I have an Anschutz 1827 biathlon rifle that I have never been very impressed with its accuracy. It is an older club rifle and I have no idea how many rounds have been through it or how it was cleaned and handled in the past. I have given the rifle a good cleaning paying special attention to the crown. I have only shot it off a rest once when I first got it. I have shot a variety of inexpensive ammunition through it including Eley, SK, Federal, CCI and some others. My biathlon coach once shot a clip of nicer Eley through it (I can't remember which) and got the same results. It just seems to produce large groups without any distinct flyers.
It has never really bothered me that the accuracy wasn't that great because I feel I'm too far down the learning curve for that to make much of a difference in my performance. The other day though, a teammate suggested that I buy some better ammunition and see how it shoots with it. So I'm wondering if this is something I should try and just how I should go about it. I'm not interested in lot testing, but just basic accuracy.
The second part of this question is what to do if the accuracy really isn't that great. The obvious place to start would be the crown. I have read a very nice article on cutting crowns from a link on Rimfire Central and the tools are not very expensive. I have only a little experience with metal working, but I am a furniture and cabinet maker so I'm wondering if this is something I could do myself .
I would really appreciate your input.
rifle accuracy
Moderators: pilkguns, m1963, David Levene, Spencer, Richard H
Re: rifle accuracy
Before doing any cutting, try to find a borescope to check the interior of the barrel (and especially the area just ahead of the chamber).
If it has been fired a lot, and no special attention paid to the chamber leade area, you may have a carbon ring there. It can be removed. I'd start with soaking with a good carbon remover (I like "Carbon Killer", but may folks use automotive top engine carbon remover), and a chamber brush.
If it has been fired a lot, and no special attention paid to the chamber leade area, you may have a carbon ring there. It can be removed. I'd start with soaking with a good carbon remover (I like "Carbon Killer", but may folks use automotive top engine carbon remover), and a chamber brush.
Re: rifle accuracy
PcW,
The crown is generally held to play an important part in accuracy. Some folks have successfully recut the crown with hand tools; the Mason piloted cutter is often mentioned. Personally I wouldn't want to try this myself unless I was sure the factory crown was worn/defective, and had practised beforehand. I'm not a practical type mind.
However before I tried any gunsmithing, I'd ensure the rifle is running properly.
Pat is right to suggest cleaning again. If the barrel is very grubby, it can take several cycles of soaking, bronze brushing, and patching to come up clean. A single round of patches or a nylon brush are fine for routine maintenance, but not a really thorough job. Grey streaks on a dry patch mean the grooves aren't clean. Very careful use of a cleaning paste, such as VFG, can shorten the time. Paste is especially good if there is lead or stubborn burnished fouling.
As well as cleaning the barrel, I'd also replace the main spring in the bolt. The 1800 Match 54 spring isn't large (by design), and according to Anschutz should be replaced every few years if the rifle is used regularly, so the firing pin hits the case hard enough. A new spring is cheap, and easy to fit. If yours is a Fortner action, I'd still replace the spring - ignition is important for 22s.
I'd also have the headspace checked with graduated gauges; heavy use can wear the bolt so the headspace is a bit too large. Then the bolt doesn't fully chamber cartridges, so the firing pin strike is weakened. I recently looked over a misfiring 1913; headspace was 0.046 against 0.043in-ish new. You can get shims to correct headspace.
Bedding bolts, are these actually tight? Borrow a torque wrench to ensure the torque is even. You may want to see if there is any improvement with the bolts set to a specific torque (the same on each though). Are the bolts bottoming out in the stock?
Is the barrel fully free-floated?
Finally, don't expect cheaper ammo to shoot like top grade. There is a reason that Tenex, Midas+, and R50 cost more than the Sport, Standard Plus or Geco. One magazine of a possibly higher grade isn't proof the barrel is knackered. After a thorough servicing, try some mid-2nd grade, like Eley Match, or Lapua Centre-X, ideally a few different batches of each. Enlist the help of a better shooter, if you don't think you can hold well enough to test fairly. If the rifle won't group acceptably with any batch, seek a professional opinion about a new crown, or even barrel. 30 years sustained use or rust from neglect can impair accuracy. A gunsmith can rechamber the existing barrel, but I'm not sure this is worth the cost unless the barrel was a proven performer when younger.
The crown is generally held to play an important part in accuracy. Some folks have successfully recut the crown with hand tools; the Mason piloted cutter is often mentioned. Personally I wouldn't want to try this myself unless I was sure the factory crown was worn/defective, and had practised beforehand. I'm not a practical type mind.
However before I tried any gunsmithing, I'd ensure the rifle is running properly.
Pat is right to suggest cleaning again. If the barrel is very grubby, it can take several cycles of soaking, bronze brushing, and patching to come up clean. A single round of patches or a nylon brush are fine for routine maintenance, but not a really thorough job. Grey streaks on a dry patch mean the grooves aren't clean. Very careful use of a cleaning paste, such as VFG, can shorten the time. Paste is especially good if there is lead or stubborn burnished fouling.
As well as cleaning the barrel, I'd also replace the main spring in the bolt. The 1800 Match 54 spring isn't large (by design), and according to Anschutz should be replaced every few years if the rifle is used regularly, so the firing pin hits the case hard enough. A new spring is cheap, and easy to fit. If yours is a Fortner action, I'd still replace the spring - ignition is important for 22s.
I'd also have the headspace checked with graduated gauges; heavy use can wear the bolt so the headspace is a bit too large. Then the bolt doesn't fully chamber cartridges, so the firing pin strike is weakened. I recently looked over a misfiring 1913; headspace was 0.046 against 0.043in-ish new. You can get shims to correct headspace.
Bedding bolts, are these actually tight? Borrow a torque wrench to ensure the torque is even. You may want to see if there is any improvement with the bolts set to a specific torque (the same on each though). Are the bolts bottoming out in the stock?
Is the barrel fully free-floated?
Finally, don't expect cheaper ammo to shoot like top grade. There is a reason that Tenex, Midas+, and R50 cost more than the Sport, Standard Plus or Geco. One magazine of a possibly higher grade isn't proof the barrel is knackered. After a thorough servicing, try some mid-2nd grade, like Eley Match, or Lapua Centre-X, ideally a few different batches of each. Enlist the help of a better shooter, if you don't think you can hold well enough to test fairly. If the rifle won't group acceptably with any batch, seek a professional opinion about a new crown, or even barrel. 30 years sustained use or rust from neglect can impair accuracy. A gunsmith can rechamber the existing barrel, but I'm not sure this is worth the cost unless the barrel was a proven performer when younger.
Re: rifle accuracy
Hey guys,
Thanks for the replies. I think the rifle was originally purchased by the Maine Winter Sports Center in the late '90s and used as a club rifle until sometime around 2006. I suspect that the rifle was cleaned once or twice a year along with all the other club rifles. I purchased the rifle from one of our current world cup team members who bought it from the Maine center. I know that the rifle was mostly cleaned with a pull through device when he had it.
I asked about bedding bolt torque when I bought the rifle and was told that the torque didn't seem to affect it that much as long as the torque was the same on both bolts. I have not played with the torque myself though I bought a torque wrench just for that reason (and for bicycle parts).
I have read on this site all of the discussions about ammunition testing and whether or not it is sufficient to test in a vice and it seems that for the most thorough testing, it should be done off the shoulder to allow for recoil. My needs are not that sophisticated. I have a medium size clamp on vice I could bring to the range and mount the rifle using the accessory rail or clamp just the action in the vice. Would that work for me?
I'm going to take your advice and give the rifle a few more cleanings. In the past I have used JB bore paste and Hopps products to clean it. I just replaced a broken firing pin and if I was smarter I would have replaced the spring at the same time. Live and learn. I will go ahead and get a few varieties of nicer grade ammunition a see what I get from that. I am also going to meet with a coach from a youth small bore program and I'll get the name of a good gunsmith from him. I can't imagine that I will ever be competitive enough to justify a new barrel, but it would be nice to have the bore scoped and the crown checked.
Thanks for your help, PCW
Thanks for the replies. I think the rifle was originally purchased by the Maine Winter Sports Center in the late '90s and used as a club rifle until sometime around 2006. I suspect that the rifle was cleaned once or twice a year along with all the other club rifles. I purchased the rifle from one of our current world cup team members who bought it from the Maine center. I know that the rifle was mostly cleaned with a pull through device when he had it.
I asked about bedding bolt torque when I bought the rifle and was told that the torque didn't seem to affect it that much as long as the torque was the same on both bolts. I have not played with the torque myself though I bought a torque wrench just for that reason (and for bicycle parts).
I have read on this site all of the discussions about ammunition testing and whether or not it is sufficient to test in a vice and it seems that for the most thorough testing, it should be done off the shoulder to allow for recoil. My needs are not that sophisticated. I have a medium size clamp on vice I could bring to the range and mount the rifle using the accessory rail or clamp just the action in the vice. Would that work for me?
I'm going to take your advice and give the rifle a few more cleanings. In the past I have used JB bore paste and Hopps products to clean it. I just replaced a broken firing pin and if I was smarter I would have replaced the spring at the same time. Live and learn. I will go ahead and get a few varieties of nicer grade ammunition a see what I get from that. I am also going to meet with a coach from a youth small bore program and I'll get the name of a good gunsmith from him. I can't imagine that I will ever be competitive enough to justify a new barrel, but it would be nice to have the bore scoped and the crown checked.
Thanks for your help, PCW
Re: rifle accuracy
Pcw,
A professional opinion won't hurt.
If you have cleaned regularly with Hoppe's, and periodically with JB, you may not find further cleaning improves things markedly. Pull-throughs, such as the former owner used, are useful for a quick clean after shooting, but typically won't deep clean. But your earlier efforts with JB should have removed any lingering crud.
I don't know what sort of mileage elite biathlon shooters put on their rifles, but position shooters can certainly wear out barrels.
As for vices, the jury is out. Eley, and I believe the US Lapua range, clamp actions, although in really big vices. There is an argument that a vice won't allow the rifle to behave as it does from the shoulder, which distorts the results. Against that, a vice certainly eliminates some human error, and if nothing groups well, that's suggestive something isn't right.
A professional opinion won't hurt.
If you have cleaned regularly with Hoppe's, and periodically with JB, you may not find further cleaning improves things markedly. Pull-throughs, such as the former owner used, are useful for a quick clean after shooting, but typically won't deep clean. But your earlier efforts with JB should have removed any lingering crud.
I don't know what sort of mileage elite biathlon shooters put on their rifles, but position shooters can certainly wear out barrels.
As for vices, the jury is out. Eley, and I believe the US Lapua range, clamp actions, although in really big vices. There is an argument that a vice won't allow the rifle to behave as it does from the shoulder, which distorts the results. Against that, a vice certainly eliminates some human error, and if nothing groups well, that's suggestive something isn't right.
Re: rifle accuracy
I wonder if there is a rule-of-thumb for wearing out an Anschutz .22 barrel in a Model 54 action? Some Hammerli pistol shooters have their barrels relined after ~ 100k rounds and report an improvement in ransom rest groups. The Anschutz 1813 I shot years ago was not cleaned fastidiously, which seemed typical and still shot well after my 60k rounds. I'd never heard of anyone shooting out a high quality .22 rifle barrel until reading internet message boards.
Ultimately, the 'proof is in the pudding' and 100 yard test groups are the ultimate measure. A bench rest setup should be sufficient. If a rifle is inaccurate and seems to have been that way for some time, replacing the barrel is typical. I suppose in certain circles, persons know about re-barreling Anschutz target rifles.
Personally, I would contact Anschutz with the model and serial number of the rifle and see if they provide any guidance. Re-barreling the action may be a service they will still provide.
Edit: a cleaning guide and coated rod were always used when cleaning the barrel. IMO, more damage is typically done cleaning the barrel instead of shooting. Here is what a (plastic) cleaning guide looks like:
Edit II: OK, these 1827 biathlon actions are not 54 actions but are Fortner and assembled by Anschutz. The 1827 bathlon rifle is unique. I doubt many know much about them (even on the internet).
Ultimately, the 'proof is in the pudding' and 100 yard test groups are the ultimate measure. A bench rest setup should be sufficient. If a rifle is inaccurate and seems to have been that way for some time, replacing the barrel is typical. I suppose in certain circles, persons know about re-barreling Anschutz target rifles.
Personally, I would contact Anschutz with the model and serial number of the rifle and see if they provide any guidance. Re-barreling the action may be a service they will still provide.
Edit: a cleaning guide and coated rod were always used when cleaning the barrel. IMO, more damage is typically done cleaning the barrel instead of shooting. Here is what a (plastic) cleaning guide looks like:
Edit II: OK, these 1827 biathlon actions are not 54 actions but are Fortner and assembled by Anschutz. The 1827 bathlon rifle is unique. I doubt many know much about them (even on the internet).
Last edited by 10M_Stan on Sun Jun 24, 2018 7:20 am, edited 2 times in total.
Re: rifle accuracy
Find a local bench-rest friend or somebody with a borescope. That should answer many questions. Also shooting a biathlon gun above 30 degrees ambient wont tell you the true story. The clearances in the gun are designed to be right straight out of the freezer so to speak. Im personally betting on a carbon ring and I would caution you to go very slowly with anything having an abrasive quality since you never get to put metal back....... I would start by hanging the action vertically after removing the bolt and leave it in a can of a good penetrating oil for a week or so, its almost miraculous what a well oiled squeaky clean gun shoots like..... Also KROIL is very very good
-
crankythunder
- Posts: 255
- Joined: Tue Dec 22, 2009 6:57 pm
- Location: The ugly side of Hell, Michigan
- Contact:
Re: rifle accuracy
Dear PCW:
As a four position shooter, I find a set of benchrest bags indispensable for benchrest shooting in order to quantify ammo performance.
What exactly are the groups you are getting from your anschutz?
For example, my Winchester 52c has delivered sub 0.200 inch groups at 50 yards with top ammo. I use a cheaper ammo for competition which deliveres 5 shot groups in the 0.300 range for position shooting.
My Anschutz 64 will give me 0400 groups at 50 yards.
My Kimber 82g delivers 0.500-0.750 inch groups (measured center to center) at 50 yards with medium quality ammo.
I use all three for competitions and do not feel undergunned.
what groups are you currently getting? If you are not experienced benchrest, you might find a friend at your gun club who has the experience and equipment.
I think it might be a carbon ring by the way.
Sincerely,
Cranky
As a four position shooter, I find a set of benchrest bags indispensable for benchrest shooting in order to quantify ammo performance.
What exactly are the groups you are getting from your anschutz?
For example, my Winchester 52c has delivered sub 0.200 inch groups at 50 yards with top ammo. I use a cheaper ammo for competition which deliveres 5 shot groups in the 0.300 range for position shooting.
My Anschutz 64 will give me 0400 groups at 50 yards.
My Kimber 82g delivers 0.500-0.750 inch groups (measured center to center) at 50 yards with medium quality ammo.
I use all three for competitions and do not feel undergunned.
what groups are you currently getting? If you are not experienced benchrest, you might find a friend at your gun club who has the experience and equipment.
I think it might be a carbon ring by the way.
Sincerely,
Cranky