Hammerli FP60

[ronpistolero]

Hi.

I understand this free pistol has been out on the market a few years. I'd like to hear some detailed reviews of the gun please. I am somewhat biased towards Hammerlis as I have been using a 160 and previously a 107.

Thanks!

[Reinhamre]

My advice is to stay away from that model.
You can adjust the grip angle but this comes with a price, the small bits that the grip screw is connected too flimsy!
IF you have a strike of bad luck and the trigger has been set and the "shoot" goes of when the breech is not fully closed, then you must invest in a new firing pin. It happened twice on my gun and resulted both time in a broken fire pin. Then I bought a spare breech (same as on model160) and was more careful. If you must have a Hammerli, then a model 150 will be better

[ronpistolero]

That's so sad that such a quality product yesteryears has gone bad especially with stiff competition around. Odd that they have not corrected this despite such flaws which I am sure have reached them

[slofyr]

Over 5000 rounds through my FP60 so far and not one problem. What a pleasure it is to shoot. It's lighter weight and, for me, holds steadier than the H160 or 84e. The action is much smoother than the 160, as well. Fit a Rink and enjoy.

[Reinhamre]

Sure, enjoy when it last.
Even the worst gun will have an owner that loves the gun, a "it shoots better than me" sort. And the worst gun may have find a owner that can make amazing results with the gun. The best of guns will also find a owner that finds flaws in everything, it is the law of nature.

[jipe]

My advice is to stay away from that model.
You can adjust the grip angle but this comes with a price, the small bits that the grip screw is connected too flimsy!
IF you have a strike of bad luck and the trigger has been set and the "shoot" goes of when the breech is not fully closed, then you must invest in a new firing pin. It happened twice on my gun and resulted both time in a broken fire pin. Then I bought a spare breech (same as on model160) and was more careful. If you must have a Hammerli, then a model 150 will be better

I own a 160 special with the same breech as the FP60 and I am not so negative about it: yes, if you release the trigger when the breech is not fully closed, you have a chance of breaking the side pin of the firing pin (or berak it into two pieces). When the breech is fully open, the chance to break the firing pin is lower (the side pin may break when it hits the breech opening lever at "full speed", this happens when the breech is almost closed, when the breech is fully open, the breech opening lever is close to the side pin and the hit is not so strong -> less chance to break the pin).

But:
- it can only happen if the trigger has been armed before opening the breech or when the breech is still open. This should never happen since on a FP with a (very) low trigger weight, for safety reasons, you should never arm the trigger when the breech is open (or open the breech when the trigger is armed). If you need to release the firing pin when it is armed, you must use a dummy cartridge and fire the shot as usual. You also must be careful during weapon cleaning.
- I saw that Hammerli modified the trigger pin, the recent ones seem to be made of a different steel allow than the old one and less prone to break.

For the 150, yes it is a good pistol but take care, there are three different trigger design, only the latest one is good, the two earlier are not good and fragile.

[Reinhamre]

Yes, you are right about all that jipe
BUT: Some of us do dry fire the pistol more ore less frequently and Murphy is alive and kicking. I did open the pistol and the trigger was set already!
That is how it happens. I hope you do not suggest that I "fire" the gun before I look to see if it is emty??

[jipe]

Yes, you are right about all that jipe
BUT: Some of us do dry fire the pistol more ore less frequently and Murphy is alive and kicking. I did open the pistol and the trigger was set already!
That is how it happens. I hope you do not suggest that I "fire" the gun before I look to see if it is emty??

No, of course not !

Actually, I think the biggest risk of damage when cleaning the pistol.

Another problem is if a range officer ask you to stop shooting when you have already armed the trigger, there is no 100% safe way to unload to pistol (excepted to shoot of course), it is not possible to un-arm the trigger, there is no safety mechanism, opening the breech doesn't prevent to release the firing pin...

Now this problem isn't only for the 160, the same problem exist on many free pistols.

What I do is that I always leave a dummy cartridge in the pistol. When I stop shooting, I load the dummy cartridge and then I release the shot so that the firing pin is not under compression and I leave the dummy cartridge in the chamber.

Dry firing isn't a real problem as the firing pin must not be armed to dry fire, arming the trigger is enough and it doesn't cause any wear or damage on the pistol, it is possible to dry fire like that as many times as wished.

For the FP60, I don't understand why the action would be smoother, it is exactly the same as on the 160, the parts are even exchangeable ?
The only differences are the frame, the trigger blade and the rear sight which has a width adjustment on the FP60 while on the 160 you need to exchange the removable blade to change its width.
For the weight, there is a difference indeed, but not that much (only the frame in aluminum, the barrel+breech+internal trigger mechanism are still in steel, the grip, which is heavy on a FP, is the same) and anyway an heavy free pistol isn't bad.

My advise is that if you want a Hammerli FP, go for the 160 special. As said, the 150 latest version is also good but the big advantage of the 160 wrt 150 is that all internal parts are still available from Walther/Hammerli because they are the same as in the still in production FP60.

[slofyr]

....For the FP60, I don't understand why the action would be smoother, it is exactly the same as on the 160, the parts are even exchangeable ? .....

I do not know why the FP60 has a smoother action than the 160, but mine sure does. I owned the 160 for a couple of months after purchasing the FP60 and had a chance to compare both. Others who shot them noticed it too. I did not try to interchange parts to check fit, and I could not see any differences in the cam or the arms, so can only assume some sort of leverage advantage. Possibly, there is a slight difference in the finish of machined surfaces. Beats me. From the day I bought it, cocking the 160 required a brisk and firm tug on the lever where the FP60 only requires a moderate pull to eject the empty and cock the striker. It was not a maintenance issue, either, the 160 was meticulously cared for.

As for breaking the firing pin because the trigger was set before loading and closing the block, in my opinion that is operator error. It never ceases to amaze me how someone can call an excellent product crap because of 'their' problem. No matter how good something is, on the net you'll always find someone whining about it. If you are considering a 50-meter pistol and do not try an FP60, you will be missing a good thing. The engineers who create our precision target arms are not stupid, and for sure the pistols are extensively tested before reaching the production stage. The FP60 action has a long heritage in the Hammerli line, and it has been used by a substantial number of shooters who have gotten along with it just fine.

[ronpistolero]

Reinhamre was probably just very unlucky with his unit, hence the bad experience he has had was merely translated into words. Nevertheless, people may have their own ways/habits that are deemed "safe" in operating this kind of firearm yet may not be tolerated by particular models. At least now that I have heard some positive comments, then maybe I can pursue this model. Though they may be just as competitive, I just don't like the Morini aesthetics, especially the position of the breach lever upon loading. Just my thoughts. Anyway, more opinions on the FP60 are welcome.

[lastman]

Personally, my FP60 is the best FP that I have ever shot.

I've had mine for nearly 2 years and it hasn't had a single problem, not even a misfire.

I do believe that this is not a FP for everyone, in fact I believe unless you are a serious FP shooter you should look at something else. The very long barrel length makes this pistol extremely accurate, however it makes it very easy to flick a shot off the card.

There are so many things I love about this pistol, some of which are:
Really easy to make adjustments, especially sighting adjustments
Very accurate and I get a lot of feedback from each shot.
Very well balanced, it just seems to want to sit still

There are a few cons to the FP60 however.
The factory grip stinks (that thing is a real hunk of crap.) It adds an extra few hundred $ to the price to get a rink.
The point made about the grip screws being flimsy is an understatement. If you have a 1 piece grip such as a rink, you will learn the true definition of patience whilst trying to screw it together.

Reinhamre's problems seem to me either an operator error or a faulty unit.

If you do a search, you'll find a few previous threads have given fairly detailed analysis on this pistol.

Good luck