun, I feel obliged to inform the public about the miseries the MG2 ownership has brought to me.
As it has brought miseries to many, many owners of MG2s.

I don't know too many people that would term 8 as a lot. I don't see anything in that poll about what countries these pistols are in so you seem to assume a lot in a poorly worded poll.

Why do you keep changing your name when you post, MG2 owner or the crowd or what ever you like to call yourself?

You have done a great service in demonstrating to the public on how not to go about getting assistance for that the public should be greatly thankful.

[MG2-owner]

(...)
Let's be honest:

Yes, Matchguns supported the many customers who experienced problems with their newly bought MG2. Matchguns seems indeed very supportive.

But is it normal that so many customers having bought a new MG2 needed to be supported. Here the answer is clearly negative. This should not happen (...).
.

Thank you for pinpointing the problem, "Jipe".
This is the MG2-"affair" in a nutshell.

[David Levene]

I have to remind you about the poll, David. It is not just my gun, there is a lot of nonreliable MG2s out there.
The MG2 will have to struggle hard to overcome the "troublesome gun" label it deservedly has earned.

No, I have to remind you about the poll, whatever your name is.

The poll is not about the most unreliable or troublesome gun, it is about the "worst" gun.

I don't know how you define "worst" but I would treat it as being the gun I would be least likely to buy, or buy again if I had already owned one. That decision could be based on either my shooting experience with the gun, however brief, or reports from others which I believed. In my case it would be the Morini 102E very closely followed by the Hammerli 208. Neither gun suited me and I would have no desire to ever own either. I considered them to be the worst guns I have ever shot, but to call the 208 a bad gun would be ridiculous.

If the poll had been about unreliability then I could only consider the guns I had shot for an extended period. In my case it would have to be a Walther GSP as it was the only gun that ever caused me to "malfunction out" of a match. It let me down once in 4 years. Would I call the GSP an unreliable gun based on that, no.

If the poll had been about the most troublesome gun then again I could only consider the guns I had shot for an extended period. I would have to choose either the FAS 602 or 603 as both guns needed a lot of care and attention. They would however be the first guns I would buy again if our laws allowed; they were worth every bit of the effort.

I have strayed a bit but hope I have demonstrated that this poll can mean different things to different people. The results, even if they had been from a reasonably sized sample (which they most definitely are not), could not therefore be taken as proof of anything. Even taking them as an indication of anything meaningful is highly questionable.

[556]

Ask Mr M.Andersson of Njurunda, Sweden, what he thinks of the MG2. He came in third in the Swedish Championship of 2007 with an AW93. He started with a MG2 that broke, was supplied with another MG2 from the Swedish agent (who was on site) that also broke, and then borrowed an AW93 to finish the competition with.

This post reveals the true sould of the MG2.
It is not unusual to bring one backup gun to a major shooting.
If you own a MG2 you have better bring more than one.

[Richard H]

It was also in 2007, much has transpired since then it is now 2009. How long will we hold this as an example of all MG2's?

[deadeyedick]

It was also in 2007, much has transpired since then it is now 2009. How long will we hold this as an example of all MG2's?

This is what some can't seem to move forward with Richard......guns , as well as life, is evolutionary and in a constant state of change.