MatchGun MG2 Carrier Maintenance

[Gwhite]

I've been promising this one for a while. I originally created it as a 3 video playlist, only I wanted to park it under my overall MG2 playlist. Apparently you can't nest playlists in YouTube without 3rd party software (at least I couldn't find a way to do it).

As result, the 3 videos on maintaining the carrier hardware are lumped in with my other two videos. They are all clearly labeled, but it's not as tidy as I would have liked. In any event, here's the link to the complete MG2 playlist:

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=P ... 1BwdNMPPeU

[ghostrip]

Lovely videos. i hope you do an upper frame maintenance video

[Gwhite]

Working on the slide cover is a challenge. I've had to do it three times on my first MG2, which now has over 20,000 rounds through it. My second MG2 has only about 8,000 rounds through it. So far I haven't had to replace anything up top.

I do have a 3D printed bench block design for working on the slide cover. I should try to get that up on Thingiverse...

[deadeyedick]

Great video tutorial Doug. These videos would have made my life much easier back in 2006 when I purchased my first MG2

[Gwhite]

I have my 3D printed MG2 slide cover bench block up on Thingiverse now: https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:6662216

The Summary includes notes on how to use it. It's labeled so you drive the pins in the right direction, and it will accommodate pistols that have one of Jon Eulette's optics rails installed.

Slide Cover Pin Removal.jpg (53.41 KiB) Viewed 5086 times

[PaulE84]

Your videos are great, thank you so much. I'm waiting for my permit to pick up my brand new EVO Rapid Fire model - I live in Melbourne Australia. I haven't had much success finding information regarding the hammer spring. One of my older MG2's from a few years ago had one break and a gunsmith put a replacement in for me. I can't for the life of me remember how he did it but I'm sure it's straight forward.

I have 2 questions.

1 - How likely (if you know) are the new EVO hammer springs going to break?

2 - Do you have any videos or instructions you could share on hammer spring replacement including any other parts on the upper?

Thank you in advance - Paul

[Gwhite]

The springs can break. I've had to replace one once (with 3 pistols in service). There is a weak point introduced when the form the hooks, and I sent that info to the factory to see if they could get their spring maker to fix that, but I have no idea if they did that, or how many older springs are still out there in pistols.

Replacing it (or the "bullet insert lever" BIL) is a pain in the neck. I can dig up my notes, but won't be making a video until I have to go through the process again.

There are a couple things that make the process easier. The 3D printed bench block is essential. I also like these punches: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0085V67VW.

The trick that really helps if the hammer spring is intact (like when replacing the BIL) or when you need to install a new one is to stretch the spring by inserting a bunch of small washers between the coils.

The washers I use are General Purpose Brass Washer for M2.5 Screw Size, 2.700 mm ID, 5 mm OD, 0.40 to 0.60 mm thick
https://www.mcmaster.com/98691A112

[PaulE84]

I really appreciate the info, thank you. I have a friend that will 3D print the block for me, and I’ll also look at getting those tools. The washers idea is great, thank you.

Cheers

[Shiloh]

This what I used to relace the hammer spring (twice) on my MG2. Anchor the upper frame (I use an old Craftsman woodworking bench vice with wood inserts), partially remove the pin holding the spring in front, stretch the spring with the tool, push the pin back in to secure the front of the spring.

Designed for and works great on S&W revolver rebound springs.

https://gunsmithertools.com/shop/ols/pr ... -s8b70415b

[PaulE84]

This what I used to relace the hammer spring (twice) on my MG2. Anchor the upper frame (I use an old Craftsman woodworking bench vice with wood inserts), partially remove the pin holding the spring in front, stretch the spring with the tool, push the pin back in to secure the front of the spring.

Designed for and works great on S&W revolver rebound springs.

https://gunsmithertools.com/shop/ols/pr ... -s8b70415b

That's a great little tool, I never thought of that. Thank you.

[PaulE84]

Hi Doug,

I noticed in your videos that your parts (carrier, ejector, extractor, slide) are polished. Is that how they came, or did you polish them yourself? I picked up my EVO Rapid Fire model just over a week ago and noticed my parts were a little dull in comparison with some dark markings on them. Is it advisable to polish the parts or to just leave them?

My MG2 prefers faster velocity rounds which makes sense given all the moving parts and the lighter slide needing to manipulate them all. Apart from some initial malfunctions in the early stages whilst testing a variety of ammunition, I can say it's been very reliable. We're not spoiled with an abundance of SK in Australia, but I can get my hands on Eley which suits me great. I have fired 500 rounds so far.

MALFUNCTIONS:
- As mentioned above, slower velocity does not work in my pistol, so I steer clear of it. Eley has been a perfect choice form me.

- 1x Eley Standard round with noticeably less powder charge caused an issue. The projectile was partly inside the breach and was stripped from the case which dropped unburned powder inside the gun. This prompted me to give the MG2 a full clean (so I could ensure the unburned powder was all gone) with the removal of the carrier as per your instructional videos, which was easy enough. Thank you for that.

- I installed an O-Ring to the barrel to hopefully prolong/avoid cracking the slide. The gun functioned flawlessly, but I found on a couple of instances the hammer followed the slide, so I wonder if the O-Ring was the cause of this as the issue went away after I removed it. I did notice the O-Ring was somewhat out of its position when these two malfunctions occurred, so perhaps it got in the way of the slide coming back which may have affected the slide properly locking the hammer back in those instances. I might try a thinner and tighter O-Ring and see if that will be okay. It's strange to me that they removed the buffer in the new pistols. I do recall slides cracked with buffers in place with previous models, so I don't know if it actually makes a difference or not. A buffer does make sense, though.

I also had issues with the slide lock engaging mid-way through a series (no matter which side it is on), so I added Loctite 243 (others have reported 222 not working) to the screw two days ago to see if that resolves the issue. If it doesn't, I will just remove it and keep it off. The left rear sight plate screw was also coming loose, so I added 243 to that as well. I will test it today to see if there is improvement.

All in all I'm very happy with my MG2 RF, it's an excellent pistol. Thank you for your videos, they have been very helpful. I would love it if someone created a Facebook Group (there used to be one) for all MG2 owners to mingle and share experiences, help and knowledge.

[Gwhite]

I haven't polished any of my MG2 parts. Some arrived a bit shinier than others...

The US importer has reported that some people have had issues using the O-ring buffer, but I'm not sure what the failure mechanism is. All three of the MG2s I have don't seem to be affected. Eventually, the slide in my wife's MG2 cracked, even with the O-ring. The replacement slide is much thicker over the barrel, but I've still got the O-ring installed.

I've run into the slide lock problem as well. Some slides seem to sit lower than others, and can catch the edge of the lock. I put a slight bevel on the corner of the lock. That prevents it from snagging during cycling, but it still has plenty of engagement for manual operation.

I've also had to apply LocTite to the side plate screws.

[PaulE84]

Thanks Doug, I appreciate your feedback. May I ask what you used to bevel the slide lock and is it possible for you to add a photo of it so I can look at replicating it? Only if it isn't too much hassle of course.

In your video, you mentioned you take the carrier out every 2.5k rounds or so for a more thorough clean. Alessandro at Matchguns and the Australian importer advised against this with no explanation. Just wondering what your thoughts might be regarding this? Obviously, I can see that you remove it, and you think it's fine, I just wonder why they would advise against it.

[Gwhite]

Here's a picture:

I don't know why they would recommend against removing the carrier. If you do it a lot and don't take care to examine the set screw & replace it if it gets chewed up, you could eventually wreck the threads in the frame, which would be very bad. It's not a job for a lot of hamfisted gun owners, but if you are careful, I don't see the harm. The MG2 collects fouling faster than any pistol I've ever shot. Eventually, the fouling will build up to the point where it will cause malfunctions. You can flush it out with an aerosol gun cleaner, but then you have the problem of relubricating everything without getting oil everywhere.

I don't do it unless I have to, but I have had to quite a lot for a variety of reasons. I've probably had the carrier out of my main pistol at least a dozen times, and it has less than 10K rounds through it. All three of our pistols show no sign of any undo damage from the process. Total round count is probably close to 40K by now.

[PaulE84]

Thanks for the info and photo, Doug.

Does the set screw get damaged/chewed up from normal use of the firearm or is it purely due to removing and reinstalling the set screw to hold the pin in place that causes the damage?

[Gwhite]

The problem with the set screw is that the pivot pin for the carrier is free to rotate a bit. The groove that is ground into the left end is not a tight fit, so as the carrier operates, the pin rotates back & forth. The pin is hardened, and the factory makes no attempt to break the sharp edges on the pin. As a result, those edges dig into the screw threads and damage them.

Here's a photo of the screw that came out of my first MG2 when I removed the carrier for the first time:

What I have done since then is to stone down the sharp edges on the notch in the pin to reduce the damage. Here are before & after pictures of the pin:

12-6-21 Carrier Pivot Groove (Before).jpg (47.42 KiB) Viewed 2005 times

When I've removed the carrier since then, the damage is minimal, but I still occasionally replace the set screw if it feels the least bit rough coming out. From an industrial supplier, a bag of 100 is $10 USD, so it's cheap insurance.

[PaulE84]

Wow, that set screw looks terrible. I bought a whole bunch of set screws yesterday and will look at replacing them from time to time, even if they look okay. Cheap insurance as you say. I will also take the MG2 to my Gunsmith to look at softening those edges on the carrier pivot pin. Your insight is invaluable, thanks Doug.

By the way, the slide lock seems to be holding up okay after I applied 243 LOCTITE to the screw. No issues with it yesterday at all. I have training today and tomorrow leading up to a big competition over the weekend. It'll be a good test. After the event, I might look at getting the slide lock bevelled anyway just for extra measure.

Thank you for your time.

[Gwhite]

Because of the way the slide hits the stop, putting the stop on the right side will tend to tighten the screw. If the stop is on the left, the impact will tend to loosen it. I'm right handed, and prefer it on the right anyway. I can reach up with my trigger finger to hold it up.

[PaulE84]

A friend of mine who recently purchased an EVO Standard has put approximately 2,000 rounds through it and has broken 2x Bullet Insert Levers (BIL's) in the usual spot where the pin holds it in place. Does anyone have a similar experience and any thoughts on why this keeps happening? It seems odd that he has broken 2x in such a short time.

He has been using CCI, does this have an effect on it at all?

[Gwhite]

I had a BIL break on my first Evo, after several thousand rounds. I don't know if it was a design weakness in the change to the Evo version or what, but the replacement and the other two Evo's we have are fine. I'm surprised that two broke in such short succession.

I doubt that it has anything to do with ammunition. Morini was constantly tinkering with the design of the carrier, and it's possible the carrier ears are sticking up high enough to whack the BIL due to that, or just manufacturing tolerances. I'd cycle it manually, and compare it with yours. I'd make sure there's no contact between the BIL and the carrier ears when the carrier is fully up and the BIL is down.