Hi everyone,
I bught a 1912 a month or so ago, and I've been trying to get my positions all set up (I shoot 3P). the reason I bought a 1912 was because the walther I had before was too long in the stock for me and my sling was always touching the triigger gruard in prone and kneeling unless I acutally held it away.
So the problem is kind of still there. It's because I am so short and I have r eally short arms. Is there a way I can shorten the butt? I'm not very confident with taking thigns apart.
I wondered if it coul d be shortened by shortening the legs of the buttplate and sawing a chunk off the back of the butt? Or would that damage the mecanism? Could the mecanism be moved further into the butt? or would that interfere with the cheekpiece mecanism?
Janie.
shortening a 1912 stock
Moderators: pilkguns, Marcus, m1963, David Levene, Spencer
Janie: i just went down that road myself. I shortened one for my daughter. I did it myself but it is quite an involved project. I would recommend sending it to a gunsmith to have it done. Between the cheekpiece hardware and the butt plate hardware there is a lot going on in the butts of those stocks so it is tricky to get get it as short as possible without messing something up. Specifically I would send it to someone who is very savy with stock work to make sure you don't wind up with a hack job. Call Alex Sittman at Masterclass stocks and see if he will do it. He has a tremendous reputation with target stocks. His web site is www.masterclassstocks.com.
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Janie
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Janie
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Guest
How old is the 1912 in question? Is the butt carrier mechanism the old style alloy lump ('scuse terminology) that bolts to the wood. Or is it the newer one also used on Anschutz's alu stocks, that sits inside the wood?
If it's the old style it may not be that hard a job. As long as you don't saw into the cheekpiece adjustment, you should be able to remove the wood and then bolt the carrier lump (apologies again!) back on.
If it's the new you would need a good gunsmith. HPS (the Gemini stock people) based in Gloucester might be able to do it; or Fultons at Bisley. Norman Clark in Rugby too. Have you tried your local gunsmith?
Good luck anyway.
Tim S
Exeter UK
If it's the old style it may not be that hard a job. As long as you don't saw into the cheekpiece adjustment, you should be able to remove the wood and then bolt the carrier lump (apologies again!) back on.
If it's the new you would need a good gunsmith. HPS (the Gemini stock people) based in Gloucester might be able to do it; or Fultons at Bisley. Norman Clark in Rugby too. Have you tried your local gunsmith?
Good luck anyway.
Tim S
Exeter UK
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JAnie
If your only reason for adjusting the stock is that your sling is fouling the trigger guard why not just replace the sling?
The new HPS sling is designed to deal with this
http://www.hps-tr.com/otherAccess.htm#flexSling[/url]
The new HPS sling is designed to deal with this
http://www.hps-tr.com/otherAccess.htm#flexSling[/url]
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Guest
If it was bought new then it probably is a new one. The old ones had a 1" (or so) alloy block that the carrier mechanism (the little rods that make it go in and out) fitted into.
If you are petite (i.e. 5' 4" or under) a shorter than normal butt will allow you to lie behind the rifle, rather than alongside it. However if you are of a more average height, and it's just a case of the sling catching on the trigger guard K Silver's suggestion of the HPS sling (where the middle length is replaced by a length of plastic coated wire) is a possibility.
If you are based near Gloucester (i.e HPS) speak to them, Robert Knibbs may well be able to help.
cheers
Tim S
Exeter UK
If you are petite (i.e. 5' 4" or under) a shorter than normal butt will allow you to lie behind the rifle, rather than alongside it. However if you are of a more average height, and it's just a case of the sling catching on the trigger guard K Silver's suggestion of the HPS sling (where the middle length is replaced by a length of plastic coated wire) is a possibility.
If you are based near Gloucester (i.e HPS) speak to them, Robert Knibbs may well be able to help.
cheers
Tim S
Exeter UK
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Janie
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Guest
Um 5' yeah that's petite. I wasn't saying that you should ignore the sling; but that if you were taller the sling alone might cure things.
Smaller shooters often find that rifles are a bit too long.
As an example, I use an 1813 stock and only have the butt extended by 2cm, for a total butt length (to the trigger) of 33cm; I'm 6'1-2" and with fairly long arms. So a 5' shooter might want a butt that is appreciably shorter.
Too long a butt requires you to lie at quite an angle to the rifle, so that your left hand (presuming you are right handed) is far enough along the fore-end so that the rifle balances.
With a shorter butt, you can keep your left hand in the same sort of place at the front; but your body can come round behind the rifle. This should also reduce any potential movement of the butt during reloading.
The sling is useful as shorter shooters usually have shorter arms; even with the left arm above the 30 degree minimum, the length of arm means a low position. This low position can bring the sling into contact with the triggerguard, illegal and bad for accuracy. (this isn't unique to small people, until I recently moved my handstop in 1" my sling tended to do this.)
One further matter, and I do apologise for bringing up further confusion; your handstop. At 5' I'm guessing you have small hands. What handstop do you use?
Remember that with a wider stock (like on your 1912) you may need to offset the handstop a little to the left (if you are right handed). This will let you place the handstop firmly against the web of your thumb (so it won't move) and allow the stock to sit over the palm. With a wide stock and a handstop in line with the barrel, you may find that you can't get the handstop properly in place without having the stock lying on your thumb (which usually hurts).
Hope this helps, and wasn't too long winded.
Tim S
Exeter UK
Smaller shooters often find that rifles are a bit too long.
As an example, I use an 1813 stock and only have the butt extended by 2cm, for a total butt length (to the trigger) of 33cm; I'm 6'1-2" and with fairly long arms. So a 5' shooter might want a butt that is appreciably shorter.
Too long a butt requires you to lie at quite an angle to the rifle, so that your left hand (presuming you are right handed) is far enough along the fore-end so that the rifle balances.
With a shorter butt, you can keep your left hand in the same sort of place at the front; but your body can come round behind the rifle. This should also reduce any potential movement of the butt during reloading.
The sling is useful as shorter shooters usually have shorter arms; even with the left arm above the 30 degree minimum, the length of arm means a low position. This low position can bring the sling into contact with the triggerguard, illegal and bad for accuracy. (this isn't unique to small people, until I recently moved my handstop in 1" my sling tended to do this.)
One further matter, and I do apologise for bringing up further confusion; your handstop. At 5' I'm guessing you have small hands. What handstop do you use?
Remember that with a wider stock (like on your 1912) you may need to offset the handstop a little to the left (if you are right handed). This will let you place the handstop firmly against the web of your thumb (so it won't move) and allow the stock to sit over the palm. With a wide stock and a handstop in line with the barrel, you may find that you can't get the handstop properly in place without having the stock lying on your thumb (which usually hurts).
Hope this helps, and wasn't too long winded.
Tim S
Exeter UK
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Janie
So perhaps shortening my sotck and buying ksilver's sling would be the best thing to do. I do have to lie at a big angle, you're right, and I am right-handed yes.
My handstop is that circulra silver Anschutz one. It doesn't hurt so it should fine?
Not long winded at all Tim! I probably need all the help I can get ;).
Thanks
Janie.
My handstop is that circulra silver Anschutz one. It doesn't hurt so it should fine?
Not long winded at all Tim! I probably need all the help I can get ;).
Thanks
Janie.
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Guest
Shortening the butt and the HPS sling should really help. Try the sling first, as this will (probably) be cheaper!
If the handstop doesn't hurt, it's fine.
As/when you have the butt shortened do be prepared to adjust the rifle. You will probably have to move the buttplate and cheekpiece around as your shoulder will have moved a bit. There may be subtler adjustments such as the rearsight (for eye-relief) and even the trigger blade for perfection.
An experienced shooter looking over you when setting up will be a great advantage.
cheers
Tim S
Exeter UK
If the handstop doesn't hurt, it's fine.
As/when you have the butt shortened do be prepared to adjust the rifle. You will probably have to move the buttplate and cheekpiece around as your shoulder will have moved a bit. There may be subtler adjustments such as the rearsight (for eye-relief) and even the trigger blade for perfection.
An experienced shooter looking over you when setting up will be a great advantage.
cheers
Tim S
Exeter UK