Choosing a Free Pistol: Used Hämmerli 150 or a new one??

[Markus]

Dear All,

a local gun shop currently offers used Hämmerli 150 Free Pistols, which I am very interested in to buy.

I am not very experienced in buying used guns, so I do not know, if this is a good deal for me or not. Searching for that model, I found these two references with some technical information:

http://www.pilkguns.com/tenp/spham150.htm
http://www.potfire.com.au/compend/spham150.htm (nearly identical to pilkguns, intended?)

Alternatively, I would buy another used or new like Toz, Morini or Hämmerli, without any time-related 'pressure'. Does anyone has some tips, how I should procede? How would you rate the 150? Comparable to models from 'today'?

Thanks in advance and best regards, markus

[GOVTMODEL]

Though I no longer shot Free Pistol. I'l note that Hammerli 150 parts were scarce BEFORE Hammerli closed its doors.

I can't imagine they are better supported now.

Richard Ashmore

[Markus]

Hi Richard,

Though I no longer shot Free Pistol. I'l note that Hammerli 150 parts were scarce BEFORE Hammerli closed its doors.

I can't imagine they are better supported now.

Richard Ashmore

This is one of the disadvantages of discontinued guns. If buying, I just hope, that Hämmerli quality stuff might last for another few years. Anyone else having good or bad experiences with Hämmerli 15x/16x/fp10/fp60 free pistols?

I have not found an easy way to search for threads covering free pistols, as they are sometimes abbreviated just 'fp'..

I will try to ask Larry and pilkguns for their opinions as well.

Thanks, markus

[Neil Foster]

GOVTMODEL

Hammerli did not close its doors. They are now owned by the UMAREX Group, the same folks who own Walther. Parts and service in the USA are by Larry Carter. Hammerli is very much in business, just located in Ulm Germany and not in Switzerland. In fact they have a new free pistol out, it is the FP-60. A very fine gun, with the quality expected from Hammerli.
Neil

[Fred.Mannis]

GOVTMODEL

Hammerli did not close its doors. They are now owned by the UMAREX Group, the same folks who own Walther. Parts and service in the USA are by Larry Carter. Hammerli is very much in business, just located in Ulm Germany and not in Switzerland. In fact they have a new free pistol out, it is the FP-60. A very fine gun, with the quality expected from Hammerli.
Neil

Neil,
It's always good to think positively. I just hope that the facts support your argument when the time comes that you need a part for your new FP-60. As for me, after listening to some of the Walther/Hammerli/Umarex issues here on TT. I would be wary of buying one of their older models.

YMMV
Fred

[GOVTMODEL]

GOVTMODEL

Hammerli did not close its doors. They are now owned by the UMAREX Group, the same folks who own Walther. Parts and service in the USA are by Larry Carter. Hammerli is very much in business, just located in Ulm Germany and not in Switzerland. In fact they have a new free pistol out, it is the FP-60. A very fine gun, with the quality expected from Hammerli.
Neil

A poor word choice on my part. More accurate to say there was a sale of Hammerli assets to UMAREX. Larry Carter is remains the US agent for Hammerli.

That said, the only new Hammerli pistol shown on his web site is the FP-60. The SP-20 is shown on the Hammerli site, but appears to be unavailable from Larry.

Friends with older Hammerli Free Pistols had parts problems before the asset sale, so I still lack confidence that UMAREX is going to provide better support for discontinued models than Hammerli did before the sale.

Richard

[Markus]

Hi Neil,

GOVTMODEL

[...] In fact they have a new free pistol out, it is the FP-60. A very fine gun, with the quality expected from Hammerli.
Neil

Any more infos on the quality? I guess, the previous one FP10 had not really a very good reputation for quality (but just knowing from hearsay).

Thanks, markus

[Markus]

Hi Fred,

[...]

Neil,
It's always good to think positively. I just hope that the facts support your argument when the time comes that you need a part for your new FP-60. As for me, after listening to some of the Walther/Hammerli/Umarex issues here on TT. I would be wary of buying one of their older models.

YMMV
Fred

Fred, how to search efficiently for these issues? Do you know some 'good' search terms/keywords?

Thanks, markus

[Freepistol]

GOVTMODEL

Hammerli did not close its doors. They are now owned by the UMAREX Group, the same folks who own Walther. Parts and service in the USA are by Larry Carter. Hammerli is very much in business, just located in Ulm Germany and not in Switzerland. In fact they have a new free pistol out, it is the FP-60. A very fine gun, with the quality expected from Hammerli.
Neil

Neil,
It's always good to think positively. I just hope that the facts support your argument when the time comes that you need a part for your new FP-60. As for me, after listening to some of the Walther/Hammerli/Umarex issues here on TT. I would be wary of buying one of their older models.

YMMV
Fred

I have been away from International shooting since 1995 and am truly disappointed to hear all the bad news about Hammerli, especially since I bought a 162 in 1993. I feel like an orphan!
Ben

[Fred.Mannis]

Fred, how to search efficiently for these issues? Do you know some 'good' search terms/keywords?

A search using Umarex turned up 14 entries. I tried using AND logic to search for Hammerli AND repairs, but this turned up a very large number. Made for interesting reading tho :-)

Fred

[6string]

Hi Markus,
The 150 is an excellent gun, as are the 152, 160, 162. Since you have the ability to actually see and handle the Hammerli, you are at an advantage to determine if it feels good. Rest assured that as long as the gun has been well cared for, it will shoot! Parts aren't a big deal. Larry Carter has them and my experience is that they are still pretty reasonably priced. Having said that, there is not much on most free pistols which can't be fabricated by a good gunsmith or even a machinist. Firing pins are easy. Springs are easy to substitute. The firing pin spring will wear out if stored cocked. No problem, as it is easy and cheap to replace. Better yet, don't store it cocked! Read the owners manual about taking care of the set trigger. That is the one biggie of all free pistols. In fact, you may want to check the serial # and compare to those on the 10p site. Some set triggers are more desirable and can be confirmed by serial #. The quality of workmanship inside and out is astounding, as is the excellent material. The trend in competitive pistols is more and more towards cheaper materials (molded parts, alloys, plastic, etc.) and certainly away from skillful hand assembly. The 150 was built to last.
If you like it, and the price is right, you'll probably be very happy.
PS: use the search tool to see a recent post in which I compared the 150 and 160. Might be useful to you.
Best Wishes!

[Mark Briggs]

I'll chime in here and echo many of the thoughts posted by 6String above. I previously owned an early serial number 150, with the "type 1" set trigger. It worked well for me, but I got bitten by the Morini bug and sold the Hammerli to finance the Morini. Luckily I sold it to a friend, who sold it to another friend. Just recently I re-purchased this pistol because, frankly, it feels like a real piece of gunsmithing art. And it shoots like that too.

While there have been criticisms of the earlier trigger modules (especially the Type 1) I can't say as I've found anything about it that I don't like. It goes "bang" every time I want it to, and the rest of the time it doesn't go "bang" unless I do something severely stupid.

I have only 2 complaints with the 150. Firstly, the rear sight notch width is not adjustable, except by changing the rear sight blade itself. That's no biggy, unless you don't happen to have a rear sight blade with the right sized notch in it!

My second complaint is the biggy. The factory grip on the 150 is useful only as firewood. A Morini, or better yet, a Rink grip is the way to go. The fellow from whom I've re-purchased my 150 put a Rink grip on it and even though it's not been carved to fit my hand it's a huge improvement over the factory grip.

One last point - the factory beavertail forearm on the 150 has a hole in it with a threaded cap. If you don't like the balance of the pistol this hole is just the right size to insert 50cal muzzleloader bullets as counterweights. Very handy!

Hope this info helps...

[6string]

Yes, those factory grips are pretty lame. When I had one, it came with a Morini grip which was very nice. Regarding the forend, it can also be removed, making it handle more like the 160 special. Actually, one could probably use the clamp-on weight rail as used on the 160 special. Neal Johnson used to have them for about $120.