The New ISSF Air Pistol Finals Format

[B Lafferty]

It being dropped from Olympics has honestly made it more attractive to me personally. Exactly because it got rid of the finals. It's not like you need to resolve many ties in free pistol anyway. Especially not in national and lower level competition.

Yeah, I’ve been thinking about trying to hold a little old-school match, if I could get a few people interested. I have a few free pistols, and anyone with an iron sight bullseye gun could join in as well. 10-shots on a paper target. Change it. Repeat 5 more times. Count center 10s as Xs. It has a simple, pure appeal to me.

+1

[B Lafferty]

FWIMBW, on the ISSF YouTube channel it appears that one month after Croatia, the views of the men's and woman's air pistol finals is lower than it would normally be. Perhaps this is an indicator of the failure of the new format as a spectator friendly format.

I've had no response to critical emails that I sent to ISSF Executive Board members and to Board members of USA Shooting. Not that I expected any detailed responses from the ISSF (maybe just an acknowledgment of having written?), but I did expect a substantive response from USA Shooting given that I was a member of that organization.

Screw them all. Take shooting out of the Olympics and let shooters get on with meaningful competition instead of childish, dysfunctional attempts at boosting popularity for the ignorant spectator masses every four years.

[FWB_700_Alu]

If a Scoring format awards a 9.7 and on the next series a 10.3 is not rewarded, something is wrong. I will not be watching any of any Finals in the future as long as the present scoring system is being used.

Greetings from Fascist Germany

[toddinjax]

I came across a live feed of ISSF final in Egypt last night. Watched a few minutes, didn't know wtf was going on then stopped watching. I am no world class shooter but when an interested and active participant of a sport turns away, your sport is in deep trouble.
Hho are the ones who make these changes? Are they elected into their positions? As posted above already, there was nothing wrong with what was already in place.

[B Lafferty]

While this observation is not really precise, it does appear from ISSF on YouTube that viewership of men's and woman's air pistol finals since the format change has fallen off.

What do the top level shooters think of the new format? Has anyone seen or read any interviews/discussion with the competitors and coaches?

[Azmodan]

new new format!
https://issf-sports.org/competitions/ve ... hipid=3080

[renzo]

Years working to achieve my ISSF judge license, and then this.

They've changed the finals format how many times since London 2012?

The Mixed team match has changed how many times since its introduction?

One doesn't have solely to know the rules and have field experience, now you've got to have a permanent wi-fi link to be updated of every silly change!!!

[B Lafferty]

Years working to achieve my ISSF judge license, and then this.

They've changed the finals format how many times since London 2012?

The Mixed team match has changed how many times since its introduction?

One doesn't have solely to know the rules and have field experience, now you've got to have a permanent wi-fi link to be updated of every silly change!!!

No longer interesting. No longer watching. No longer care about the event.

[Grippy]

This new new format is a massive improvement in my opinion. They stuck with the gold medal match part but the part leading up to that is better from a shooters perspective. Points are points again. It is streamlined. It gets rid of some of the arbitrary zeroing. And by grouping shots it recovers some degree of time management that was lacking in the versions that boxed every shot individually into 50s intervals. It allows shooters to stay closer to their natural rhythm. Overall this one is a complexity reduction even compared to the previous format.

Also for judges/organizers this is much nicer I'd imagine? You only need commands for series of five shots at a time instead of micromanaging every single shot. Less stages. Better flow due to less interruptions etc. It's structurally the precision stage of the 25m event with slightly different time limits.

This is a big step in the right direction In my opinion.

[charliemow13]

Not watched the full coverage of the Rio world cup event yet but definitely liking this return to points being points and grouping the shots in series of 5. For me the excitement watching the finals was seeing how small the margins were between the shooters. It makes me appreciate just how high their level is when they are separated by just tenths of a point. And this new new format brings that back.

[BobGee]

Screw them all. Take shooting out of the Olympics and let shooters get on with meaningful competition instead of childish, dysfunctional attempts at boosting popularity for the ignorant spectator masses every four years.

Here, Downunder, we hope that shooting remains in the Olympics. It is one of the mainstays of our ability to resist the remorseless attacks from our gun-control zealots. As long as there is international shooting competition many of us have an argument for owning our firearms.

Bob

[Whizzzz]

Just watched the Junior Womens competition ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AsmZgWO ... ideostream ).

Blimey they are good!

It took a bit of a while to get used to the format, I would think as a shooter it might feel a little disjointed. I like to get into things and work at my own pace.

[Ramon OP]

What I'm missing from commentators is more teaching: explaining in detail how to shoot well, tactics, ways to train, rules... There are some explanations now, but few and vague. It is a tough job!

What I'm missing from broadcasts is to focus on the full shot instead of static moments. Just showing a face or a pistol about to shoot adds boringness. There's been some good broadcasts and I really like when we can watch two shooters side by side.

I appreciate the experimentation on final formats. My favorite is 8 shooters starting at 0 with eliminations: there's more suspense and seeing the ranking changes in tight finals is thrilling.

[B Lafferty]

What is the latest 10 meter men's and women's individual air pistol finals format, please. And can someone link to the latest ISSF rules covering same?
Thanks!

[Spencer]

https://www.issf-sports.org/getfile.asp ... 1.1.22.pdf

[atomicgale]

So now: The number of shots fired will be 10, plus 5, in initial round (then a break where you cool off & get clumsy), then another 10 shots (a break), then another 5 shots, (yet another break), then make the "Gold Medal round."

Then, you shoot AT LEAST another 8 shots (2pts best; winner needs 16).

Hence: TEN +FIVE +TEN + FIVE + at least EIGHT. Shooting at least another HALF-MATCH - while setting-up/shooting/clearing your gear/waiting on next round/finding a spot to dry fire / setting BACK UP/ shooting / clearing away your gear AGAIN / et cetera ad nauseam.

All the while, (at least for pistol), neither the grand total of SIX spectators, nor the athletes have any idea how anyone is doing . . . .

POSTSCRIPT: Just to add insult to injury: Music during Finals required to be BEST OF THE VILLAGE PEOPLE.

[B Lafferty]

Thank you both. This is what I suspected. Totally uninteresting to watch.

I wonder if there have been any negative comments from the top shooters and/or any national shooting sport federations.

YMCA anyone?

[atomicgale]

Quoting the finals regs on "changeover" from First relay of 4, to Second relay of 4:

"The changeover should take a maximum time of two (2) minutes"

. . . then the second group is introduced & expected to be ready to compete.

For us pistol shooters, gathering up our gear and leaving / or setting up to shoot (while overlapping in the same lane/position with the guy packing it in) would be very-very rushed, at best.

For the rifle shooters, how in the world are they supposed to haul-off all the shit they lug around in two minutes?

[B Lafferty]

Quoting the finals regs on "changeover" from First relay of 4, to Second relay of 4:

"The changeover should take a maximum time of two (2) minutes"

. . . then the second group is introduced & expected to be ready to compete.

For us pistol shooters, gathering up our gear and leaving / or setting up to shoot (while overlapping in the same lane/position with the guy packing it in) would be very-very rushed, at best.

For the rifle shooters, how in the world are they supposed to haul-off all the shit they lug around in two minutes?

Points well taken. From a purely spectator point of view, I think the new format simply sucks. I haven't watched a final since they abandoned the old format. I wonder what their YouTube channel viewership stats are and what the top shooters think of the new format. Also, is the new format impacting the flow of new, young shooters into the sport?

[atomicgale]

IMO, it should be titled How to Kill a Sport. Boring, IMO. Not worth watching at all . . .and I've tried.

WATCH THE WORLD CUP AP-MEN FINALS - ESPECIALLY THE GOLD MEDAL SEQUENCE!
Link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f3m2m_3809U

After personally scathing the new format - I believe it was modified in Cairo this week:
1. Five shots, ALL 8 finalists together
2. Five more shots, rank
3. Five shots - award 7th & 8th
4. Five shots - award 6th & 5th
5. Five shots - "award" 4th & hand-out Bronze Medal (I don't like the Bronze medal aspect . . . should be a shoot-off)
6. GOLD MEDAL SHOOT-OFF: "2 pt. Must" (like boxing's 10) - 2pts per round: 2pts best shot or 1-1 for tie.
First to 16 points = GOLD MEDAL

Up-side: Seriously watch this thru the Gold Medal shoot-off. Solely for crowd appeal - this one is a WINNER.

Downside: You could end up shooting 25 more shots @ 4:10/per; then from exactly 8 to up to 16 more for GOLD.
(i.e. literally up to a 101-shot day, not including sighters)

SPOILER ALERT,

SPOILER ALERT,

SPOILER ALERT (leave screen now) . . .



SPOILER ALERT: (There was 16 shots taken in Gold Medal shoot-off.)