Miracle of 3-d printing, legal or not legal

[seamaster]

Finally tackled my front heavy IZH 46m problems.

1) too front heavy, took out that end barrel front sight block. Made 3.5mm 4.0mm 4.5mm front sight block/sight replacement. Original block was quite weighty, new versions weighed nothing. Front heaviness much improved.

2) I run out of elevation adjustment clicks, barely got into sub-6 with my izh46M. My new 3-D front sight is 5mm lower, now allows me to go comfortably into sub-6 area now.

3) had tried to make visible scratch mark, to paint dot on that front sight, without much help. I can barely notice any scratch mark or paint mark on that metal front sight. With 3-d printed front sight, I dotted a 1mm light tunnel through that front sight. It now looks as bright as a tiny fiberoptic dot. No problem focusing on that front sight now.

Question. Is it legal per ISSF rules? no fiberoptic, no hooded front sight. Is that 1mm light tunnel breaking any rule?

[FWB_700_Alu]

So you put a hole in the front sight post?

[seamaster]

Yes, a 0.5mm light tunnel in the middle of front sight. Looking straight into front sight, I will see the white dot. At a slight off angle, it is just a regular black front sight, no one can see it.

So legal or not, it is too much fun with that tiny light dot.

Front sight does not seem to exist to me any more. It is like shooting red dot sight.

I have never able to shoot that izh 46m like that. Two days ago, I was spraying shots all over the place. Now 5-6 x out of ten. EASILY. Fliers still there, but grouping is light and day much better.

Legal or not, it is just too much fun shooting red dot, or, more properly, white dot.

[FWB_700_Alu]

So you obviously still use your rear sight. To me you are using a hooded front sight.

[seamaster]

Under which ISSF rule would you call this tiny, tiny dot a hooded front sight?

[FWB_700_Alu]

Their are no sizes given for the hood that is not to be used...If anything, the front sight is Iluminated by something.

[seamaster]

You got me on that “illuminated” front sight technicality.

Just went out to shoot more. It is so much easier to keep that dot in sub-6.

Name is grouping, grouping galore !

Now to argue in terms of legality. If I 3-D print a tiniest line down to that little dot. This is an open sight now.

No argument in technicality now, correct?

[FWB_700_Alu]

Now I think that would be an open sight. I don´t think their are rules against 2 front sight posts.

[rmca]

8.4.1.3 Sights
a) Only open sights are allowed. Sights using fiber optic, light enhancing or reflecting color surfaces are prohibited. Optical, mirror, telescope, laser-beam, electronically projected dot sights etc. are prohibited;
b) Any aiming device programmed to activate the firing mechanism is prohibited;
c) No protective covering is permitted on front or rear open sights;
d) 10m and 25m Pistols must fit within specified measuring boxes with sights mounted on the pistols (see PISTOL SPECIFICATION TABLE, Rule 8.12);
e) Correcting lenses and/or filters must not be attached to the pistol; and
f) Corrective lenses or eyeglasses and/or filters or tinted lenses may be worn by the athlete

I would argue that the hole on the front sight is light enhancing, there for, not legal.

Hope this helps

[dulcmr-man]

8.4.1.3 Sights
I would argue that the hole on the front sight is light enhancing, there for, not legal.

Hope this helps.

I think the phrase "light enhancing" probably refers to some kind of fiber optic component that gathers light and therefore I believe that this "tunnel" MIGHT be legal. The only way to know for sure would be to present it to the ISSF for a formal ruling.

Dennis, aka Dulcmrman

[seamaster]

"Sights using fiber optic, light enhancing or reflecting color surfaces are prohibited. Optical, mirror, telescope, laser-beam, electronically projected dot sights etc. are prohibited"

A light tunnel is not optical/mirror/telescope/laser/dot sight.

Light level is the same in front, behind, 360 all around the front sight.

It is a a tiny light tunnel dot, but I am not sure it is "light enhancing".

At this point, I feel the pain of Bill Clinton. As he said, "Please define sex."

Any way, I have another question. For me, a shooter of 540-550 caliber, shooting this "red dot"-like front sight is an eye opener. It is definitely easier, and more precise, with dot effect than open iron sight. For people shooting at a higher level, let's say President's 100 bull eye shooting, do you shoot higher score with red dot than open sight?

[Azmodan]

send an email to munich@issf-sports.org and ask. see what they reply

[FWB_700_Alu]

add a picture as an attchment.

[j danielsson]

Though it does not enhance surrounding light, it definitely brings more light to were it is not supposed to be any as l see it.
I would say not allowed...ish.

[spektr]

Now I skirt the rules just as hard as anybody, but honestly, the rule itself dooms you. The lack of specificity of the term light enhancing is the problem...... Since light enhancing isn't clearly defined in the rule, you cannot argue against it. THAT is your problem. I DO believe that ultimately your sight is not legal, since by design, it provides a transport path for photons normally located in front of the sight but blocked from view to become visible to the shooter, and that this transport path enhances the light visable to the shooter...... The problem with my specific definition is that you have nothing in the currently written rule to say otherwise...... The imprecision of the rule drives the outcome.

[KDZ]

Is the internal surface of the hole you made shiny? (as with metal or hard plastic) If so it has similar light transmission efficiency to fiber optic because rays striking the wall at a low angle (nearly parallel) are totally reflected (total internal reflection). Look down any shiny bore and you will see a rim of light.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Total_internal_reflection

[rmca]

"Sights using fiber optic, light enhancing or reflecting color surfaces are prohibited. Optical, mirror, telescope, laser-beam, electronically projected dot sights etc. are prohibited"

A light tunnel is not optical/mirror/telescope/laser/dot sight.

You missed the first part...
a) Only open sights are allowed.
A tunnel is not an open sight. I would say that the hole acts as a fiber optic.

It's one of those things that, the only opinion that matters, is the equipment control one's...
I would try to find out what it is, well before a match...

Hope this helps

[FWB_700_Alu]

You got me on that “illuminated” front sight technicality.


Now to argue in terms of legality. If I 3-D print a tiniest line down to that little dot. This is an open sight now.

No argument in technicality now, correct?

If you read the whole thread, some things would not be commented like they are

[askernie]

Seamaster,

I have a IZH-46 and I am interested in your front sight. I would love to order one from you. I don’t care about specific legalities since i shoot for pleasure and do not intend enter any ISSF regulated competition.

Thanks
Ernesto “Ernie the eyeball” Fuentes
justaskernie@gmail.com
813-598-2902

[seamaster]

I don't know nothing about no 3-D printers myself.

My good friend has one, he was making all things (hinges, screws, wine bottle caps, glasses frames). So I told him my heavy front sight and not able to get down to sub-6 problems. So he combined my izh46m block holder and Steyr front sight, and created a front sight that solved both problem. While he was at it, I asked him to create a small 1mm tunnel through that Steyr front sight so I can have a visible mark in the middle of the front sight. He obliged. It is all in his computer. He used caliper measured the front sights I gave him, then he recreated it geometrically in his computer, then print it. I had Andrew Berryhill created some stuff for me awhile back. But the overall quality of Drew's 3-D stuff was not sharp along the edges where it really need to be sharp. After a few trials with my friend, we learned that the side with first print layer on glass surface is always rougher, so as not to use that side for sharp edges where I need them to be sharp. My friend has different materials, colors. It is just amazing what that computer linked printer can do. I was amazed with this 3-D printing ability long time ago (1992) when I saw my engineer friend at MIT was "printing" constant release medication tablet. As tablet dissolve, surface area gets smaller. So concentration of drug was lower on the outside, but as surface peels away, concentration gets higher to compensate for constant drug release. It is amazing to see the technology has become so plebean. A good machine is $150 now, and you can just make all kind of things with it. Scan with your iPhone, clear up the lines in your computer drawing, voila, print it out in fifteen minutes. Amazing.

But to answer your question. I have a computer mental blockage, I don't know nothing about no 3-D printers myself.