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[Russ]

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[Thomas Monto]

I do most of my shooting on a commercial range. Over the years, I have made an observation regarding a lot of shooters who use the range. Most of the shooters are recreational shooters. They shoot large caliber handguns that make a lot of noise. A recent incident come to mind.

When I was getting the range ready for junior shooters an gentleman can in picked up a couple of man sized targets, stapled them to the holder , loaded his automatic (I think it was a .45), ran the target down to 25' and shot a clip slow fire. I think he hit the man sized target a couple of times, certainly no group was shot. He then preceeded to fill up the clip, then shoot it at the target as fast as he could pull the trigger. He continued to do this until he either ran out of ammo or got tired, I don't know which.

Olympic style shooting takes time, practice, skill, patience and all the other attributes needed to become a champion. I find that most shooters do not want to spend the time or resources necessary to become proficient in the sport. There are a lot of "Trigger Pullers" as Scott puts it.

Look at cowboy action shooting, lots of noise, targets are rather big and they go "clink" when you hit them. Compare that with air pistol that goes "puff" when fired and splat when hitting the target. I am not putting down cowboy action, just look at the difference in the number of shooters involved with the sport. Why the gap?

I have seen "Russ" shoot AP. He is an accomplished AP shooter. I think what he is trying to do is help the sport move to more participants and better shooters. His efforts are to be lauded.

Scott pointed out that maybe rather than advertise his willingness to help shooters, he could provide topics for discussion on technique, mental prepareness, etc. to help us all.

We recently ran a rifle clinic with Bob Foth. Interesting, while it was open to all, only junior shooters and their coaches attended. Adult shooters have asked for coaching help, but when provided by a professional, they were nowhere in sight.

The shooting sports is one of the greatest sports around. It teaches many skills that make for a well rounded person.

We are fortunate to have the resources in this country to participate in the shooting sports. Lets take advantage of the knowledge people can provide.

[Mike McDaniel]

Unfortunately, what you're seeing is very, very common. The United States is a nation of gun collectors, not shooters. There are an awful lot of duffers who have no real desire to improve - I suspect because if they did, they would have to face how truly bad they are now.

The formal discipline required to really excel on the target range is pretty scarce.

[Russ]

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[TWP]

I think we have to start young.

You'll never get many adults to change their mind about how they shoot.

But kids can be molded from the begining.

But it takes grass roots efforts of parents and coaches. The kids need a place to shoot. They need to see their friends shooting. We also need to reach out to those places that do shooting but don't concentrate on olympic style. Places like the Scouts and other summer camps. We had one girl in our club who was an excellent shooter, she started shooting at summer camp, her parents were not gun owners or shooters, but when told how well their daughter did at camp they sought out our club and brought her in. If the camp counselor hadn't told her mother how good she was she never would have come to us.

We also need to start more air gun clubs/teams at the high school level.

[Russ]

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[Matt]

Russ,

I'm digressing.......

Decades ago there used to be a smallbore rifle league amongst the local high schools in our area, Bay City, Saginaw and Flint. However, they have all gone by the way side. As one would say, the seed has blown away.

You do bring up an interested point to ponder - is there interest at the high school level to introduce air pistol shooting? After all, that's where the population of kids are. Then the next (big) hurdle is logistics.

Just my thoughts and wonderings............

Matt

[Don90250]

I can see a similarity in the U.S. between air pistol/rifle and ham radio, my other hobby. Both require an investment of time (and lesser so, money). Neither has instant gratification. Neither one can compete with extreme sports and computer games for instant gratification. It seems as though the youth of today have become desensitized. They need more sensory input to capture and keep their interest.

I fear unless we can make air pistol/rifle more exciting, we shouldn't expect a large influx into the sport. We have family friends who are teaching their daughters to shoot. They are familiar with all sorts of firearms and air rifle/pistol. Given the choice between air rifle and trap/skeet, guess which one they prefer.

[Russ]

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[Russ]

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[Spencer C]

Any practical recomendations how to reach high school level?
Any ideas? Any positive experience?
Russ

Posted here and the ISSF site was a request for info from anybody with experience in setting up / introducing / promoting pistol sport in high schools. Responses, zilch...

With our 'difficult' firearms legislation, a few of us are investigating using a non-firearm (a timber mock up of an air pistol) with a walther 5-shot practice trigger hooked to a Scatt as a PC acceptable tool to demonstrate / screen kids in high schools.

I will post more as the project develops.

Spencer C

[Five-seveN]

How to get High school age kids into it? Well, here In Louisiana, most of the High Schools have a JROTC and, subsequently a rifle team. We mainly use the 853 and 888's, as that is what the Gov't will buy. Our team is going to The MBA classic in Nashville in October.

[Jose Rossy]

Unfortunately, what you're seeing is very, very common. The United States is a nation of gun collectors, not shooters. There are an awful lot of duffers who have no real desire to improve - I suspect because if they did, they would have to face how truly bad they are now.

The formal discipline required to really excel on the target range is pretty scarce.

I have found the same to be true. I have tried to promote the shooting sports in the shooting-related forums I frequent and to people I know who have guns.

I used to be very enthusiastic about it until I realized that almost none have the desire to put in the effort needed to become even moderately good. I have heard every concievable excuse, and hardly any of them merit anything but ridicule because they are so lame.

Now all I do is merely state something brief about the sport and ask that those really interested me contact me privately to learn more.

For the most part, American shooters enjoy wallowing in mediocrity.

[3sevice]

I agree with Russ about adults having great potential. No way I would have had the discipline or motivation as a kid. I'm 35 and picked up the air pistol and rifle as a sideline and have since become interested in them in their own right. Normally a highpower and smallbore shooter, I find myself becoming more interested in the international styles.

I spent most of my early adulthood in the service, no time or resources to shoot air pistol. During college I started shooting smallbore, after college highpower. Once my daughter was born, I started looking at airguns as a way to shoot at home. I love the airguns. I bought a couple of used Walthers and I like them as much as my 40-x. But as a teenager I never would have taken the time to dry fire. As an old man now, I look forward to it in the evening.

I'm afraid that olympic style shooting in America will always have a limited group to draw from. There are so many types of shooting competition that olympic style will only interest a small segment. In most of Europe I think that olympic shooting is the only game in town.

Mike is right in saying that most people don't have the guts to get up on the line for serious competition. We've all seen the guys at the range blamming away with an AR-15, hitting nothing.

Anyway, my two cents. I hope that other adults take it up. Maybe then we won't all have to drive 4 hours (or more) to actually attend a monthly match.

keep your powder dry,

John

[Jose Rossy]

I agree with Russ about adults having great potential. No way I would have had the discipline or motivation as a kid. I'm 35 and picked up the air pistol and rifle as a sideline and have since become interested in them in their own right. Normally a highpower and smallbore shooter, I find myself becoming more interested in the international styles.

I spent most of my early adulthood in the service, no time or resources to shoot air pistol. During college I started shooting smallbore, after college highpower. Once my daughter was born, I started looking at airguns as a way to shoot at home. I love the airguns. I bought a couple of used Walthers and I like them as much as my 40-x. But as a teenager I never would have taken the time to dry fire. As an old man now, I look forward to it in the evening.

I'm afraid that olympic style shooting in America will always have a limited group to draw from. There are so many types of shooting competition that olympic style will only interest a small segment. In most of Europe I think that olympic shooting is the only game in town.

Mike is right in saying that most people don't have the guts to get up on the line for serious competition. We've all seen the guys at the range blamming away with an AR-15, hitting nothing.

Anyway, my two cents. I hope that other adults take it up. Maybe then we won't all have to drive 4 hours (or more) to actually attend a monthly match.

keep your powder dry,

John

John, my story follows pretty much like yours except I haven't picked up the air rifle habit yet.

Let's see, already have the AR15 for service rifle, the Model 70 for match rifle, the 1411 for smallbore prone (and the odd 3P match). Looks like the only hole left to fill is an air rifle......

[M M]

It is not what else or more we need.
I would ask what a world-level top shooter can expect in this country.
How about a 4-year/$10,000,000 contract, renewable after each Olympics, from the industry?
Dream on.

[Russ]

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[Jose Rossy]

I think M. Emmons can't be less valuable athlete than T. Woods for the Nation....
Russ

Matt Emmons will never be as valuable an athlete as Tiger Woods because shooting is no longer a socially acceptable sport to most people in the US. There's been a fundamental change in American society, and I am afraid it is irreversible. Holding ground is the best we can do, in my opinion.

[TWP]

Any practical recomendations how to reach High School level?
Any ideas? Any positive experience?
Russ

Start talking with your school districts Athletic Director. Start talking with your local high schools athletic director. See what they require to start a team.

We're pretty blessed here with County and local's AD's that are fairly receptive to Air Rifle teams. Our area already has a High School Smallbore league, but it is down to only 4 or 5 teams.

[Mike McDaniel]

It's not the money. The simple fact of life is that this is a hobby. We MIGHT cough up some bucks for training of the top-flight competitors, but I would oppose trying to make this a semi-pro sport.

Russ brings up a good point, though. USAS spends a lot of effort on the junior level - but shooters have much longer competitive lifetimes than competitors in any other sport. Decades instead of years. There is nothing to stop us from pursuing the 20-something competitors - who will eventually drag THEIR kids into it.

I will mention that one way to recruit the younger shooters might be falling-plate targets. Think rapid-fire air pistol. Let the kids try it, set the hook - then work with the ones who really want to excel on the basics. Little things like hitting the target.

Another potential to ponder is historical tie-ins. We've got the 150th anniversiary of the Civil War coming up in six years. This is going to produce a tidal wave of interest in Civil War-era arms. Which those of us in the North-South Skirmish Association and the U.S. International Muzzle-Loading Team are preparing to exploit. But the opportunities are there for other shooting disciplines to exploit as well. After all, you don't have to scrub out an air pistol.

The big problem is that a terribly high proportion of shooters in this country don't like to face just how bad they really are. I've hung out on some of the same groups that Jose has, and he is understating the lameness of some of the excuses. I'm not sure how to cure this. We've tried being nice - perhaps it's time to be sarcastic? That you Aren't A Man If You Don't Compete?